IU Kelley [$31.9k] vs. Full Tuition In-State [University of Iowa, $1.3k] [vs. University of Minnesota, $13.4k]

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Congratulations. IU Kelley will leave open career doors that the other choices would make highly unlikely.

If interested in I banking or other prestige business careers the incremental cost is relatively modest.

Meaning you make a lot more money quickly in these businesses. It is however a risk so unfortunately you have to both mentally commit to one of these careers and get the grades and networking to make it happen.

A long time back I was confronted with a similar decision tree. My parents had done their absolute best to ensure money wouldn’t dictate my college choices but ultimately I did go into debt to attend a school that I felt would give me the most flexibility career wise.

Thankfully I was able to leverage that education into a job on Wall Street that allowed me to pay off the student debt in three years and have a relatively productive career. Had a chosen the lesser reputed schools I doubt this would have been possible.

Sometimes you have to bet on yourself but I would only recommend it if you go into it with open eyes. FYI we pay our undergraduate analyst $110k base (goes up automatically annually) plus a relocation bonus with significant performance bonuses that kick in quickly. The size of the debt you are talking about becomes almost irrelevant in relative terms when you consider the earning differential over a lifetime if you can make it work.

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I appreciate this input. With that being said, is Kelley only worth it if I go into I banking?

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  1. No scenario. In fact, I’d argue you built your list incorrectly. It should only include schools yiu 100% can afford or possibly afford. If you’d have applied to SMU as they have a full ride or W&L which awards 10% of its attendees a full ride, I get it.

You had zero chance of affording IU so I would not have applied.

You’re trying to sell yourself on something that shouldn’t be an option at all.

Now if you said I wanted to be an I Banker, that’s a reason but still not valid because it’s not affordable. And Tippie is producing I Bankers, according to LinkedIn - KeyBanc, Houlihan Lokey, Barclays and more.

Tippie also has the Hawkinson Institute - see attached. It’s not for you but kids going to IU in the slim hopes of a certain career can do the same at Tippie. Heck my Alabama engineer had an opportunity to test for an interview at Jane Street.

But the advantage of an IU is really for something you have no interest in.

  1. I don’t know - I’m not you. You might want to check real estate offerimgs in each program.

  2. I’d be at Iowa. I think you’re missing the point that while you have great stats, so will another 500 or 1k on campus. Alabama, for example, has the most national merit scholars -or right there.

Most people choose a college either for budget or location. Or like my son - his own dorm room. - ok, most don’t do that.

You have this belief that Tippie is inferior. It’s not.

Have you looked into Honors at either ?

Btw did you know business at UMN has a $2600 annual surcharge ? Have you factored that in ?

https://honors.uiowa.edu/join-program/how-apply-incoming-first-year-student

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Depends on career choice and you.

It will undoubtedly give you more options. Kelley is very well regarded nationally so you will also gain geographic flexibility.

This is not a clear case of cheaper is better or the assumption of debt will pay off.

It stinks but even at this early stage you need to think through what your long term goals are at the risk of shutting a door you may look back upon and regret.

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I was unaware of the $2600 surcharge at UMN and that is great to know. And looking at it from an outside perspective it doesn’t make any sense for me to go to IU. I have just always wanted to leave the state and go somewhere new. However, I also knew that Tippie was a very solid school when applying so that led me to only apply to other schools that I thought were better that way there would be a reason for me to go there instead.

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I’ve thought about that. Like if I just go to Iowa what would have happened if I chose a place like IU. But at the same time is 40-80k in debt really worth it in four years?

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Very few get an I Banking job overall but yes they do from Tippie.

But you are not interested

If you want to leave Iowa, schools like Bama, Ms State and more could work. fSU too but if might be too late to apply. They have OOS waivers but if you are late then you can’t get. Their tuition is reasonable. All who go abroad first year also get in state.

The reality is budget forces decisions. Your parents said no loans in your first message. That says enough right there.

Have you looked at KU. Its Honors program is strong. Great merit.

Do me a favor. Look at this. Forget the school name. Look at the curriculum. Does it interest you ? That can help answer your 2nd question.

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If this is the ultimate goal probably not worth it. However how are you going to raise the capital to become a property owner?

