Match me: VA resident, Class of 2027, looking for LACs with focus on Econ/politics/philosophy but also with STEM options/minors/classes [~3.5 GPA, 1360 SAT, <$50k]

Chance Me / Match Me
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One if the most highly rated colleges in the country for service is Hobart & William Smith Colleges (enrollment: 1800), which is located on the edge of the town of Geneva, NY (pop: 12,000) and literally on the shores of Seneca Lake in the heart of NY’s Finger Lakes region. “100% of the students at HWS are engaged in service, service learning, and/or community based research”, according to The Center for Community Engagement & Service Learning which coordinates much of the service opportunities on campus.

The beauty of the colleges 200-year-old campus is enhanced by its lovely lakeside setting. It is easily walkable into town and to Exchange Street with its cafes and dining spots. The Cayuga-Seneca Canalway offers a 15 mile round trip opportunity from campus for running, jogging, or biking along a spur of the Erie Canal. Long distance bikers and/or kayakers have the 300 miles of the Erie Canal itself for outdoor adventures. 15,000 acre Letchworth State Park with its dozens of Genessee River waterfalls (up to 100 ft high) is only an hour away from campus. Farther away is the 6 million acre Adirondack Park with limitless opportunities for outdoor adventures for weekend camping and hiking trips. 20 minutes east of campus is the inspiring town of Seneca Falls where the campaign for women’s rights began in 1848 and where the movie, “It’s a Wonderful Life” was set and is still celebrated. For excursions into city life, the city of Rochester is only 45 minutes away and its airport makes the area easily reachable by commercial airlines.

Academically HWS has only one required course, the First Year Seminar. Beyond that, the program is a self-planned with your advisor with the only caveat being that the plan must include at least one course in each of 4 areas of educational perspectives, i.e. a modified open curriculum. So, a student with diverse interests in Economics, Philosophy, and Politics can design his own course of study to include all or parts of the above, which can also be an individualized major integrating his diverse interests in his own personalized way. HWS also offers a “guaranteed internship” program, complete with stipends for unpaid internships. Beginning next year, all students will be expected to complete a senior capstone project.

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Lafayette, Union, Bucknell and if you are female- Smith.

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This sounds really interesting!

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That sounds like an interesting option. And based on the NPC it’s also a fit financially. And it has a 3-2 program.

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Just be aware, few students actually choose to do 3-2 programs.

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Yes, I chose HWS and Wooster not only because they offer great opportunities academically as well as for campus, service, and outdoor activities but because I thought they might come in within budget. How did Wooster match up on the NPC?

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Swarthmore College, Union College, and Lafayette College are are liberal arts colleges which present the rare option of offering engineering majors and have done so for well over 100+ years. They are also all difficult to gain admission to one degree or another. Your son might be accepted at one or two of the three. The problem is that he’s not likely to get any merit aid, so affordability will depend on need at all three. A fourth college which has the same engineering option and long history with engineering at a small college with liberal arts and all 3 of the majors he’s interested in is Manhattan University (enrollment: about 3000). He might even qualify for merit aid there.

There are several immediate misconceptions people have about Manhattan U. First, it’s not in Manhattan although it once was 100 years ago. Second, it’s in the Bronx, but not in what most people think of as the Bronx. It’s in Fieldston/Riverdale, which might just be the most affluent neighborhood in any of the 4 outer boroughs with a number of neighborhood shops & restaurants near campus and within walking distance of the Hudson River. Third, it’s not like the neighborhood is affluent but the next neighborhood over is a war zone. It is buffeted from the rest of the Bronx by 1100 acre Van Cortland Park. Fourth, although the campus is compact, similar in size to Columbia’s core campus, it has a lovely quad and access to Van Cortland Park’s green space across the street from the back end of the campus. Fifth, it is not a city public; it is a private, Catholic College.

For outdoor activities, Van Cortland offers the best cross country running path. It’s where the Manhattan cross country team competes and where the NYC high school championship meet is held. There are also several bicycle greenways which begin in Van Cortland Park. And there is a jogging path along the Hudson River not far from campus. Although it’s NYC, camping and hiking opportunities are not not far away. With a campus location on the Westchester County line, Bear Mountain and the adjacent Harriman State Park are a combined 50,000 acres with wonderful hiking opportunities and camping in Harriman. The Appalachian Trail passes through these 2 parks. There are ski slopes a couple of hours north of campus in both NY and Massachusetts.

