<p>^^^Oldfort! I pay full tuition for my three kids - private school pre-K through college without complaint. We did not take an expensive vacation before their 529s were pretty well funded (started at birth investing the max allowed). I’m just curious where you stay in Europe to keep costs down…some of the spots mention sound great and probably offer less of tourist experience than a large hotel. However, my cardinal rule is…I DO NOT COOK ON VACATION. Nor do I do laundry.</p>
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<p>Ditto. And we had every penny of college saved in advance. We aren’t complaining about the costs of college or lack or retirement funds while at the same time being spendthrifts.</p>
<p>Even when we stay in furnished places with kitchens, I don’t cook, though it is nice to have the ability to make coffee/tea or drinks when I want without ordering and waiting.</p>
<p>We have very much enjoyed the historic national trust properties in the UK. It’s all relative but my best guess is it’s less than what some of you usually spend on hotels. </p>
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<p>This just boggles the mind. In what universe is earning a quarter of a million dollars a year living “paycheck to paycheck”? People living paycheck to paycheck in NY hold their breath after they pay the rent because they know a heating bill is fast on its heels, the car needs winter tires, and there needs to be enough money left over to fill the gas tank so they can get to work next week; and there are no savings or investment accounts that can be raided if they fall short. If you don’t hesitate in the dairy aisle wondering if you can squeek by one more day before you shell out another $4 for a gallon of milk, you’re not living paycheck to paycheck. </p>
<p>I suppose one could live paycheck to paycheck on $250,000 if one lived to the very limit of one’s income.</p>
<p>But as someone who has lived in NYC and the expensive part of NJ, I’m kind of tired of the old canard that $250,000 “isn’t that much” in New York or NJ. Even in the city, someone who makes $250,000 can live QUITE comfortably. The median income in NYC is a little over $50,000. Even in Manhattan, it’s only about $67,000 (probably skewed downward by upper Manhattan). And even in the areas of NJ with the highest property taxes you can live more than comfortably on that much money. I used to live in NJ myself and I still have quite a lot of extended family there. I lived in Manhattan for several years on an income of $32,000 - without starving or missing my rent - so I get a little irritated when people who make a quarter of a million a year tell me they feel like they’re living paycheck to paycheck.</p>
<p>I agree about using VRBO or AirBnB when traveling. The convenience of a kitchen isn’t about cooking – it’s about not having to eat out every single meal, including breakfast. When we travel we always stock the kitchen with drinks (alcoholic and non-), fruit, cheese, bread or crackers, etc. so there’s always something to snack on. Being able to eat something quickly in the morning before setting out on sightseeing, rather than having to start the day at a restaurant, is so useful. And, I confess, I usually do cook one from-scratch meal when we’re there, as long as we’re staying in a lived-in apartment that has staples like salt, pepper, oil, etc. </p>
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<p>Okay, you and oldfort between you made me actually dig out the schedule of class fees from my daughter’s ballet studio, and at her level we’re paying $250/month which does translate to $2500/year for a 10-month season. So when both my daughters were dancing (younger D gave it up a couple of years ago) it did run us $5000 for classes. </p>
<p>Anyone want bunch of old karate stuff? Spent a lot on that too…</p>
<p>I can see a difference in savings but not huge proportionately with a single making $32K and a family(of 4) income of $250K living in Manhattan. A large part of the $250K income will be taken up with a much bigger bite of income tax,medicare tax, city and state tax, 401K plus housing large enough for 4, food, clothing, commuting costs,utilities, entertainment etc etc. Everything in Manhattan costs more.</p>
<p>However,$250K can go a long way other than in Manhattan or San Francisco.
