Is it just me or is my dad being unreasonable?

Parents Forum
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<p>I think I will also disagree with most who say buy the most inexpensive/cheapest laptop. That’s a good way to set yourself up for the possibility of getting a laptop that will waste the OP’s time with warranty returns, hardware problems, and finding the laptop won’t last the full 4+ years. Do you/your parents value your time, productivity, and peace of mind which would be lost if a lower end laptop craps out during your undergrad years?</p>

<p>A large part of this was…this happened to me when my older STEM oriented relatives assumed I didn’t need a high-end laptop and advised me on getting what turned out to be a low-end laptop with dubiously poor workmanship. Despite being very careful with my notebook…the LCD screen died completely right after the one year warranty ran out…which meant 6 wasted weeks while the screen was replaced and a lot more wasted money. After the second hardware failure…I decided enough was enough and paid for a corporate-line Toshiba model from my summer job. </p>

<p>That laptop and all subsequent laptops I’ve owned have never failed since. </p>

<p>Lesson I learned: Unless you don’t mind the wasted time, aggravation, and lost peace of mind…don’t go for the lowest price…or any consumer-line laptops. This lesson was reinforced when I started repairing notebooks as part of my job in several corporate IT departments/moonlighting gigs on weekends. </p>

<p>BTW: ASUS is a well-respected brand known for its reliability and speed within the gamer/IT community. That…or Lenovos or Apple are great from the reliability/build quality standpoint. Also…Apple notebooks tend to have higher battery life if that’s an important factor to consider. </p>

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<p>I think this is more dependent on individual personalities and more importantly, how they were raised. For instance, while several older cousins(Mostly male) were careless with various things growing up, they all rapidly learned that this type of careless “barbaric” behavior wouldn’t be tolerated by their parents/extended family. </p>

<p>I’ve seen plenty of females as well as males who went through multiple laptops due to careless things ranging from dropping them accidentally to spilling drinks on laptop/dropping heavy textbooks on laptops which destroyed the LCD screens. Still remember one female undergrad who dropped a heavy STEM book on the top of her Toshiba which resulted in a cracked screen and forced her to spend the rest of her undergrad using it with a portable 14" CRT monitor. </p>

<p>If someone was careless enough to break glassware as a guest at someone else’s house, my older relatives would think the guest in question was not raised properly to be careful and conscientious about the property of others. If we did this as guests in their homes/their neighbors…we wouldn’t only never hear the end of it*…we’d be forced to pay the entire bill for the damages out of summer/part-time job earnings if we were older than 7. </p>

<p>With some of the cousins…if the carelessness got bad enough…they’d be persona non grata at some of the relatives’/neighbors’ homes for several years. </p>

<p>In short, being careless about the property of others/oneself is more due to one’s personality and how one was raised…and can be changed if the individual wants to and consequences are severe enough for a serious attitude adjustment (i.e. Having to use heavy monitor for rest of undergrad, paying a few hundred dollars from part-time/summer jobs as elementary-high school kids as compensation for damage.) </p>

<p>Personally, I tend to be very careful with my own stuff and moreso with property belonging to others. Regarding laptops…other than the first one which failed twice mainly due to poor quality/workmanship…every other laptop I’ve owned has lasted well beyond 8+ years. In fact, the second laptop I had to buy because the first one proved too unreliable is a corporate-line Toshiba I picked up for $1500 from my summer job in '97 and is still running strong to this day after 15+ years…in the service of a financially constrained friend of a friend who’s using it for resumes/job searches. </p>

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<li>Some of the cousins’ parents are still reminding them of this to this day…despite the fact the incidents in question happened 30-40 years ago.<br></li>
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<p>Interesting. I used to only recommend their corporate Latitude or Precision models because their Inspiron line tended to have many issues with poor QC/build quality. Unfortunately, it seems that QC/build quality has caught up to the Latitude/Precision line as my friend’s company found out. It’s one reason why they’ve had to replace 3 Precisions for him within the last 2 weeks because one component or another was DOA and I received two problematic Latitudes from them gratis. </p>