Academically it is possible to transfer into Engineering from Arts & Sciences at Manhattan. Of course anyone wanting to do so needs to pay attention to course sequences and course requirements. The School of Engineering does offer robotics as part of Electrical & Computer Engineering (ECE). There are 7 specific robotics courses spread across ECE and Mechanical Engineering. Arts & Sciences at Manhattan do not offer the open curriculum at HWS or the 4 year IS/capstone at Wooster. There is a core curriculum and the capstone option is limited to certain specific majors. The advantage which Manhattan provides academically is the opportunity to begin college in Arts & Science while keeping the option open to transfer into Engineering at any point in the first 3 semesters if that’s where a student’s passion takes him. As a final note, there are several organized service opportunities at Manhattan.

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To stay within budget, I would think that public college options would be on your list.

Billed as New York’s “public honors college”, SUNY Geneseo (enrollment:3800) is a public liberal arts college located about 40 miles south of Rochester, NY and about the same distance north of 15,000 acre Letchworth State Park, once named the most beautiful public park in America and a great location for camping & hiking. The campus itself has been called the most beautiful college campus in New York.

Here’s the good news. Geneseo’s current out-of-state cost is $36,500, but the cost to your son would be closer to $30,000 because Geneseo has a presidential scholarship of up to $10,000, which is automatically awarded to out of state students, depending on gpa.

Here’s more good news. Geneseo has a major called Philosophy, Politics, and Economics. Sound like it was custom made for your son? Only about 6 dozen colleges in the country offer this major.

More good news. If your son decides that he is interested in law school, Geneseo has a 3+3 BA/JD program with SUNY Buffalo School of Law. 3 years at Geneseo, followed by 3 years at UB Law School. After completing the first year of law school, the credits are transferred back to Geneseo and the student is awarded his BA. It’s hard to beat that financially. Not only do you and he save a year of college cost/debt, but instead he’s out earning money in that last year and getting on with his life.

The College of New Jersey in Trenton (enrollment: 7400) is the state’s public liberal arts college. It comes with a bonus. That is that it’s the rare liberal arts college with a School of Engineering . . . AND the School of Engineering has a major in Robotics.

TCNJ’s cost of attendance is $44,000 for out of state students this year . . . BUT there’s a $5000 grant for students who are in the top 30% of their class, bringing the cost within budget. Is your son within the top 30% of his class?

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These are great options. We don’t know about the top 30% because the school doesn’t rank…

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That does sound good!

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HWS 3+2 program is with Columbia or Dartmouth.

How do the NPCs of Columbia and Dartmouth for transfer students look? (Both use the College Board NPC template, so you should be able to save your info across the two colleges’ NPCs. But be aware that they could change their financial aid methods three years from now.)

Would 3 years and HWS net price plus 2 years of Columbia or Dartmouth net price be affordable?

Of course, there is also the issue of how difficult 3+2 transfer admission to Columbia or Dartmouth would be, and whether they are otherwise suitable for you academically and socially.

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PPE was originated at Oxford a century ago but wasn’t adopted in the U.S. until the 1980s at Yale. It then spread to some dozens of colleges across the country. It is a highly respected major - especially by law schools. There is even an international Philosophy, Politics, & Economics Society.

Here are some liberal arts and other similar colleges in the Nirtheast and Midwest which offer this major:

Adelphi (NY)
Brandeis (MA)
Brown (RI)
Dartmouth (NH)
Drexel ¶
Eastern Oregon
Juniata ¶
LaSalle ¶
Suffolk (MA)
SUNY Geneseo
University of Rochester
University of Washington - Tacoma
University of Washington - Bothell
Wesleyan
Western Washington
Yale

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The program at Wesleyan - if it’s the College of Letters (COL) - began in 1959:

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The Philosophy, Politics, and Economics Society lists Wesleyan as one of the colleges with a PPE major. When I clicked on “Wesleyan” on their list of colleges in the United States, it linked to The College of Social Studies.

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Oh, that makes sense, too! Both the social studies and letters programs have been in continuous operation at Wesleyan since 1959. Both are known for their rigor and weekly, tutorial style, teaching. The Yale program sounds very similar to them.

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Done

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Thanks!!

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It looks like Wesleyan is out based on NPC.