You mention a desire to experience things beyond a small town in Iowa. My fear for you is that your perspective and ambitions may change and grow if given the window afforded by a school like Kelley.

Personalizing this again, I had no idea what my eventual profession would be as a freshman but thankfully when I realized it as a junior (the academic environment served to inform that decision) the option was open to me.

I don’t see this as a clear cut call without risk but one that you should weigh both introspectively and with your parents and those that know you best.

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Agree that with your career goals it is not worth taking out loans (and you likely would not
qualify for loans of the magnitude needed to attend Kelley).

In fact, I would argue that if you want to get into real estate that University of Iowa might be the best option as you can gain a network of contacts and fellow alums in the state you plan to live and work in after college.

Do keep in mind that University of Iowa has a Study Abroad office and you can take advantage of opportunities there to expand your horizons.

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So I am slightly confused here. How much money do you have put away for college? You said you can pay for two year’s of it but not sure if that is just Iowa or Indiana?

I am also a “bet on yourself” person and taught that to my kids. It served them well in college and after. But
 You don’t want to dig a hole you can’t get out from.

Also. Your an amazing person and you have the drive so I think you can pretty much do what you want and you will succeed. But. No way your going to be able to work and make $350/week in College. 4 year College is not community college. It’s going to be harder. I have done both. Both are challenging, no question about it. Figure you will work 10/hours /week. Pick something you can also do homework at. My daughter did. Maybe you will make $110

Do you know how many of your current credits if any might transfer?

There is a reason I am asking this and maybe approach it like a business problem. You already know you can “Only take out $27,500 /4 year’s. Your parents take out the rest under only their name. It’s” their “responsibility. They might have a separate contract with you. I would want to know the length and terms of that. Your parents also are paying for” all" your room /board. That your free and clear on, correct?

Make a spread sheet and do at direct comparison

Also as stated your interests might change. But they can change at any school of your choosing.

So the real question is
 Is IU worth the extra costs? That truly depends.

Any higher ranked school in business will have different opportunities especially with some companies. But is that better?

To really answer your questions You need to take the money you have, plus the loans you can take out, plus the room /board money your parents will pay for and actually see what is the number left. Then you can make a decision.

The other way to look at this is if you have any decent amount saved up. That could also be your starting capital for what you want to do.

Also factor into getting paid while doing internships. I am not sure how much the business students make. But that “might” provide you with some extra monetary resources BUT
 My son during covid had a great one lined up and it got canceled so
 Don’t rely on the unknown.

Also with any of this, it’s always about you. If your active on campus and have the drive to succeed, you will. You have done it so far.

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Ps in your initial message you said you wished you applied to privates.

There’s still time.

But ensure they at least have a possible chance of achieving budget. Some have earlier scholarship deadlines.

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Apologies if I’ve missed this, but have you run the NPC at any private meets-need schools? There’s still time to apply if one is affordable. Let us know if you need suggestions.

If, however, you decide Iowa makes the most sense for your situation, you can take advantage of study abroad or other student exchange opportunities for an experience outside of Iowa.

Best of luck!

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Your only affordable option is to attend the University of Iowa.

Focus on finance and accounting courses. Try to get an internship during college that relates to your desired career. Your GPA will matter when seeking an internship as well as when seeking full-time employment.

If not satisfied with your career options, then consider earning a 9 month, 10 month, or 12 month masters degree in an area of interest such as real estate development. Two examples of such programs are:

Unfortunately, you will miss out on the top undergraduate real estate programs at these schools: U Georgia, Georgia State, U Wisconsin, NYU, U Penn-Wharton,FSU, U Florida, U Texas, USC, UC-Berkeley, Cornell, U Miami, & UNC.

Consider the Big 4 accounting firms (PwC, KPMG, EY, & Deloitte)for internships. All should have groups which specialize in real estate.

P.S. NYU also offers two options for real estate related masters degrees:

https://sps.nyu.edu/homepage/academics/masters-degrees/ms-in-real-estate.html

https://sps.nyu.edu/homepage/academics/masters-degrees/ms-in-real-estate-development.html

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You can check both Hendrix and Ogelthorpe - two privates - that given your stats would match Iowa tuition. So a bit under $12k I believe.

Do you want a small LAC ?

Ogelthorpe is in Atlanta proper. Hendrix, a small city 30 mins or so from Little Rock.