<p>My only reasons for using Dell notebooks nowadays is because all of them came free and I can serve as my own IT tech support. Would not recommend them for anyone else unless it comes with a full all-aspect minimum 3 year warranty.</p>

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<p>We have never had a QC problem and have had many, many Dell laptops. H finds them easy to work on if he needs to replace memory or something.</p>

<p>I don’t think we were saying buy the cheapest thing you can get. I just don’t think the OP needs a high end gaming computer.</p>

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<p>I have always had dells, and have been very happy. I would say that Macs in general get less viruses, and if kids are not careful with installing firewalls, etc, that may be a point in their favor.</p>

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<p>The model the OP was mentioning isn’t a “high-end gaming computer”. </p>

<p>A $1500 ASUS model would be considered a mid-ranged gaming computer at the extreme best. However, that brand also has a reputation for high reliability among those in the hardcore IT tech community. </p>

<p>Heck, the two problematic latitudes that I got free from my friend’s company retailed for $1800 each minimum when they were released…and no one in their right mind would consider them to be high-end gaming rigs. </p>

<p>If a high-end gaming laptop was what the OP wanted…he/she’d probably go with a $2500-4000+ Alienware or something like it. Then again…most hardcore gamers I know prefer to game off self-built desktop machines built to high-end specs.</p>

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<p>What luxuries were the siblings given?
OP is a novice in CS. Others have pointed out that he’s already changed his major ideas several times- and hasn’t even started on campus yet.</p>

<p>Howard bookstore is pushing Macs, with the Pro starting around $1100. I didn’t look deep enough to find a second choice but suspect this is a marketing relationship, on Apple’s part. No one has said what the CS dept advises. And, I did not get the impression folks here were pushing the cheapest low end product. Just that OP do what amounts to differentiating between sleek & sexy versus the power, product and “hand feel” he actually needs, as a college freshman taking low level CS classes, probably some math and maybe humanities gen eds that require research and writing.</p>

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<p>IMO Cobrat inadvertently hit on it:

From the ASUS site:

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<p>$600-700 would get you a mid-high end consumer-line notebook or the lowest-end corporate-line notebook without any frills…neither of which I’d recommend to anyone who wants a solid reliable notebook to last 4+ years of undergrad or beyond. Especially if they are majoring in CS. </p>

<p>Especially considering the general build/hardware quality of most PCs/notebooks has gone down over the last decade as the relentless emphasis on price above all else has driven almost every manufacturer to cut corners to preserve slivers of profit margins…especially on the consumer-line/budget-line models. Worse…this race to the bottom has even crept up to the corporate lines of some companies…<em>cough</em> Dell <em>cough</em> or worse…Compaq/HP. </p>

<p>It also brought in brands like eMachines* and their really low-end budget ilk. </p>

<p>That’s not to say that high prices == quality, either. I’ve also recommended that clients/friends avoid SONY notebooks/desktops because their build quality is questionable AND they’re overpriced. </p>

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<li>Things are really bad when a brand becomes notorious for using desktop power supplies which actually smoke/explode.</li>
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<p>I think that people who like me use Dells from work may forget that we have IT desks that can and frequently do fix/upate them, so we may not really know what their life is in the hands of someone without that resource.</p>

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<p>Just out of sheer curiosity, under what operating system do computer science/engineering majors usually write code? Unix/Linux? Do they usually load Linux onto their laptops? Dual boot? Is there an advantage to the Apple OS?</p>

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<p>Plenty of “business” laptops (with greater emphasis on reliability) cost considerably less than $1,500. There are even some ruggedized laptops under that price. There are also lots of Asus Zenbook laptops under that price.</p>

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<p>It is pretty common for shared instructional computers to run Unix/Linux, since these OSes handle shared use much more manageably than Microsoft OSes.</p>