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Surprising. Wesleyan gave the best aid out of the 50 schools we calculated the NPC. We are a higher income, lower asset family. Perhaps that’s why.

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I missed this thread originally, but @Bill_Marsh has given some fabulous suggestions as has @jym626.

I know your family has indicated a willingness to postpone any engineering studies until grad school, if that is a path that your son decides on. That said, however, the bulk of my initial search has incorporated colleges that are ABET-accredited, at least for general engineering, and often more specialized fields. That way it’s an option if your son decides earlier on in college that it’s the path he would like to pursue.

My favorite college research tool (College Navigator, the fed’s website) is currently not functioning for me, so I’m grouping the schools into two broad categories, higher odds of admission and lower odds of admission. These are generally all small to medium colleges unless I specify otherwise.

Higher Odds of Admission

  • Allegheny (PA ): A well-respected education is offered here in a cute town north of Pittsburgh. https://ctcl.org/allegheny-college/

  • Carroll College (MT): ABET-accredited for civil engineering in Helena, Montana’s state capital.

  • Eastern Mennonite (VA): ABET-accredited for general engineering and located in Harrisonburg for great access to the Appalachians and Shenandoah areas.

  • Fort Lewis (CO): This is Colorado’s public honors/liberal arts college and is a fabulous destination for those who love the outdoors. ABET-accredited for computer engineering and general engineering.

  • Gonzaga (WA): This Jesuit college is located in the eastern part of the state in Spokane. It’s ABET-accredited for civil, computer, electrical, and mechanical engineering as well as CS and engineering management.

  • Randolph-Macon (VA): ABET-accredited for general engineering and just south of Richmond.

  • Loyola Maryland (MD): This Jesuit institution is ABET-accredited for CS and general engineering. It’s also part of the Baltimore Collegetown association that allows students to cross-register for classes at other area schools like Johns Hopkins and Goucher.

  • Penn State – Behrend College (PA ): ABET-accredited in computer, electrical, industrical, mechanical, polymer, and software engeineering as well as CS and a couple engineering technologies. This campus is in Erie, not to be confused with the massive university in State College.

  • Seattle U. (WA): This Jesuit institution is ABET-accredited in civil, computer, electrical, and mechanical engineering.

  • St. John’s College (MD & NM): It’s definitely a fit school, but it’s a great place for critical thinking, writing, and the life of the mind. It has campuses in Annapolis, MD and Santa Fe, NM. @randommom1 has a student here. https://ctcl.org/st-johns-college/

  • SUNY New Paltz (NY): ABET-accredited for computer, electrical, and mechanical engineering. It’s in a charming town and there’s a lot of arts and other options here.

  • U. of New Hampshire: ABET-accredited in a plethora of engineering fields. This is a smaller public flagship, with about 11k students. So whatever he wants to study, it’s probably be available, but it’s not as massive of a school as other big flagships.

  • U. of Portland (OR): ABET-accredited in civil, electrical, and mechanical engineering as well as CS.

  • U. of Vermont: ABET-accredited in biomedical, civil, electrical, environmental, and mechanical engineering. This is another smaller state flagship, with about 13kish students (I think?). A fabulous place for those who love the outdoors.

  • U. of Wyoming: ABET-accredited in architectural, chemical, civil, computer, electrical, energy systems, mechanical, and petroleum engineering as well as CS. This is also a smaller flagship, with about 8-9k students total, I believe. @twoinanddone had a student here.

  • York (PA ): ABET-accredited in civil, computer, electrical, and mechanical engineering as well as CS.

  • Hobart Williams, Manhattan, and College of Wooster would probably fall into this very broad category.

Lower Odds of Admission

  • Bucknell (PA ): ABET-accredited in biomedical, chemical, civil, computer, electrical, environmental, and mechanical engineering as well as CS
  • Case Western (OH): Cleveland school ABET-accredited in numerous areas
  • Union (NY) – mentioned upthread
  • Lafayette (PA )…mentioned upthread
  • Trinity (CT) – ABET-accredited for general engineering

You may also want to check out the Colleges That Change Lives website. It’s an association of schools that banded together after they were recognized in a book of the same name by a former NY Times education editor. The profiles are marketing information, but I feel that they tend to give a good sense of a school.

As the Jesuit philosophy appeals, here is a site with all of the ones in the U.S.: https://ajcunet.edu/about/colleges-universities/

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