@rickle1 maybe the ultimate destination is the joy of it, or learning to work hard and sometimes win and sometimes lose – one of my daughters was a competitive figure skater, time consuming and expensive and it used to annoy me to no end when people told me unless she was going to the Olympics it was a waste – it is hard to believe they have never ‘not won’ – but if not, it will happen and that too will be a good lesson
Our neighborhood wasn’t full of kids, so my kids didn’t really have neighborhood friends. Yes, many of their friends were quite busy and in activities, but it wasn’t hard to make plans for playdates. My kids did swimming lessons when they were little over the summer and as they got older they sometimes did summer school. We also had a family vacation every summer. As they got older they often got together with friends at the beach or at a pool. D also went shopping with friends over the summer. Neither one of my kids was over scheduled and they still had plenty of time to see friends, some of whom were very busy every summer. My kids also don’t mind spending time alone and they always had plenty of downtime.
As far as keeping kids busy so they won’t play video games or watch tv all day…you can set limits.
@toomanyteens I agree it’s both hard to believe and will be a good lesson. Certainly at the next level or the next or whenever, she will lose a competition.
I guess most people who say that are thinking if the skill and expense are not being leveraged to get a scholarship or make the Olympic team, what’s the point. I see the value in competition at the highest level (pushing yourself) but wonder if that effort could be harnessed in another direction where it didn’t cost so much money. To each his/her own.
In my brother’s case, it’s more about not denying his children any opportunity as they are involved in lots of other things which is crazy based upon the training / time commitment with gymnastics.
@rickle1 it was a good deal of money no doubt – I don’t see HOW a child could be involved with much of anything else with a seriously competitive sport like skating or gymnastics (and be good at it, like never losing - it doesn’t even make sense to me and I wonder if that is really the truth), that is honestly the reason that by age 16 my daughter wanted NOT to do it anymore which was of course reasonable.
^ let’s not derail this thread any further. I agree it’s crazy to do other activities on top of competitive gymnastics that requires several hours 5 days per week, but it’s not my kid. The whole point of the thread is about the abundance of ECs, cost , and essentially taking over a parent’s life.
re “I wonder if that is really even the truth” - I assume you’re questioning the story told to me and not my retelling / integrity. Suffice it to say, she is a multiyear state champion and highly ranked national gymnast.
@rickle1 I think it was more about ECs driving parents into debt.
I think that, when we’re talking about a kid who is competing at a national level in anything, be it gymnastics, field and track, chess, robotics, it cannot really be considered a, extracurricular activity, since it moves to the center of the kid’s life, and therefore requires a lot of parental time and support. That is also not some new phenomenon. The lives of the parents of teens who were competing, say, in national level gymnastics in the 1970s, were also taken over by their kid’s activity.
The entire premise of the article, and of the sentiment, is that there is a recent trend, and by recent, I mean by Gen-X and older Millennial parents who supposedly spend so much money on their kids’ assorted ECs that they are going into debt.
BTW, A couple of years ago, Market Watch was describing how student loans are the reason people are in debt. Also health care costs. So I guess that either they have paid off the debt, and have affordable healthcare, or the loan companies and health insurance companies were not happy with all that and demanded that the debt be blamed on somebody else, and ECs were the first thing they thought of. Of course, it could be worse, they could be blaming sun spots…
^ good points. Thanks for getting us back on track.
There are a few sports that cost a lot and many play on traveling teams but they aren’t really competing on a world class level. A girl we knew played on a lacrosse team that was made up of girls from all over the country. They’d travel to a 3-4 day tourney, get there a day early, practice together, play, and then not see each other until the next tournament. It cost about $8000 per year PLUS travel. That girl was not better than my daughter, she just had parents who were wealthier and willing to pay. She also skied competitively all winter but is not Mikaela Shiffrin (although I think were on the same team). Her brother was ranked nationally in tennis.
And neither played in college! They could have but chose not to.
I’ll raise my hand. My middle dd was born with a gymnast’s body. People told me this as early as preschool. I’m not athletic, so I just smiled and nodded. When we got around to gymnastics in 2nd grade, she quickly joined the competitive team and excelled. I completely drank the kool-aid. I thought Oympics! College scholarship! Meanwhile, older dd loved animals, so we thought she might like horseback riding, not thinking that it could get expensive. Fast forward, gymnast “retired” in middle school due to injuries, older one’s passion for horses soared. We had just enough cash on hand to finance both, but have had to give up vacations, needed work on the house, and feel stretched.
@jagrren Interesting and I think pretty common. Although it doesn’t sound like it in your case, I see a lot of parents pushing their kids into competitive travel teams (Actually has caused a major decline in Little League in our area as so many kids just go straight to travel which is absurd because most aren’t that good. Totally waters down the travel leagues). Kid likes a sport. His friends play travel. parents buy the Kool Aid and they’re in travel for yrs when the kid could have just been playing rec league ball (if it still exists). I think many are hoping for scholarships as a return on the investment. Very unrealistic for most. Also, not sure they realize the time commitment required to be a college athlete (even in D3). S could have done D3 but wasn’t focused on it at all.
