<p>“And, yes, I am snobby and elitist, and if there’s one institution I love it’s American universities, which are really one of the amazing marvels of Western civilization, mysterious Wonders of the World no less than the Pyramids or Macchu Picchu – how the heck did they build those things? – but amazingly productive in terms of producing research and people who are continuously improving the world despite itself. (Another reason I’m a liberal: I do believe in progress, and that the future is better than the past, even though there’s a lot of the past that I love.) So it gets my goat when people tee off on them in threads like this. The universities I know and love may be predominantly liberal, but they make plenty of room for conservative voices, and conservative voices there – intelligent ones, at least – are strong and often persuasive. They don’t enforce ideological purity at all. That’s really the province of the handful of truly conservative universities (e.g., Bob Jones). They do generally try to enforce some measure of politeness, with is not always easy with 18-22 year-olds, whatever their political affiliations.”</p>
<p>JHS: With all due respect, there was little or no room for a conservative viewpoint at the wonderful (in every other respect) top LAC my son recently graduated from. Before I sent him there, I would have agreed with you that there was “plenty of room for conservative voices”. It simply was not the case.</p>
<p>HeartArt, which LAC did your son graduate from? We could actually get back on topic. </p>
<p>I’m sorry to hear there was no room for a conservative viewpoint at your son’s school. When you say that, what exactly do you mean? What were the symptoms of this lack of room? Was it the other students (“You support McCain? Unclean! Begone!”)? The administration (“You want student funds for a Republican Club? Sorry, we gave the last bit of money to the Vegan Lesbians of Color”)? The professors (“We’ll have no talk of the benefits of the free market here. Let’s get back to white male privilege and reparations for slavery.”)? Or all of them? How did your son and the other conservative students deal with this?</p>
<p>I’m sorry to hear that, too. It’s a real weakness of the college. I discount a lot of the complaints here because I certainly didn’t experience anything like monolithic liberalism in college, and Lord knows my children don’t. I try hard to get them to sample the conservative wares available to them – it’s part of a good education, as far as I am concerned. If conservative voices really, truly were suppressed, that would be a huge mistake. (But I still have trouble believing that it’s happening.)</p>
<p>I prefer not to name the college, but it is a CC top Liberal Arts College. Since I am relating what he experienced, it is obviously not first hand (ie my experience) and I of course want to protect his privacy. When we visited the college beforehand, it was stressed that all groups and viewpoints were encouraged and valued (not really true). The student leaders declared that there were both Republican and Democratic student groups on campus, for example (also not true - no GOP). I knew that the campus was predominately liberal, that was no problem for either myself or for him, at least at the time. What we did not realize beforehand was how completely lopsided the campus culture was. There were probably a few other conservative or moderate students there, but mostly they were in the closet. If you risked stating an opinion that was not the status quo, you would most likely be ostracized and ridiculed, not engaged in a healthy debate. You would also probably forfeit a social life as well. My son honestly was surprised at how close minded and rigid his classmates were, he is used to being around a wide variety of viewpoints in his high school. As a resident assistant, he began a discussion about abortion with an international student who was from a country where sex selective abortion is practiced. This student was opposed to abortion, but he begged my son not to tell anyone. In four years, he never heard a student say they supported a non Democratic candidate. He did not have to worry about joining a conservative group that would cause problems on his resume because there simply weren’t any conservative groups. When other students saw that he drove a SUV, they would make nasty comments. My son does not dress in any unusual way or have any tattoos or piercings…He was would be asked "Do you GO here? or “Why did you come here?” (Finally he just decided to answer "Diversity, ever heard of it? with a smile on his face) He had a bible in his dorm room and apparently that was a topic of much discussion “Do you think he is a religious nut?” He downplayed any reference to religion because it was so controversial - at least the religion we belong to! Of course there was no ROTC on campus but if a military person came for recruitment or any other reason, he or she would be heckled and rudely treated. My son usually ended up talking to them just to be polite because he was embarrassed by his classmates. I could go on and on and all these stories are just little things by themselves but they do add up and are discouraging. School was not like that when I attended in the 70s (to a large liberal public university). I am also sure there were many more incidents that he chose not to share with me. All that being said, and in spite of the challenges, he made the school work for him, he did not compromise who he is and what he believes and he made some wonderful friends who in some cases, have no idea how different his opinions are from theirs. It was just easier not to engage. Did he cop out by not challenging fellow students about their ideas? Maybe, but I did not have to live on that campus and he is not by nature an argumentative person. I respect him for handling the pressure the way he saw fit. He mostly tried to learn from everyone and understand their point of view. He did however come home more conservative that when he left which is interesting. Best of all, he received an excellent education and is currently in graduate school at a state university. As for the political science professors? Could not say - he studied science and the classics.</p>
<p>The above post simply describes one students experience. In no way do I want to infer that all liberal people hate the military or have tattoos, etc. please do not think I am generalizing to trying to insult anyone. Just trying to convey how school has changed from the era when most of us parents attended college.</p>
<p>HeartArt…sorry to hear this. This is exactly the kind of place my son would hate. Of course, JHS will try to spin this somehow…he just doesn’t want to believe it happens.</p>
<p>HeartArt, what a shame. It can’t be easy being the one conservative in a sea of liberals, especially when those liberals are in many cases tactless and closed minded.</p>
<p>Did he have trouble with his professors, or was it just his fellow students?</p>
<p>“In no way do I want to infer that all liberal people hate the military”</p>
<p>It amazes me why so many liberals do hate the military…the people who put their lives on the line to protect their sorry butts…heckled? I would be embarrassed as an American.</p>
<p>Because he was a science major, there was less political discussion in his classes, so I can’t speak about his professors. He actually was pretty moderate when he left for school, he seemed to get more conservative the longer he was there. The really sad part is that in school as well as in society we have gotten to the point where we cannot have civil discourse anymore. We have lost respect for those who do not agree with us and politics has become too bitter and ugly. Discussing an issue with someone who has a different view is an important part of anyone’s education.</p>
<p>“The really sad part is that in school as well as in society we have gotten to the point where we cannot have civil discourse anymore. We have lost respect for those who do not agree with us and politics has become too bitter and ugly. Discussing an issue with someone who has a different view is an important part of anyone’s education.”</p>
<p>well put HeartArt. . .it seems especially true in today’s society, IMO. Your son sounds like a good and kind kid and I hope he, at least, feels stronger for having gone through this experience. I’m glad you noted he received a good education and made some good friends during his undergrad years. In hindsight do you think a larger state school would have been a better choice for him, as a somewhat moderate/conservative kid? Do you think the smaller LAC experience in the sciences was worth it with regard to getting into graduate school? Your insights may help the OP and others like him.</p>
<p>geeps, I believe you risk losing credibility each time you post. Does this bother you?
