<p>The position is actually at a HS, so it’s considered HS counseling. However, in China, a lot of high schools don’t have college counselors (believe it or not) so they hire from placement companies. As part of this company, I can be stationed at various HS sites across China. All of the counseling done is completely ethical. I would not be steering students towards HYPS unless they profess an interest in those schools, and I would be just as happy helping them get into tier 2 schools. I also will not write essays for them, take tests for them, etc. I will avoid those companies that do those like the plague.</p>
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<p>But so what? Why should someone’s skewed and incorrect version of reality be treated as important? I mean, if everyone in China said that they believed that NYC was the capital of NY State, would you just go, “Well, that’s their perception, I won’t bother correcting it because, after all, that’s what they believe?”</p>
<p>They are WRONG in believing that HYPS are the only quality universities in the US. They are WRONG for believing that only sunshine and rainbows follow HYPS grads and that everyone else in the US is lower-tier and has sub-optimal opportunities in life. They have a fundamental misunderstanding of what life is like in the US and what the educational “tiers” are in the US. So why are you all so scared to confront them and tell them that they’re wrong?</p>
<p>If I were an expat moving to another country, there would be a group of American expats who would quickly clue me in that while I might think that in the new country, X, Y and Z … that in reality, it’s actually A, B, and C. Why doesn’t anything like that seem to exist in the US? Why do all of these immigrants come over here and no one ever seems to say to them, “Hey, you know how before you got here, you thought the world revolved around HYPS? Well, here in the US, it’s not at all like that. People are successful through many different colleges.” </p>
<p>What’s the hesitancy to deal in reality?</p>
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<p>Yes, and heaven forbid we’d actually ever dare to tell them that they’re wrong. Nope, your approach is just to tiptoe around people’s misperceptions.</p>
<p>Grow a backbone. The proper response to “I haven’t heard of this particular LAC and so therefore I can’t imagine that it’s any good” is “Well, just because YOU haven’t heard of it, doesn’t make it not good. That’s not how things work in the US, where there are plenty of excellent places that aren’t HYPS.” Why it’s culturally acceptable to give in to misguided notions and treat them as worthwhile is beyond me.</p>
<p>The reality is that IN CHINA Harvard is #1. Why try to bully them into accepting your reality? If they just want a quality education, there are many Chinese universities that can provide.</p>
<p>When you get there, there will be plenty of opportunities in China. You don’t have to work in the counseling field after your stint. China is growing and the world is at your oyster. In China they worship ppl from HYPS, so I encurage you to consider try out there.</p>
<p>The main concern I have is the language, you must have a good commend of Chinese to work there. By commend, it is not casual conversation, it is learning the ancient idioms and official documentry writings etc. Also, you will find Cultural differences and you have to know how to handle that.</p>
<p>Go, tiger.</p>
<p>Lol, Chinabound, that sounds a bit better.</p>
<p>Though I think I know exactly who you are working for. They spam/head-hunted me and my friends too a while back!</p>
<p>Good luck to you.</p>
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<p>Depends on who is advancing such an argument. If it is a respected older adult 10+ years out of college and in a highly respected career/job/position in society, that may have an impact…and even then…you’re going against at least a century of social conditioning/experience. </p>
<p>They also tend to ignore advice from American born Chinese like myself or Chinese who are much more open-minded because like many people…they tend to prefer listening to those who confirm their own long-held prejudices/beliefs and more importantly in the case of many employers…do not like being contradicted. Don’t forget that Mainland China is still an authoritarian society…and the authoritarian mindset permeates not only employers in the public sector…but also many areas of the private sector. In the case of the American-born Chinese…they also discount it as coming from someone who has little/no understanding of “Chinese society/needs” and thus…“too Americanized” for their advice to have much relevance. </p>