My D’s colleague and her husband moved to a nice section of Dallas, bought a huge house with pool and their payment is less than what they were renting for a one bedroom in Manhattan. My S often speaks of the taxes he could have saved by living in Texas, no state taxes, no city taxes and how he could buy a mansion by selling his 2BR coop in the Village.</p>
<p>Having grown up in NYC myself to parents who never earned even close to that median (in the 70s), and having many friends and family NOW who live there on a working class income, I know for a fact it can be done. But you can’t have the biggest apartment in the best/most convenient neighborhood with taxis or your own car or whatever. Kids share bedrooms, everyone takes the train, public schools are what’s up, you watch for deals on museums and movies and you eat inexpensively. </p>
<p>Not everyone wants to live that way, of course, but that is a choice.</p>
<p>Two sons in the state university system is about $60,000/year. That leaves $78,000 for everything else. I can do that standing on my head with one arm tied behind my back.</p>
<p>I’m still puzzling how a family of 4 can spend $30k for groceries, plus another $10k for eating out. Are they packing fois gras sandwiches instead of PB&J?</p>
<p>$575/wk for groceries! I don’t think I’ve EVER spent that much in a week on groceries, even when shopping at Whole Paycheck-- i mean, Whole Foods.</p>
<p>$575/week for groceries probably means lots of prepared food (think of all the offerings at Whole Foods) – in other words, we’re talking about a family that doesn’t really cook. Which is no wonder, since the parents are working their butts off in order to be able to afford all those pricey groceries! They’re probably too tired when they get home to cook!</p>
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<p>Ummm, four singles living separately probably have higher living expenses than a family of four living together (or four singles living together) with the same level of luxury or lack thereof. So the family of four with an income of $250,000 could certainly spend more lavishly than four singles making $32,000 each ($128,000 combined) (even after accounting for income and payroll taxes).</p>
<p>We spent about $575/month for groceries when the kids lived at home. That much per week boggles the mind!</p>
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<p>I think you misread my post.
I do not expect a single making $32K living in Manhattan can live separately without roommates.</p>
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<p>Yes, my post does indicate that, but not much lavishly. If I were single, making $32K and pinching pennies, I could eat “cup of noodles” or a salad with some protein (tofu) every day. However, if you have a family of four, you can’t serve them that diet every day.</p>
<p>A single person making $32K is in the 15% tax bracket while the $250K filing jointly is in the 33% bracket. So the family makes 7.8x more than the single person but pays 17.1x taxes, not including medicare, and other taxes.</p>
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<p>Why would a low cost subsistence diet that is possible for one be impossible for a family of four?</p>
<p>Of course, even a low cost subsistence diet need not be monotonous.</p>
<p>this is absolutely accurate. but colleges somehow think I have 3 times that as they want me to pay full freight for 2.</p>
<p>I spend over $500 a week on groceries and I cook from scratch. If I make my family of five a steak dinner comprised of food purchased at Whole Foods, this is approximately what I spend:</p>
<p>$75 beef tenderloin 2.5 lbs at @$29.95/lb.
$9 good piece of cheese and bread/crackers/olives for appetizer
$3 zucchini squash or other vegetable
$3 organic baby potatoes
$6 salad with various ingredients including cheese, nuts, tomatoes
$8 raspberries
$12 bottle of wine
$3 other beverages
$5 dessert - ice cream/gourmet quality chocolate or ingredients for a baked item
$123.00 total</p>
<p>The tenderloin is obviously an expensive meal, so substitute salmon or chicken and you can cut that in half, but cooking five nights a week, dinners average around $70 per night. That still leaves breakfast, lunch and snacks…it’s easy to get to $500 a week. Also factor in using top quality olive oil, vinegar, and other condiments. </p>
<p>The unlimited meal plan costs around $595 per month for my D that I think it is a bit over price. So the family with $595 grocery cost per week is like having a college meal plan for 4. ;)</p>
<p>Gourmetmom, I’m coming to your house! </p>
<p>I spend a lot on groceries too–probably $200 a week just for two of us. That includes staples like toilet paper, cleaning supplies, etc. as well as everything I need to make my daughter’s lunch each day (and some of mine). Our biggest issue is fresh fruit–my daughter eats a ton of it. It is definitely a luxury that people eating ramen and canned tuna can’t afford.</p>