It seems to me that you are making HeartArt’s case.</p>
<p>HeartArt, what would you recommend to a kid like your son who was a junior in college now? Would you tell him to stay away from your son’s school? Does your son think his college was representative of all LACs as far as the pervasive and oppressive liberal atmosphere, or does he/do you think there might have been other LACs where he could get an excellent education without having to stay in the closet as a conservative?</p>
<p>Here’s a question for other posters who have kids at LACs now: Liberals hated Bush. They loathed him, everything he said and everything he did. But Bush isn’t President now. Do you think the polarized atmosphere is still as bad as ever at liberal campuses?</p>
<p>Morandi and Cardinal Fang: You both pose excellent questions. I do think my son’s LAC experience was worth it, even though I wish it had been a more accepting atmosphere. We do not do our kids a favor by constantly trying to create the perfect environment where they will be coddled and affirmed 24/7. Becoming successful is often about how you deal with difficulties and challenges. He could have transferred at any time, he found great ways to make it work and my husband and I are extremely proud of him. And yes, he is good and kind and strong. He is in medical school now and his experience of dealing with so many people of different backgrounds will make him a better physician. For him, a small LAC was a better fit because he is a bit reserved and might have blended into the woodwork at a large school. He had the opportunity to lead in several organizations, work as an RA, play a DIII sport as a walk on (!), do interesting research, co-create projects in the arts, meet bright, creative, interesting people from all over the country and the world…he definitely blossomed in the environment. He also had his convictions challenged (social, political, moral) often, but he stayed true to his values and beliefs. </p>
<p>I think an LAC is a wonderful choice for many students. But you need to be aware that at least in the top LACs (referring to the CC list) the predominate atmosphere is decidedly liberal. I know this thread has argued this point for many pages now, but it is true. IF that works for you, great. If not, perhaps you should look at other LACs that may not be as elite, but are most likely just as excellent. This is especially true if you are a political science/history/philosophy major because you would probably would want a more inclusive viewpoint from the professors. </p>
<p>In terms of getting into graduate/medical school: I am sure the name value of his school helped get him an interview. Medical school admission is largely based on grades and MCAT scores. But the confidence he developed in the smaller environment I think was helpful for him as a medical school candidate. Working with full professors in small class settings was beneficial as well. </p>
<p>Re: Political atmosphere on campuses. My prediction is because President Obama was elected, the politics will probably be less polarized. I think there will be less anger and that will lead to more rational and informed debate. One can only hope!</p>
<p>Any school that requires a Statement of Faith is pretty much the opposite of open-minded.</p>
<p>It’s interesting that in 59 pages of this thread, no parent has come on and said “My conservative child went to LAC X; it’s a great place for a conservative student.” Conservatives make up a minority of college-aged people, but still, I would have expected some parent to report that their conservative daughter or son went to X College, where there was a small but active group of conservatives, and was perfectly happy with their reception as a conservative at college.</p>
<p>Have you ever met any conservatives who graduated from Dartmouth? I have, lots of them, and they can’t stop whining about how oppressed they were there (notwithstanding that it’s clear they were having the time of their lives writing for the Review and engaging in cabals against the liberal administration).</p>
<p>A formerly prominent student CC poster – under several names – is a right-wing student at Dartmouth. She whined about how liberal it is all the time, too.</p>
<p>It seems like Dartmouth is a great place to be a conservative student, but you’ll never get any of them to admit that.</p>
<p>“It’s interesting that in 59 pages of this thread, no parent has come on and said “My conservative child went to LAC X; it’s a great place for a conservative student.””</p>
<p>Did you miss my post – somewhere in the last few pages – where I said that my conservative kid is at a liberal LAC and extremely happy? The other night he attended a debate between Ken Starr and Erwin Chermerinsky and enjoyed it very much. True, he hasn’t completed college yet, but he loves his school, we think he’s getting a great education (and we are comparing it to a top public university where one kid went and a top Ivy where another went) and he has tons of friends. It is true, he is part of a consortium that allows him exposure to students in other schools, but most of his closest friends are from his LAC and all of his classes have been completely within his LAC so far.</p>