I have two types of kids. S was a very good baseball player but didn’t hound us to play travel ball. In HS he played in a local HS summer league where we played the other schools in the area but their stars were all playing travel. He got asked to guest play every now and then but he wasn’t all about that. He loves the game but knew it would end in HS as he was good, not great. He also didn’t naturally want to do a lot of extra practice. Interesting that he plays Club Baseball in college. He played all kinds of sports in local leagues, but not travel.
D is a VERY motivated performing artist. Always in a show and taking extra voice / dance / acting. Attends a Performing Arts HS. Her goal is to be a Broadway performer. Very talented but so are thousands of others (yes I’m a realist). However, because she’s motivated and DOES hound us, we do the equivalent of travel ball with her. Summer intensives with professional staff that cost, never ending side lessons, etc. Her activities / passion cost us more than in state tuition at our flagship (FL is very inexpensive)
We do it for her. We didn’t for him. We would have if he really wanted it. We kind of assessed both of their demeanors, interests, motivation and went from there.
If your kid is a serious athlete/artist/performer spending large amount of money to help them succeed is not funding ECs, it is investing in their future. It’s no different that stretching your budget to pay for a good HS or a good college.
Again, at a certain level of accomplishment/focus, it becomes a curricular, not an extracurricular, activity.
^ that’s actually my point. If the kid is both exceptional and motivated (My D), we spend the money to give her any advantage. If the kid isn’t exceptional and/or motivated (My S), we don’t.
The thing I see is many parents, at least around here, spend a ton on the latter. They are just unrealistic and want to believe their kid will get drafted, D1 scholarship, etc. May be motivated and love it, but they’re just not that talented. Odds are very small. I know soooo many kids who played travel for years. It cost their parents thousands per yr (not wealthy people) and they didn’t get a sniff in college. Some of them are trying to play JuCo (no money) to transfer in but very unlikely. However, I do know a few that are playing in major programs and could get drafted.
All I can say is that there is no way my cousin’s 10 year old needs to go to Hawaii to play baseball. His team cannot be so good that they can’t find teams in California to play. Or Arizona or Nevada.
OMG I know – when my daughter played volleyball I was pissed they were going to FL for a tournament (from NJ) - because really?? There is volleyball everywhere-- why the big trips?? And they were not even that good.
It’s a real gamble that your child will be a recruited athlete. The money that parents spend on travel teams could be going toward their college funds. And these days, you almost need to be on one because of the level of competition in certain sports like hockey and lacrosse. We know several families where that happened - their child was just under the recruitment threshold, despite attending sport finishing schools, or were injured. Of course, there are many happy outcomes too.
Add that to the time demands in those sports and grades can suffer too. When you see a 3.8 or 3.9 and a 35 ACT in an athlete that is one exceptional kid.
@TooOld4School I don’t know if we were just lucky or what, but both the major feeder clubs in our area for lacrosse (girls) were super reasonable about the travel. We went to one tournament that was ‘far’ away and that was driving distance too. Of course the east coast is where it is all at, so that helped. But I found this club to be pretty reasonable for travel.
Since we are talking sport and being recruited I will just say that size or body makeup is a huge factor in being recruited.
^ 100%! College coaches, especially D1, are as much interested in how you project (physically) as your ability. A 5’9" 155 pound pitcher who throws 88 isn’t going to get anywhere near the attention as a 6’1" 190 pound pitcher who throws the same 88. Kid A is probably tapped out (maybe gets more out of his body with proper technique but is a huge injury risk) while Kid B has a ton of upside. With the right strength and fundamentals training they probably feel they can get him to 93-95 over 4 years. That’s a big difference. Then he gets drafted. Then other top talent see program Y got a kid drafted so they want in. It’s a system.
My kid started playing basketball as a second grader and fell in love with the sport. At some point, she said she might want to play in college, so we found a travel club team and went all in for a few years. It was her passion and we could afford it so it wasn’t a sacrifice. Plus, playing your chosen sport at the club level is pretty much required to make a lot of the high school teams in our area. When she fell in love with lacrosse, we said “no way” to the club craziness because, unlike basketball, it is very easy for individuals to register for showcases and be placed on a house team. Still, showcases were not cheap especially when you add in travel and a few days stay in a far away location. But, I wouldn’t trade that time with D and witnessing the joy she experienced from playing. She learned leadership, resiliency, and the people she met playing sports are still some of her closest friends. The time and money spent were absolutely worth it.
Yes, so many people posting here apparently refuse to believe that having the student live at home and commute to college costs more than $0 in living (and commuting) expenses. Let’s call this amount $H. If on-campus living expenses cost $C, then the difference in living expense costs between on-campus and commuting from home is $C - $H, not $C.