Is Preschool really such a great thing?

Parent Cafe
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<p>The line about “the gains don’t seem to be carrying forward for Head Start kids” is a total right-wing canard, and has been debunked time and time again. In fact, that’s what Nobel Laureate Jim Heckman – quoted misleadingly in the article – spends his time doing: preaching the benefits of Head Start-like programs as public investments.</p>

<p>There was one longitudinal study about 20 years ago that showed the educational advantages of Head Start vanishing around 6th or 7th grade. However, researchers have since been able to track the first cohorts of Head Start kids well into their 40s. Guess what? At practically every stage of life, they are significantly better educated, less criminal, wealthier, healthier, more employed, and happier than similarly situated kids who did not participate in the program. The data on the long-term positive impact of Head Start is impressive and inspiring. That’s why Heckman, an evaluation theorist, is interested in it: it’s a remarkable example of successful social investment.</p>

<p>The shopworn slant of the op ed piece makes me question everything in it. I don’t know anything about the data on Oklahoma and Georgia, but the early Head Start studies do suggest that middle school is not necessarily the best point at which to evaluate the effectiveness of preschool programs. I am certain that Heckman is right that we don’t have data on whether well-to-do kids experience similar – or any – benefits from quality preschool. It stands to reason that they wouldn’t, mainly because they already get lots of what Head Start provides – stimulation, attention, structure, socialization, good habits – in their homes, unlike many (NOT all) children from more challenged families. On the other hand, lots of us – people like marite, mathmom, and I – didn’t really have a choice about preschool or not. Our kids were going to go to a preschool, and I suspect all of us wanted it to be a good, quality environment. (Better, at least, than the alchoholic babysitter who parked our kids in front of the TV and told them they would burn in hell forever unless they accepted Christ as their savior.)</p>

<p>Another important aspect of quality preschool is that kids are much safer there than they are with relative care. The occasional problems with preschools make headlines, but there is a daily stream of kids who come to some kind of harm, through negligence or abuse, from their adult caretakers, even those who love them very much.</p>

<p>Attacks on preschool initiatives come from an odd assortment of opponents. For many – I suspect these authors – the problem with preschool is that it enables women to work rather than to stay home in a “traditional” arrangement. Closely allied with them are church groups, mainly Catholic and Evangelical, that run their own preschools. They don’t want to meet higher safety and training standards, they (legitimately) want to control their own curriculum, and they don’t want competition from high-quality, government subsidized programs. Finally, there are left-wing poverty advocates, who see family and neighbor child care as a way to get government cash to poor people, and who thus resist attempts to upgrade the education and status of preschool “teachers”.</p>

<p>Pennsylvania has just gone to universal Kindergarten, and it has expanded state funding for preschool programs in public school systems significantly. It also has a number of programs to provide organizational support and training – and consumer education about quality – for private- and nonprofit-sector preschools, including those with religious affiliation (although you get into issues there fast). The programs are quite popular across all sorts of lines: rich/poor, Democrat/Republican, urban/rural.</p>

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<p>Until recently, I was very much opposed to mandatory preschool. After spending several years as a substitute teacher in some very low income schools, however, I now adamantly support mandatory preschool. I was operating in MY world before … you know, the world of the parent who plays an active role in her child’s life. CC parents, working or stay at home, are the parents providing a good start for our kids. However, there are SO MANY kids who come to kindergarten so behind … and I do mean BEHIND!!! How on earth can a 5 year old already be so completely & utterly scr*wed??? I don’t know what the heck happens (doesn’t happen?) in some homes, but these kids are NEVER going to make up the ground they need to make up. I am talking kindergartners who are so far behind in basic skills that they never catch up. These are the kids who go on to fail out of school. I know … I also sub a lot in high school. </p>

<p>Here is the problem: Unless these kids MUST go to preschool, they won’t … no money for tuition, no room in Head Start, no day care after a 2 or 3 hour preschool program, no parental interest in getting kids to something they don’t HAVE to get them to, etc., etc., etc. It must be mandatory in order to get these kids what they need.</p>

<p>I have become convinced that early childhood education is the only way to stop the problems we have later in school. There is no more important place to begin improving our nation’s schools.</p>

<p>Is preschool really such a great thing? Maybe not for you & me … we can probably give our kids the early childhood experiences they need without a formal preschool … but for the most vulnerable among us, it is a MUST.</p>

