Note that these are ones earned in college from where all students theoretically have the same starting line (rather than being pre-selected out of high school).
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Latin Honors is highly variable though. My niece’s college had anyone who had over a 3.5 get a latin honors distinction. It was seriously 1/2 the graduating class. At my D’s school it was based on a % of the class (top 10% of a students college for distinction and then 3% for highest).
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Hello! I’m sending you a PM, feel free to check it whenever you have time.
At DD’s school,
Cum laude was 3.65+, magna cum laude 3.8+, summa cum lauda 3.9+
PBK was top 3% of students who completed the necessary requirements with GPAs of at least 3.8, with a competitive nomination process. Not automatically granted.
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I wanted to put this small linked in blurb from Jose Munoz, the President and CEO of Hyundai Motor Company as he addressed Georgia Tech graduate students at their commencement ceremony.
His words go to show you that you should keep an open mind - and how paths are often not pre determined. The next paragraph is from Mr. Munoz - it’s just a two minute read.
"I had the great honor of delivering the commencement address to Georgia Institute of Technology’s graduate students on Saturday. I felt right at home at Hyundai Field at Bobby Dodd Stadium, a few hours’ drive from Savannah and Hyundai Motor Group Metaplant America (HMGMA).
Standing before hundreds of brilliant young people on the cusp of changing the world was very meaningful.
I told the graduates that my path to becoming the CEO of Hyundai Motor Company was never planned.
When I was finishing my Ph.D. in nuclear engineering in Madrid, I had a clear picture of my future. I would work in nuclear power plants or aerospace. I worked hard to understand the mathematics of nuclear reactions and the trajectories of objects leaving Earth’s atmosphere.
Then I kept missing the train home because I was working late. So I needed to buy a car. That decision took me to a dealership where I met my wife, whose family ran the business. This began my first role in this amazing industry.
Working in the dealership taught me so much about automotive retail and how best to support our outstanding dealer partners.
I told the graduates that the path from where you start to where you end up is rarely a straight line. And that’s exactly how it should be.
I reminded them of the Four H’s from Hyundai: Stay Hungry. Stay Humble. Be the Hardest Worker in the Room. And Stay Healthy.
And an F for Family First.
The families of those students have all stood by them as they completed a very challenging degree.
To the Class of 2025: Congratulations! Use your talents to create something amazing that benefits humanity.
And to President Ángel Cabrera, my fellow graduate of the Universidad Politécnica de Madrid, thank you for the invitation and for the honorary PhD. You’ve done considerably better with your degree than I did. You became president of one of America’s greatest technical universities.
I ended up selling cars. And I couldn’t be prouder of where that path has taken me.
It’s a great time to be a Georgia Tech graduate. Go Yellowjackets!"
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Somewhat clickbaity but fwiw…
Not a single actual Stanford student quoted…
Some students are “lowering their standards” and working for companies that they would not have considered before.
That comment sounds kind of “icky” to me.
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At some point, you have to make a tradeoff. You have to start your career.
It’s like buying a stock at 100. It falls to 70. You know you should sell but you don’t. Next stop 50. You might have sold something at 70 and bought something else that went up.
Sometimes, in life, you need to pivot. I know we had this discussion on this or another thread and there are different thoughts. But to me, 6 months out, holding out for the dream job is beyond risky.
I think you misunderstood what I meant.
I meant that when somebody says they are “lowering their standards” and accepting a job that they would not normally accept…that comment rubs me the wrong way. It’s an “icky” thing to say.
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Thx for clarifying. Yes I misunderstood.
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The article quotes a student who graduated in 2024 (from LMU, no Stanford students quoted, as you stated) and mentions a decline from peak in 2022. This implies the problem is not specific to just 2025 grads. While post grad outcome stats aren’t available for 2025 yet, they are available for 2024 and earlier. And 2024 and earlier stats don’t show anything resembling the tone of the article. Instead they show few CS majors are seeking employment. Among those who are employed, median earnings of CS majors are higher than all other majors, and many CS majors are employed at well recognized companies. Stanford keeps detailed stats private, so I’ll use some other selective privates as examples. Stats below are for 2024 CS grads.
