The book goes into detail how the book came about and how Jeff was able to get 3 schools that he did not work at to let him in.
Not sure if @JeffSelingo knows what heâs getting himself into offering to do this thread. There are going to be a lot of questions! Lol.
But if we donât buy the book, lol? All I see is âembedded.â Not to what actual degree. That would be helpful.
Could you list the âfewer than 60â schools which are both need-blind in admissions and meet full financial need ?
Thank you in advance !
https://www.â â â â â â â â â â /articles/match-fit/need-blind-admission-colleges
I can never remember what we are and are not allowed to link but hereâs a link to that info. List of all need blind. Meets full need is bolded.
I just want to chime in to say Iâve dowloaded the book on Audible and am on Chapter 2. Very interesting, and I am enjoying it immensely. Good work, @JeffSelingo
@homerdog: Thank you for the response. Link doesnât connect due to the site imposed asterisks.
I ask so that I can list the schools which are âneed blind admissions & meets full needsâ and pair them with their respective US News rankingâin addition to the valuable information as to which schools meet both standards.
Again, @homerdog, thank you !
just google âneed blind meets full needâ
I spent a year inside three schools, reading applications with them, sitting in committees â many weeks at each one: U. of Washington, Emory, and Davidson.
Some big publics and other schools have a matrix with auto admission standards like that. But most selective schools (around 200 or so), use a holistic process like I describe in the book â including U. of Washington â where they review every application (yes, every one even if only for a few minutes).
I think Georgetown is an outlier on so many things (they still donât take the common app). I think places like that will go back; many big state systems will probably do largely because of what you say. The College Board and ACT have worked very hard to get these tests required in states, so there will be pressure on state university systems to require them again in the future.
Yes, as I point out in the book, the % taken during ED at selective schools went way up during the 2008 recession and never returned to their historical numbers. I expect the same this year for those schools that can push the numbers up even higher. Iâm also hearing some schools might add ED3 (!)
Googling yields separate lists for âNeeds Blind Admissionsâ and for âMeets Full Financial Needâ. That is why I asked @âJeff Selingoâ to share his list of the fewer than 60 schools which satisfy both croteria.
They donât pay attention to the âapply for financial aidâ question as much as you might think. But they do pay attention to high schools, zip codes, and parent occupations. So, no need-blind doesnât mean they are hiding that stuff. So clearly they know.
Colleges are looking for both well-rounded and pointed students. They constantly talked while we were reading applications and in committee about the leaders vs. the âglueâ kids â those students who operate in the background, with deep expertise, etc. They donât want all leaders, so they are looking for both.
The review of an application is a process: they look at the student, then the student in the context of their school, then later on in the shaping process I recently described in a Wall Street Journal excerpt from the book, they look at the student in the context of the class.
I think the CDS is more accurate for some schools than others. That part about whatâs considered is probably the least accurate! So many schools I know take demonstrated interest into account donât mark that. Always look at the yield. If itâs a selective school and their yield is under 30% they are likely taking DI into account.
It depends on their major and whatâs available to them. But even the College Boardâs own data shows that after 6 APs the return on those starts to diminish. So some colleges like UNC-CH have stopped counting them up like that in admission.
Seems to make most to students wanting to major in STEM I found in my reporting.
Right, itâs not the FAFSA EFC. Most of these schools and selective ones in general also use the CSS which they calculate their own expected contribution.
From the intro of the book:
My criteria for choosing those schools were in some ways as subjective as the admissions process itself. I wanted colleges and universities that were selective, meaning they accepted fewer than half of their applicants. Yes, despite my frustration with how we obsess over selective colleges, I still chose to focus on these schools because I wanted to see how admissions offices at such places grapple with sometimes impossible decisions. While some schools I considered were among the ultra-elite, I hoped to expand my reporting beyond that rarified world. Given that 80 percent of American students attend a public university, I also wanted to include at least one state flagship institution.
Over the summer and early fall of 2018, I approached two dozen campuses with my request. Nearly every one refused. Their reasons varied, but most told me that, given the influx of applications, they didnât have time for an outsider to audit the process. Later on, some admitted they didnât want their inner workings revealed to the wider world especially when schools like Harvard were in the midst of discrimination lawsuits. With conversations about inequity a major issue in the political sphere, a few worried about exposing how they shaped their class based on the financial need of applicants.
In the end, three institutions agreed to let me in. One was public, the University of Washington, known as UW. One was a small liberal arts college, Davidson. And the third was Emory, a major urban private research university. There are lessons to be learned from how these colleges run their admissions offices no matter where you decide to apply.
The point in featuring them is to give you a window into three major types of selective four-year campuses that exist in the United States. I asked the three colleges to let me observe the admissions proceedings during various moments in the fall of 2018 and throughout 2019. I visited the campuses regularly during the height of the reading and selection period between November and March. All three schools agreed I could review applications and listen to conversations between admissions officers about applicants on the condition that names and identifying details remained confidential
(including the application readers, if they so chose).
@jeffselingo Binge read the book on release day. Found all the specific examples inside the admission rooms so interesting and your conclusions of how the process should evolve. Our HS college counselors just added it to their must read lists for parents too.