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<p>Well, I did have a choice, I suppose I could have become a stay at home mom. But I don’t have the patience to be around very young children 24/7. And it was clear that by age 2.5, S1 very much wanted to be in the company of children his own age anyway, even though he was in a wonderful family daycare.</p>

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<p>Kelsmom, It would be interesting to hear your view as a teacher, in what respect the 4 years olds from poor families are behind? My D. went to preschool out of necessity of both of us working. Her B-day is in October, and I wanted to place her earlier, not later. However, I was told by her preschool director that she is not going to be ready for kindergarden because she does not possesed fine motor skills like turning door nob to open the door. I did not take this as a serious argument and sent D. earlier. D. never had a “B” in her life, graduated at the top of her class and continues having straight A’s in college. She could not read AFTER kindergarden, entering 1st grade. My S. who started his school in a different country, could not read until he was 7, when he went to 1st grade, no kindergarden.
So, it is interesting to hear teacher’s view on how 4 years olds readiness for kindergarden is being evaluated, besides what I heard about my D’s inability to turn a door nob.</p>

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<p>This is from an article in Slate describing Heckman’s 2007 paper:</p>

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<p>“So, it is interesting to hear teacher’s view on how 4 years olds readiness for kindergarden is being evaluated”</p>

<p>I’m not a teacher, but kelsmom’s post resonated with me based on my volunteer work. When it comes to being far behind, I’m talking about big-city 5-year-olds who aren’t familiar with any age-appropriate books, who lack all kinds of basic vocabulary, and (in a city with 30 miles of free beaches and a free zoo) have never seen a beach or been to the zoo. These are kids of normal intelligence, but shockingly restricted experience. Not to mention that they would fall asleep in camp, but also tell me about the late-night videos and the raunchy things they saw on the Arsenio Hall show the night before (I’m dating myself, I know). When a four-year-old is going to bed at 11:30, there’s no possible way she can function in school.</p>

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<p>My kids went to something called a “nursery school” which was a place where kids under 5 fingerpaint and play with blocks. When we moved to another part of the country, I kept referring to places where kids under 5 fingerpaint and play with blocks as “nursery schools” and the other parents would snap, “It’s a CHILD DEVELOPMENT CENTER!!!”</p>

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<p>MiamiDAP, I speak as a substitute teacher without a teaching certificate. That is, I have no formal training in educational pedagogy. In addition, I should mention that I am not a big advocate of pushing young kids to learn things too quickly (no formal reading/writing in my kids’ preschools, by my choice). My beliefs are based on observation, so I can’t answer the question of how exactly things are formally assessed. What I can address, though, is the fact that I was honestly stunned to find out how <em>behind</em> these kids are. For example, I spent almost a month in a kindergarten room this past April/May. I had 45 kids … 22 in the morning & 23 in the afternoon (district goes all day this fall). The regular teacher is very experienced. I spent time every day for a week going over simple addition & subtraction. We did whole class things, such as bringing classmates up front - counting them - adding more - or subtracting some. We counted plastic animals, stuffed animals, books, etc. We did written problems together, going through addition & subtraction problems step by step. Then I gave them sheets with 4 simple addition problems to do by themselves at the start of class. An alarming number needed help. Same with easy subtraction problems. So I gave each kid a little cup of M&Ms and a worksheet of simple addition problems. I explained that they were to use the candy to figure out the problem, if they wanted to do so. In each class, I had 8 or 9 kids who could not do it by themselves. I had to sit them all around a big table & go through it step by step. In the end, I still had several kids in each class who absolutely could not do a problem alone even after we had walked through some problems together. They simply could not understand the concept. </p>

<p>This is just one example. I had kids who knew what letter a certain sound was, but didn’t know what that letter looked like … kids who knew the letter but were clueless as to what sound it might make … kids who did not recognize letters … kids who did not recognize written numbers (1-9) … kids who couldn’t form letters on a page at all … kids who lack the ability to hold a pencil, much less cut with scissor … kids who couldn’t move around for a whole 3 minute song. Then there were the kids who had such behavioral problems … defying teachers, hurting classmates, throwing things, complete inability to pay attention (beyond being young or even run of the mill ADHD). My kids were in the same district, but in a school with few low income students. The things their kindergarten teacher could do with them were amazing comparitively - the kids I had last spring could barely draw a recognizable picture on a page & write their name on it, while my kids & their classmates were at least putting letters on a page to tell a story (not all were correct, but they had the CONCEPT down). Many of the kids I had this spring couldn’t make a pattern, couldn’t flip 2 dice/add spots/write the number. My SIL is a kindergarten teacher, and she gave me some simple glyphs to do with my class - they couldn’t follow the directions to do them. In fact, quite a few were unable to follow along & fill in the numbers on a copy of a calendar for the new month while I wrote them on the overhead calendar (and I went SLOWLY!!!). Somehow, when their brains should have been filling up with cool stuff … they weren’t. I don’t know why not. What I do know is that while kids like mine were learning to get along in the world, to share, to play nice, to hear a story, to make a picture, to express themselves, to engage in learning … other kids are living in a world that offers their brains totally inadequate stimulation. By the time they arrive in kindergarten, they are somehow already behind in their ability to LEARN.</p>