CMU – 2% Seeking Employment/School, Average starting salary = $150k, Most common employers = Google, Amazon, Microsoft/Jane Street…
Yale – 3% Seeking Employment/School, Average starting salary = $143k, Most common employers = Amazon, Microsoft, Google…
Duke – 1% Seeking Employment/School, Average starting salary = Not Reported, Most common employers = Microsoft, Amazon, Meta, …
Cornell – 3% Seeking Employment/School, Average starting salary = $126k, Most common employers = Google, Microsoft, Amazon, …
I don’t doubt that it is more challenging than previous years or that many apply to numerous jobs before finding employment, but I disagree with the dire tone of the article, that a large portion Stanford (and similar highly selective private) CS majors can’t find quality jobs.
These AI doom articles are just another form of AI slop we are destined to suffer through.
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But are students graduating with unrealistic standards?
Maybe they are? Or some are?
One of my kids accepted a position 6 hours away because of how the job market is now. It’s not a permanent position and I have no idea how things will be when the position is over.
Those entering the workforce for the first time need to realize they’re starting at the bottom. Kudos to your child for embracing an opportunity that isn’t necessarily optimal. Every journey has a first step. It’s taking that step, rather than sitting back and waiting for an expected opportunity that may not come, that separates the grinders from the entitled. I’d hire the grinder every time.
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Thank you!
She’s actually in a great city and teaching facility with an amazing boss and coworkers. Her boss’s mission is to train them and help them when it’s time to get another position. She’s also great at networking. Fingers crossed!
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This thread has focused on CS and engineering, but the poor job market extends to many other fields.
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If you look at school job boards for CS and I don’t know the last snapshot timing (how many months after graduation, but in 2024, UCB had 58% working, 23% still seeking. Shows 763 responses.
UNC had 2.4% still seeking - so vastly differnt. It had a 51% knowledge rate.
Pitt had 5% still seeking with an 83% knowledge rate.
On Sep 8, this year, UMD stated of Dec 23/May 24, 1.9% were not placed with 5.1% finalizing plans. 72% reported.
Rose Hulman just says 93% placement rate (so I assume 7% not working or in school) with 100% reporting. This is 2024.
Purdue, in 2024, reported 28 kids, or 10.65% of those who reported, were seeking employment, whenever the last snapshot was.
Ga Tech has a report labeled 2024/25 - not sure of the time frame. They show a 35% response rate with 75.5% placed. They say that’s the percent employed or self employed divided by those actively seeking employment. Here is the actual language: he Placement Rate is calculated as the percentage of respondents who are employed or self-employed, divided by the total number of respondents who are either employed, self-employed, or actively seeking employment.
UVA last showed 2023 data with 11.6% looking for CS.
Cornell’s 2024 job board showed 2.6% still looking in CS.
Many/most don’t seem to provide robust data but some do and have high response rates. I would assume (but can’t for sure) those who respond have better outcomes on average than those that don’t.
It does seem like, it’s not necessarily the top schools that have the best outcomes, maybe not from employment but from % employed.
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We’ve discussed this before but ONE MORE TIME. Your assumption is erroneous. I graduated from college in the 1970’s and NOT ONCE have I returned the periodic employment/compensation surveys. Ditto my spouse. Not from undergrad, not from grad. I even got a recent survey from my MBA program about retirement planning/downshifting at work which got a chuckle from me and then I deleted it.
My kids are more recent grads– and NOT ONCE have they returned the employment/compensation surveys. They were all employed in their respective fields within 8 weeks of commencement; they have NEVER responded. Since the last time you posted this erroneous assumption I have polled at least 50 people- at work, neighbors, my book club, a volunteer board I serve on. Not a single person has ever filled out the survey except for my Rabbi where the placement office of both his undergrad and ordination reigns supreme and EVERYONE knows where everyone is working.
Some people fill out surveys and others do not. That is pretty much the only reliable assumption one can make about the varied response rates. That- and the knowledge that graduates of our military academies have 100% employment rates after graduation and their ROI is off the charts because they were educated courtesy of the taxpayers.
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some colleges also likely have more effective carrot and sticks to enforce compliance. Continuing access to handshake, alumni email etc.
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