<p>If it is from someone just a few years in from college…much less a fresh graduate…even from an HYPS…most of the parents, their friends, and more importantly…employers will regard the individual as trying to be extremely charitable to non-HYPS/elite school grads at best…and more often…presumptuously rude in not knowing his/her “proper place” as the younger/junior person. </p>
<p>While this behavior has been acceptable in Western Countries and starting to gain some steam in East Asian/Mainland China…it is still regarded by most parents and especially employers as a huge negative and a great reason to not only reject said candidate…but even possibly blackball him/her with other employers…and in non-professional settings…bring about social ostracism/ridicule from the parents’ social circle about the kid being “Too Americanized/presumptuous/rude”. </p>
<p>Even with the willingness of many parents to be more open-minded…the employers haven’t shown that willingness…and the professional/social costs are too high for most to be worth it…especially for a recent/fresh college grad.</p>
<p>There already is a fully functional organization tasked with the responsibility of providing accurate, unbiased information about higher education in the US to potential students around the world. Unfortunately it is underfunded, and for reasons that I cannot fathom, only has one (yes 1) office in mainland China. Heck, there are THREE in Venezuela! Anyone who is seriously interested in helping international students would be well advised to start here:</p>
<p>[EducationUSA</a> | Study Abroad, Student Visa, University Fairs, College Applications and Study in the U.S. / America](<a href=“http://educationusa.state.gov/]EducationUSA”>http://educationusa.state.gov/)</p>
<p>The next step is to begin to develop ties with the folks at [NAFSA</a> | Home](<a href=“http://www.nafsa.org/]NAFSA”>http://www.nafsa.org/) They are the people in the international admissions offices who are the decision-makers.</p>
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<p>To the average Li/employer on the street, that’s correct for better or worse. </p>
<p>Then again…at least at the undergrad level…there’s still a strong preference for a kid to have attended a topflight Chinese University(i.e. Bei-da, Tsinghua, Ren-da, Nankai, Fudan, Shanghai Jiaotong…and other elite tippy-top schools) to attending a US undergrad. Granted…this thinking is starting to change within the last 2-4 years…though it was much more dominant back in the early '00s and earlier. </p>
<p>One of the main reasons why upper/upper-middle class Chinese parents have been sending their kids to the US for undergrad is because the competition for admission isn’t nearly as cutthroat and numbers driven*. Some Chinese Profs and grad students at an Ivy campus mentioned that many of the undergrads on the same campus may not have scored high enough to gain admission to a second-third tier Chinese university because the competition in the examination is so stiff. </p>
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<li>The applicant’s score on the National College Entrance examination determines not only which school one is admitted to…but also his/her major.</li>
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<p>chinabound- My S has been in Shanghai this past year teaching ELS. He makes less than your salary but has no problems making ends meet. He travels a little bit but otherwise has a very active social life. He lives in a hi-rise studio in the French Concession. It is fine - not luxurious in the least but in a great neighborhood. He found the apartment himself after the company that brought him over put him in a terrrible neighborhood. Make sure you know what neighborhood you are in and how far the travelling to school will be.
Shanghai and Beijing are VERY different. When we visited, we knew we were in a communist country while in Beijing. Shanghai was much more cosmopolitan and commercial. Much more western, I guess. He lived in Beijing for a year when in HS and is thinking about going back there next year. I think he likes Beijing more. (I liked Shanghai more.)
Re: insurance. Are you sure it is totally comprehensive? S remains on my insurance at no extra cost to me and only has hospitalization from his company. He has a list of local MDs in Shanghai who take my insurance.
He has been approached by strangers and asked to write essays for US colleges. He was offered a lot of money for it… $200-300 USD. He was going to do it but it didn’t sit well with him. He does do language tutoring on the side and makes a fair amount that way. (An extra $100USD/week can go a long way over there.)