<p>It is not obvious from Howard’s web sites what CS courses use (the information may be in the course syllabi which are behind a student login). There is a general description here, but not enough specifics (and the photos look old, due to the CRT-type monitors): <a href=“http://www.scs.howard.edu/resources[/url]”>http://www.scs.howard.edu/resources&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Having a laptop that can run the same or similar OS as the instructional computers can allow the student to do programming assignments without being connected to the instructional computers until almost done (the student can upload them to the instructional computers when finished, do some final testing, and turn them in).</p>

<p>It would be a good idea to contact the CS department to find out what they advise and what the instructional computers run.</p>

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<p>As an added bonus, Howard may have a deal with one or more companies OR have deals at its bookstore where the student can get the recommended laptop at a great student price. It’s definitely worth asking the U about. Moaning & groaning about what you WANT vs. what is NEEDED for you to work on for your U are entirely different things. Our kids like computers that are good for their video games but that’s not one of our priorities when we make purchases. When they can use their own funds to purchase their computers, they can purchase what they can afford.</p>

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<p>There are so many incredible deals that can be found, its not uncommon to get a computer that lists for $1000 for 30% off. At least. So spending $700 can still mean one can get quite a nice system.</p>

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<p>It’s really dumb to get a $1500 laptop, ESPECIALLY as a first laptop. My boyfriend just got a Lenovo for $700. He is a hardcore gamer and it’s working out wonderfully. </p>

<p>Ask your parents what they’ll pay and get a job to make up the rest. You do not “deserve” a $1500. End of story.</p>

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<p>Three years ago, my D started at her residential high school, which requires students to have a laptop, and they strongly advised buying an “industrial grade” machine through their purchasing program.</p>

<p>Her “industrial grade” Toshiba was in the shop six times over the three years - admittedly, two of those times were because of dumb things she did to it. On the other hand, I just retired a lowest-end Dell laptop I bought in 2006 and used extensively, that never burped once. The power brick finally failed, and since the computer (with its 40 GB drive) was out of gas anyway, I decided not to buy a new brick. I bought a $400 Acer to replace it.</p>

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<p>“Is it just me or is my dad being unreasonable?”</p>

<p>Dad of course. Once a kid said that her classmate’s parents sold their house to pay for his tuition and asked why her parents couldn’t. Seriously, won’t you do most your programing in computer labs?</p>

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<p>FWIW, my DD got a Lenovo T420 despite putting up a similar argument towards a MacBook Pro. It worked perfectly for her freshman year and is powerful enough for architecture work. Likewise, her mom, a high flying computer consultant also has the exact same laptop (from work). </p>

<p>One needs to separate wants from needs. An ultrabook may look great for some humanities major (ok, just kidding) but a real comp sci guy or gal would not be caught dead writing code on an ultrabook.</p>

<p>My suggestion is a good, cheap, and upgradeable DIY desktop for serious coding and a cheap, small laptop or tablet for class work if so required (doubt it). For a cool single purchase solution a Lenovo X220 type convertible would work the best. Good laptops that would last four years would also work (T420 for example). To me, as a parent, the ultrabook is all flash and glitter.</p>

<p>(and yes, I’m a 27 year software developer who also would not be caught dead writing code in an ultrabook - maybe I could impress a marketing chick or two with it but how would it run Ubuntu under VMware compared to my dual quad Xeon server class desktop I have at work?)</p>

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<p>I think they should buy it for you. I offered to buy my children a car if they graduate after having paid for school themselves (scholarships). You are not being unreasonable at all. There is an EFC and chances are, he is not spending any of it.</p>

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<p>^ that’s it- they buy him the laptop afer he graduates debt free. :slight_smile:
But, he’s not paying attention to any of us.</p>

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<p>Out of curiosity, was it a Satellite or a Tecra?</p>

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<p>Can’t fault a laptop manufacturer for that. Especially if it is of the “spilling liquids on laptop” or “drop 2 pound STEM textbook on laptop screen” variety. </p>

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<p>What model was that dell laptop?</p>