If Yale is roughly the same price, it is no contest. The fact that it is actually cheaper is gravy.
I fully admit that I am prejudiced, but honestly, the constant drumbeat on CC that prestige “doesn’t matter” is pure nonsense. And in some fields it matters a lot. If she wants to live and work in the Nashville region, Vandy will have a stronger network. If she wants to live and work elsewhere, particularly abroad, Yale trounces Vandy.
This is not to say that Vandy isn’t a fine school with high standards and so on. This is not to say that people in every region of the USA faint at the mention of Yale. But let’s be realistic.
when son and I were debating UCB and other schools, I wondered aloud if the UCB would have all the freebies the private colleges would offer. For us, UCB was same price. I can’t answer this question, but son did find free food at meetings and House events.
When I talk to HS kids, I mention Rice and others with the residential system.
Pedigree matters in law, and Yale is the best pedigree. For an international career, Yale will also open doors more than the others.
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Sheesh… we know that you are really into “prestige”. But did you even read the original post?
Kid wants to be a linguist and is contemplating a chemistry major.
The parent just mentioned that a law degree may come in handy later.
IMHO, at least in East Asia, Berkeley (when it comes to chemistry - a STEM degree) is a lot more impressive than Yale.
Nevertheless, Yale is cheaper and it is a tippy-top (an understatement) school how ever you slice it (linguistic department, chem department) - I think that should be a fine choice.
By the way, I was at a party chatting with my spouse’s corporate counsel (who has a Ph.D from Stanford and a JD from Harvard) regarding the “open door” thread. She said “Columbia - who?” - sorry - we had a joke at your expense.
And by the way, she chose Harvard over Yale/Stanford (many years ago, though)
It’s hard for me to see how you pay more for one of the options that isn’t Yale unless you are (1) hoping to play SEC sports or (2) planning to do engineering at Berkeley. Even that one is a close call.
I’m usually pretty sympathetic to students who feel at home in a different environment (see the Rice vs. Stanford thread), but if you got into Yale and you want to be a linguist, you’re probably just as nerdy as they are, if you can admit it. Tell her to rush a sorority at Yale, and she’ll find the other Vandy types.
I’m a Cal grad who LOVED Berkeley and even I would urge your daughter to pick Yale. Yale will open doors your daughter doesn’t know exist… and still offer her the kind of urban/intellectually live experience akin to what she’d get at Cal.
@Kelowna where are you from? Vandy is very southern, so if you are not from there, there are definitely issues (esp for girls) that she may not realize. Other than having said that, I would go Yale - given her future interests Yale probably gives her the best opportunities for all of those areas. However, it is important to note that if she really doesn’t feel comfortable there, she shouldn’t go - she needs to be sure it’s the right place to spend the next four years, and it needs to be her decision - not folks on CC encouraging you to take the best school.
As an attorney I can say that Yale will absolutely open doors no matter where she goes to Law school. We have several Ivy undergrads at my firm and that’s what everyone talks about and it’s what got their foot in the door. They all went to ok law schools but nothing that would have gotten them the big open door that hysp did.
@Cameron121: FYI, your description of Vanderbilt as “very Southern” has become outdated. It’s now a national university with students from all over. Only about a third of the student body is from the south. My daughter, a born and raised New Yorker, feels very much at home there. Her friends are from California, Chicago, New Jersey, DC. I think she has only one close friend from a southern state, yet she and her friends would describe themselves as typical, mainstream “Vandy girls.” The place has just transformed dramatically in terms of the student body over the past decade–and particularly in the last five years. I wanted to mention that for anyone reading this thread who’s considering Vanderbilt. That said, for the OP’s daughter I’d vote for Yale in a heartbeat!
If it’s a verifiable fact, then let’s verify it. Can you provide links to one of those studies?
Do they provide numbers (such as average salary differences or number of job offers) to demonstrate just how much it counts?
Presumably you are referring to the federal government. Which part? For career civil service positions, the fact that you have a university degree matters in determining eligibility and salary. I doubt that where you got it matters much at all. There are hundreds of thousands of these positions. For Foreign Service positions, eligibility starts with an examination. Where you got your college degree does not affect your eligibility to take the exam. You don’t get extra credit added to the score for having attended a prestigious college.
Political appointments may be a different story. Congressional staff jobs may be a different story. But by the time one is eligible for most of these positions, chances are, one has racked up other credentials in addition to a college degree. So it would be hard to tease out just how much the undergraduate name matters in hiring/appointment decisions.
I’ve seen one study (much criticized on CC) that does attribute a significant, measurable earnings difference to the college degree status … when the prestige difference is *very large/i.
I would just like to note that over on the Yale forum, there is a thread in which somebody is worrying about whether Yale is nerdy enough. I’m a big Yale booster, and thus biased, but I have to say that for her interests, and at the price, Yale looks like the best choice. Can she go to Bulldog Days? They do a pretty good job of stimulating the love.
Tier 1: selection of private research universities
Tier 2: selection of private LACs
Tier 3: selection of public research universities
Tier 4: all others
Not sure how many people would agree that Harvey Mudd is Tier 4 (since it is not listed in any of the others), or that St. Louis University (Tier 1) is a higher ranking school than all of the Tier 2 and 3 schools, for example. Or that private research > private LAC > public research when comparing the “top N” schools of each type.
Thank you! It has been awesome reading all this and discussing it at the dinner table with her. She is now down to two, although I already know what her college of choice will be, but lets wait for her official decision.
As an HYP undergraduate alum who was also offered a Regents’ scholarship a Berkeley, I agree with these two, and with Happy Alum. From college onwards, the name of my alma mater alone opened up more doors than I ever imagined going in, and the value of these opportunities was worth far more than the difference in tuition. If the two are equally priced or Yale is cheaper, than the choice is easy IMO.
People on CC like to say that graduate school matters more. But s*** happens, and there’s no guarantee that one will get the excellent grades or boards needed to get into these schools. That’s especially true at a highly competitive environment like the one at Berkeley.
So why take that gamble when your D has already gotten into Yale for undergraduate. and as Happy Alum wrote, that alone can make a big difference in some fields, even in the absence of an excellent graduate school education. (The fact that a few schools may have been imperfectly classified in the Vanderbilt L&E Journal study does not invalidate the study.)