If you have other questions, PM me and I’ll ask S.</p>
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<p>I’m not sure I want to work in a college admissions office because the pay tends to be low and depending on the institution, you might have to compromise some of your ideals to adhere to institutional priorities. Do you work in admissions now? How do you like it?</p>
<p>The startup I will be working for is relatively new (there are new start-ups there every year) but has experienced remarkable success. They also recruit based on the networks of their employees, so it’s unlikely to be the same company.</p>
<p>Thanks for sharing your son’s experiences, woody. It sounds like I will like it there. One of my goals is to save as much as possible, and it looks like I will be able to do that while still having a lot of fun. I’m imagining Shanghai right now as NYC except cheaper.</p>
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I’m so glad to hear this, and I’m thrilled by the possibility of starting a new life there and hopefully creating success for myself through the opportunities I find. What kinds of opportunities are you talking about though? Would I be able to get into other industries like financial consulting/banking for example? Do you mean start-ups, educational, tech-based or otherwise? Do I have to actively network with expats to find them or could I just rely on job postings?</p>
<p>Do you have any thoughts about other cities in Asia in comparison do Shanghai? Hong Kong or Seoul for example?</p>
<p>I’ll be sure to be proactive about learning Mandarin and will make it a goal to gain proficiency while I’m there.</p>
<p>Thank you all for your contributions.</p>
<p>chinabound, I think living and working in China would be an adventure that will only do you good, personally and professionally. </p>
<p>Yes, you get an $80K US tax exemption, and yes, your “income in kind” like housing is also taxed. Get an accountant who’s familiar with US expat returns. </p>
<p>I’m not knowledgeable about Chinese taxes, but I do know that many expat salaries are “net” in that the employer covers the local tax. If you take on extracurricular work be very careful of its impact on your visa. </p>
<p>Circumventing the law is a national past time in Asia, but it’s your life and your career, so you have to understand the consequences. AmCham is an excellent resource for contacts and advise.</p>
<p>Both Shanghai and Beijing are appealing. Shanghai is the money/business base; Beijing is the power/government base. Kind of like New York and Washington. </p>
<p>This job could lead to all sorts of opportunities – especially if you hone your language skills. The important factor is to maintain your expat status as local hires are often paid substantially less. </p>
<p>But don’t get ahead of yourself. Spend a year at this job, make contacts (your students’ parents will be a goldmine of connections), learn the language, do some traveling. Then you can think about your next move.</p>
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<p>A mentality that is authoritarian and rejects new information or any information that contradicts previously-held beliefs.</p>
<p>So remind me again why I’m supposed to be sooooooo scared that the Chinese will eat our lunch? Seems to me that cultures that practice this aren’t going to win in any kind of long run unless they change their mentality and develop critical thinking skills.</p>
<p>The tax exeption is 92,900 so you won’t have to pay US taxes. You still have to fill out the forms though. I just use Turbo tax and it is pretty easy. You have to report on all benefits you get too such as housing. For housing you can further deduct part of this allowance if you qualify. All companies have to pay Chinese taxes - so either you will pay or your employer will pay for you.
The salary is pretty good for just starting out.</p>
<p>I wonder how much you know their language and culture. What is your long term career goal? Are you going to develop your career in China or here in the U.S.?</p>
<p>China is a very dynamic society. Yes, lots of parents have aspiration to send their kids here. There are lots of schools, preparing for that kind of students. </p>
<p>However, Chinas overall environment is horrible (air, water, traffic, etc.). Your pre-tax $50k salary is about the same pay of a mid-level manager in a large corporate in China. There is a double-digit annual inflation rate in China in recent years. It isnt cheap when you buy clothes, food, or go to restaurants. Buying a car costs twice as much. The price of a condo in either Beijing or Shanghai is prohibitive with your salary, with a starting price of US$400k.</p>
<p>Also, there is no such thing as 9-5 working hours in China. People expect you to work around the clock. Your cell # can be published at your school’s website and people can contact you at any time. As a visitor, I often saw office worker began to leave from model office buildings at 11pm.</p>
<p>If you are for sure going there, I want you be aware of the reality.</p>