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I may be a bit late to this discussion, but I agree with the consensus that you should avoid debt, save $$$, and stay in-state. You are comparing three very good options with a significant difference in cost.

One thing to keep in mind is that classes will get more difficult as you get into upper year university classes. You want to put a lot of effort into your class work, and make a strong effort to always stay ahead. This means that the extra effort to also work to earn money can be an unfortunate distraction.

As one example, I was a math major. My understanding is that sometimes math majors end up working in finance, and sometimes finance majors can end up taking some math courses. Some of the upper year math courses might be a bit tougher compared to what you are used to.

Both of my daughters were able to avoid debt for their bachelor’s degree (in one case at my insistence). After graduation, both were able to take advantage of opportunities that were only options because they had no debt. One took a job that was very much a dream job and that helped to prepare her for the graduate program where she is studying right now, but that paid very badly. She could only afford to take the job because she had no debt (after she took this job she thanked me for not letting her take on debt for her bachelor’s degree). My other daughter after graduating university was able to volunteer in Europe for three months (actually about 80 days on a 90 day visa), using money she had saved from an internship to pay for the flight and a week of travel. Again she could only afford to do this because she had no debt.

You are in a different field compared to my daughters, but again there may be an interesting “first opportunity” after university that pays badly but is otherwise very much worth doing – this is relatively common.

I would be wary of “average salary of graduates” data. This can be skewed by location. Jobs in Chicago or Minneapolis are likely to pay more for the simple reason that it is expensive to live in those locations. This doesn’t mean that graduates are actually better off. They are just more likely to be living in an expensive city. Similarly if a university has a tiny percentage of graduates working in investment banking in New York City that may skew the average, but not be relevant to most graduates (and I personally would not want to work in investment banking in NYC, even though my math degree at least as of today if I were younger would be interesting to investment banking companies).

I agree with both. There are some situations where this is worthwhile. I do not think that this is one of those situations.

By the way, I just looked up the RD admissions deadlines for a few private universities that meet full need for all incoming domestic students. There is still time to get applications in, but in some cases there is only about a week or maybe in some cases a bit less left before the deadlines. You could have your parents run the NPC today on a few schools that meet full need, see if the schools would be affordable, and if so get in a couple of applications to private schools. You would however need to do this very soon if you are going to do it at all.

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A few thoughts:

Already mentioned here about study abroad and I didn’t see a reply. Have you researched options at U of Iowa? Study abroad for a semester or full year would be a great way to study and live away. Or a summer program like DIS or others.

Summer earnings: Having a summer job is great - But if you put yourself into a position of needing to make a specific sum of money to pay your tuition it could close you out of lower or non paying internships that could open doors for you post graduation. It would also limit your ability to accept an internship out of state, as you would need you to use those internship earnings to pay your housing/food costs.

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I’m actually into U Georgia as well with the cost being around $20k a year for tuition after scholarship. Again, parents are paying for full room and board. Should this be an option? I originally liked Carlson and UMN more so with that being cheaper I crossed UGA off.

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No. You can’t afford. Your folks won’t give you loans.

It is a top real estate school. If you look at what I sent you regarding the curriculum when you asked if the major was right. If so, we can find cheaper.

They could have made budget (has a full ride) so it’s a better app than IU but you can’t afford based on what you got merit wise. It’s got more similarity to Iowa environment wise than UMN.

And don’t forget tuition increases each year. And who is paying transport, pizza night out, for clubs etc.

Stop looking at the unaffordable. Find affordable if you want more. I gave you Ogelthorpe. It’s in Atlanta. You can take classes at Emory and Ga Tech. It will be cheaper than UMN.

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You should be discussing this with your parents. The vast majority of those responding (including me) are just well intentioned parents. Unfortunately, any advice we provide is not informed by the entirety of your family’s financial situation, your family’s priorities or any real insight into you, beyond a few posts.

This is a life changing decision and you have gotten some valuable opinions but ultimately you and your parents should be making this decision collectively.

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Iowa would be my recommendation
IU over a 100K more over 4 years
Minn over 50K more over 4 years

Wanting to work in real estate on your own and being from Iowa if you are planning on staying in Iowa then that makes Iowa an even stronger choice

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