<p>“I’ve been led to believe that most privates that don’t use Profile, do not meet 100%-need.” </p>
<p>That is just not true.</p>
<p>A few here in our area that I have seen 100% or more in need met…</p>
<p>Knox College
Lake Forest
Luther
Wartburg
Grinnell
Coe
St. Ambrose (rare, but it does happen)
Central
North Central
University of Dubuque
Beloit
Illinois College</p>
<p>And those are just the ones that are on the top of my mind.</p>
<p>scottaa…I think if you check, you will find that most, if not all, of the schools on the list you posted also use their OWN financial aid application form, which actually asks similar questions and seeks similar information to the Profile.</p>
<p>In other words…the don’t JUST use the FAFSA…they use the FAFSA and a school financial aid application form.</p>
<p>thumper-</p>
<p>I’ve been processing awards for those colleges for years. Yes they all have some form of institutional award (as does practically every college), but none of them assess equity in primary residence. And I have seen many 100%+ awards out of them.</p>
<p>Scott… I NEVER mentioned assessing primary equity in residences. BUT these school finaid forms DO ask for information from non-custodial parents (the ones I’ve seen). They do NOT use ONLY THE INFO on the FAFSA…they just don’t. They take a much deeper look into family finances than the FAFSA does…and these schools do not use the FAFSA EFC as their sole criteria for awarding need based aid.</p>
<p>What exactly do you do?</p>
<p>I echo the words of the person who said that most people are shocked by their EFC, I know that we were. Thinking of paying for college is daunting so don’t expect yourself to wake up tomorrow feeling better. I had to bring aspirin to work because for the whole month of February I had a headache thinking about how we were going to pay for this. Keep your chin up and I’ll hold a good thought for you.</p>
<p>thumper-</p>
<p>I have been a college financial adviser and coach since 2001, [College</a> Financial Strategies](<a href=“http://www.cfstrategies.com%5DCollege”>http://www.cfstrategies.com) & [Real</a> College Savings](<a href=“http://www.realcollegesavings.com%5DReal”>http://www.realcollegesavings.com) . I have processed thousands of financial aid applications and can tell you beyond a shadow of a doubt that outside of the schools that utilize the Profile, non-custodial statements and usage of home equity (what started my comments in post 4) to determine financial aid is rare.</p>
<p>example: Wartburg college</p>
<p>[College</a> Search - Wartburg College - Cost & Financial Aid](<a href=“College Search - BigFuture | College Board”>College Search - BigFuture | College Board)</p>
<p>Average indebtedness at graduation: $31,063 That’s alot of loans for a meets full need school. They are obviously maxing out stafford and perkins loans.</p>
<p>Hmm. Don’t think I saw any Perkins from Wartburg this year.</p>
<p>well if they didn’t use perkins loans,then I’m not sure how they come up with indebtedness that high unless they assume students are taking out private loans because, correct me if I’m wrong, $31063 is more than the amount you can take out in stafford loans as an undergrad.</p>
<p>So you’re going to complain about 31k in loans, while there are hundreds of posts on here about borrowing 50k, 100k, 150k.</p>
<p>I’m not complaining. I’m pointing out that you mentioned that as a “meets full need” school and I’m saying that they are meeting alot of that need with loans and apparently not just federal student loans are included. Based on the COA of about 35K, that 31K in loans for 4 years is nearly 25% of the cost of the total education.</p>
<p>For example. My son goes to NYU, total cost of 4 years will be in excess of 210K. He will have less than 30K in loans (perkins/stafford) due to 30K in scholarship $$ each year from NYU. So the amount of loans relative to total cost of attendance is about 15%. this assumes of course that I am paying my EFC in cash and not with loans, which is the case.</p>
<p>There is always “your mileage may vary”, but I have not seen Wartburg use loans beyond the Stafford. I would assume that the 30k would include private loans acquired by the students outside of the school.</p>
<p>If they are using personal loans beyond the Stafford, they are NOT meeting STUDENT need. Loans beyond the Stafford (and Perkins) are not awarded to students alone. They MUST have a cosigner unless they have significant collaterol in their own names. BUT if a student had that amount of assets they wouldn’t NEED a loan. </p>
<p>Sorry…loans taken out by parents or with cosigners are NOT part of a “meets full need” package in my mind.</p>
<p>Thumper-</p>
<p>“If they are using personal loans beyond the Stafford, they are NOT meeting STUDENT need”</p>
<p>That is just not accurate. </p>
<p>COA - EFC = FN</p>
<p>A student’s EFC may be $0. It could be $10,000. It could be $20,000. How a student pays for that EFC is entirely up to them. If they can pay cash and not finance any of it, then good for them. But if they find they must finance part or all of their EFC and borrow more through some form of private loans, that has nothing to do with whether or not the school met their entire need.</p>
<p>I’m sorry, but it’s definitions such as you are using for “meets full need” that help plunge students into too much debt. </p>
<p>Requiring private loans is not meeting full need.</p>
<p>Let me make my comment a different way…if a student is graduating from college with loans in EXCESS of the Stafford Loans AND the school does not disperse Perkins loans…then THAT student is being required to take private loans that would not be able to be solely in the student’s name. The student would need at the very least a cosigner, and at the very most, someone else to be willing to take a loan for them to use (e.g. Plus loans).</p>
<p>Schools that “meet full need” typically don’t do so in the above fashion.</p>
<p>Actually, students can graduate with that much in Stafford loans. Independent students can borrow $9500 as freshmen, $10,500 as sophomores, and $12,500 in junior year & beyond. A dependent student whose parents are turned down for PLUS can borrow at the independent student level. The aggregate loan limit for an undergrad for Stafford is $57,500 … and believe me, I have met plenty who are there and are still not done. In fact, I am dealing with a student right now who is a sophomore & is at her agg limit (she is not a teen - but not all that old - she seems to school-hop).</p>
<p>Kelsmom is correct about the upper limits of the Stafford loans. BUT I still maintain…students who are looking for schools that meet full need are hoping and anticipating that their debt will be excessive. They are hoping for more grants and things like WS.</p>
<p>Of course, from Scott’s list, clearly that may not be the case…ymmv regarding the loan vs. grant ratio.</p>
<p>Folks… need is a technical term not open to redefinition. You might as well call red blue.</p>
<p>Scott, I think I understand what you’re saying - if a student’s parent doesn’t come up with the EFC in cash (or take a loan in their own name, ie. Plus), then the student’s loans would go up due to their having to borrow their EFC plus borrow whatever Stafford/Perkins money. In other words, their “need” stays the same but they’re financing the EFC too. Is that right? </p>
<p>It seems that could happen at any college and might also indicate that students are having to contribute more toward meeting their EFC.</p>