<p>I have seen their future … the 1st graders who do absolutely nothing academically in class. The 3rd graders who spend all their time messing around instead of working - because they truly don’t know how to do the simple assignments they are given. The 5th graders who can’t copy down a few notes from the overhead. The 9th graders who count on their fingers or need a calculator to multiply 3X3. The 11th graders who write as if they were talking (and they don’t speak properly). The kids who leave school at 17.</p>

<p>As for your kid who couldn’t turn a doorknob, my feeling is, “Big deal.” I think that’s ridiculous! My D had a boy in her kindergarten who didn’t know all of his letter/sound combos, and he had trouble speaking (he spoke fine … we just had no idea what he was saying!). However, he had a mom who worked with him. She knew he was fine - he just needed a little more time. She was right. He ended up at the top of his class. The difference between him & the kids I wrote about is that he had always been exposed to things - he was inquisitive & learned what he was ready to learn - he just was a late bloomer. The kids I wrote about don’t have a supportive home environment that will lead to success in a few years. They are behind in a very different way. I don’t know how to articulate it … but I absolutely recognize it.</p>

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<p>Uhh - JHS, did you actually finish the WSJ piece? The author accurately characterizes the findings for the Perry project. His point is that this sort of thing can work for extremely disadvantaged kids at a very high investment from tax payers. The problem is the notion of UNIVERSAL preschool mandated by the government and presumably structured by the government. That would be extremely expensive. Many families quite reasonably might prefer not to fund such a grandiose program so that there might be funds available for them to educate their children according to their own notions. I totally get how a Perry type program for carefully targeted kids could be a good thing. I don’t think the author is arguing against that.</p>

<p>And BTW, unless I’m missing something the Perry program is not Head Start.</p>

<p>Just to let you know, I have liberal creds - have taken the NY Times seven days a week for the last 13 years! We just recently added the WSJ because we couldn’t resist the deal (6 days a week for a year for $99). And I have to say, it’s made a very nice addition to our breakfast table reading.</p>

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<p>Even with “universal preschool,” parents would still be able to choose for their own children. We pay now … we’d still pay & would be able to put our kids in the programs we prefer. I would still choose a play-based program. Of course, I also think the government model should be play-based. Kids need to be exposed to things. They need to learn how to get along with others. They need to hear fun books. They need to paint … play in sand … play in water … act … dress up …etc.</p>

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<p>I have taught in an inner-city school district at some very high poverty schools and can confirm kelsmom’s observations. Some of the children entering kindergarten had to be taught how books worked – how to handle them, about the cover showing the title, how to turn the pages by the top right corner of the right-hand page. (What so many of us do without thinking about it and model for our children as we read aloud to them.) Many families did not have any books in their homes – when my local suburban library cleaned out their children’s room of old books, I was able to bring these “discards” to my students and they were thrilled to have books they could keep at home.</p>

<p>For some of these children, a quality preschool experience would be wonderful.</p>

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<p>my mother taught first grade in an inner city schools. She got kids who had never held a pencil (or crayon). Didn’t know colors or letters. She could tell the first week of school who was going to ‘make it’ and who wasn’t. And the vast majority of the parents couldn’t care less. It’s a horrible cycle.</p>

<p>OTOH, my son was in full time day care from 14 months on (I was unemployed after he was born so he was home that first 1+ year). I had to drag him out of daycare. He loved it. And this was a daycare run by the school district, nothing high-end, but the teachers were great. </p>

<p>Preschool isn’t necessary for the lucky kids who can have an involved, interactive, attentive parent at home. There aren’t that many out there that are willing or able to do that.</p>

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<p>She’s in day care, not sophisticated but very loving/attentive.</p>

<p>She already loves to dance at 16 months, so I am celebrating all things musical.</p>

<p>She’ll be bilingual because she hears English and Portuguese all the time.</p>

<p>She watches a bit too much TV/video for my taste, but still not a whole lot.</p>

<p>I read to her everyday.</p>

<p>Any milestones, issues I should pay attention to doing as she passes 2, 3, 4 years?</p>

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<p>Just keep loving and enjoying her. THey grow up so fast.
Since she loves to dance, dance with her. My experience with my kids is that the things that they loved as toddlers were things they continued to love into adulthood. Older S loved sports even as a 10-month-old insisted on sleeping hugging a soccer ball. At age 24, he continues to be a sports fanatic.</p>

<p>Younger S loved dancing and movement types of things from the time he had occupational therapy as a baby. We put him into a toddler dance class, which he loved (Interestingly, most of the girls in the class seemed to be miserable probably because they were in dance because their mothers wanted them to dance; the girls weren’t that interested). He also loved dance class while in elementary school. He stopped dancing because of teasing from his older brother, but took it up again in college, including a dance-related type of martial arts.</p>

<p>If your D loves dancing, by the time she’s 3 or 4, she may enjoy going to real dance concerts that are designed for adult audiences. We started taking younger S to those when he was 4. He loved them, and was perfectly behaved. Get tickets early so you can get close enough so she can easily see.</p>

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<p>Loves to dance at 16 months? My kids did not walk until 18 months. Slow, I know.
What she is able to do now sounds terrific.
Try to answer her questions. We used to dub our kids “Mr. How Come.” If you don’t know the answer, say “let’s look it up together.” It will give her the sense that books are not just about telling stories but also a source of information. Take her to museums, but also on walks in the country. And keep on nurturing her love of dance and music.</p>

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<p>There is a difference between preschool and day care. Day care will take care your kids while you are at work, and it could be from 7am to as late as 6 or 7 pm. Their main concern is to make sure your kid is cared for. A preschool is more focused on providing an educational environment. Often they are limited to only a few hours a day.</p>

<p>Preschool was necessary for my kids because we had full time childcare at home while we worked. We thought it was very important for our kids to have interaction with other kids. They did a lot of arts and crafts, but more importantly they learned how to interact with other children. I was always amazed how those preschool teachers could get ten 2 year olds to sit still for half an hour, but they do learn to do that.</p>

<p>For people that live in NYC area, you know by going to the right preschool also gets your kid into the right private school, then that’s your ticket to top tier college.:)</p>

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<p>Oldfort: It may depend on both the daycare center and the age of the children involved. Our daycare center took in children from 2.5 months old to pre-kindergarten. For the children who could walk, there were plenty of activities that you might describe as “pre-school” such as arts and crafts, building Lego structures, story time, playing in the sandbox, and so on. In fact, kindergarten seemed just an extension of what my kids got in their daycare center. I have a great picture of my S from a field trip to an apple orchard.</p>

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<p>I am not implying daycare do not do anything educational. Many daycare do incorporate that into their schedule. But their main concern or responsibility is to make sure kids are fed and cared for. Preschool very often will not take children that are not potty trained, and kids are usually there for only a few hours. As working parents you couldn’t rely on preschool to be your primary childcare.</p>

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<p>Bedhead, keep her dancing, read to her everyday (that is the BEST advice), Daycare/prescool is wonderful cause it helps her develop social skills, lets her build self confidence because it shows her there is a world out there beyond mom and dad and she can survive it even when you aren’t around. Sounds like you have it under control.</p>

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<p>Oldfort: I don’t know if the daycare/preschool dichotomy holds so well. There are indeed many daycare centers (and that’s what they call themselves) which do not admit children who are not toilet trained, but the daycare centers we know of go all the way to pre-kindergarten. Some parents brought their children into the daycare center when their child was older, eg. three. And since they are all day centers, they have to organize activities for the children. It is not possible to just “feed the kids and make sure they’re safe” for eight hours without organizing activities and providing toys. One of the great things about the daycare center was that our kids could be extremely messy, the place was child proof–which our house was not–, there were other children, and there were adults watching the kids every minute of the day. There were more toys and children’s books than in our home. And we did not have to hunt high and low for other children for our kids to play with.</p>

<p>Family daycare was a different story. There was a huge difference among the sites we investigated in terms of space, philosophy, availability of toys, etc…</p>