My S applied to Clarkson and UMaine. Clarkson very generous with merit. UMaine has the flagship match. Both strong programs.
My friend’s daughter is in mechanical engineering at St Louis University and loves it. There are opportunities for aerospace there as well if that’s an interest. Jesuit schools incorporate service learning which he may enjoy with his past experience with volunteering back at home. Jesuit schools do typically provide some financial aid as well.
CC is not somethign he is consdering. He did AP CHem and AP Physics (Algebra based) in junior year with B and B+ and Pre Calc honors with an A. Plans on AP Calc and AP Physics Mech in Senior Year.
I am concerned about the rigor of engineering and have talked to him multiple times abotu it but he is unfazed, so I am hoping he is motivated enough to make it work.
Thank you all for the great suggestions and information. Lots to think about and I will tak to my son about all of these. Much appreciated!
How well did he score on the AP exams for chemistry and physics 1?
AP chemistry may be given subject credit; general chemistry is often a peripheral requirement for ME majors. AP physics 1 will not be given subject credit, since ME majors need to take calculus-based physics, although it should fulfill the expected prerequisite of high school physics.
Because physics and calculus are critical prerequisites for later courses, if he earns a high enough AP score to get advanced placement, he may want to verify his knowledge of the subjects by trying the college’s old final exams in the courses the he may be allowed to skip before deciding whether to skip them.
How well did he score on the AP exams for chemistry and physics 1?<<<
Right? He was a b student in the course, did he somehow defy that and get a great score?
His scores and grades are fine. He doesn’t need all A’s to succeed. He needs drive, interest and a non give up attitude. He needs to communicate and work well with others.
Engineering is very hard at every level but the first year of two is very telling. Some don’t make it past the first semester and guess what, that is ok. At MSU, your technically not in engineering until you meet their requirements. Many straight A students don’t make it and many B/C students do. But this year with Physics C and Calc 1 should give him a clue. If he bombs those then maybe not. But A or B and he’s fine.
I also WOULD NOT try to pass out on Calc/Physics in college. This is against advice you will get. OK, well maybe physics…LOL…for his field, he needs a great foundation. Calc in college in NOT Calc in high school. It is really hard but again needed to build concepts on. But it gets you on the path of thinking differently. He won’t get all A’s in college in engineering. He might barely pass some classes. It’s hard for everyone.
Grade in AP course versus AP score can be a measure of how well the high school teaches the AP course. B grade with 3 or 4 score is probably a reasonable expectation. B grade with 1 or 2 score suggests substandard course quality or very high grade inflation. B grade with 5 score suggests good teaching but hard grading, or a student who does well on tests but may not have put much effort into other graded things that high school (including AP) courses often include in the grade.
Still waiting on the AP test scores which are due to come out next week.
110% agree with knowsstuff.
In addition to what he listed, also tell your son not to be afraid to ask for help, AND go to all the review sessions, prof office hours, TA office hours, form a study group, etc… Even if he thinks he knows the material, go to all of those things anyway.
Engineering is not a solo sport ; )
In terms of placing out of intro courses based on AP scores, many schools will have old course exams online. Purdue told incoming students that if they could consistently get an 80% of better on the exams that they should move up a level. (The means are usually in the 50s/60s). Physics was a no go to skip because mechanics was interwoven into the honors engineering design course and E&M was combined with optics. That said, my D said Physics C was the most useful HS course she took in terms of preparation for engineering.
FWIW, I think your son should have many good options. I don’t have any additional recommendation to what’s already been suggested.
Yes, get help. there will be tons of help. Forget pride…go. Go to everything you can. It will only help. Many schools have peer to peer tutoring for math and science. Great way to socialize also. My son said to me once that even the easy classes are hard. Also don’t overload your first semester. Once you meet with your counselor you will make your schedule. First semester make lighter. Most schools even if you get into their engineering school your typically not until the end of your sophomore year once you complete the requirements. Just figure out how to do that and still stay on track…
However, going light can delay graduation unless you go heavy later, or have AP credit that you can use to fulfill requirements.
Since the OP is in California, California public universities generally admit directly to major for engineering majors, rather than admit to first year engineering programs where there may be college GPA thresholds or competitive admission later to declare a major.
For colleges that do admit to first year engineering programs, the secondary admission to major criteria vary:
http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/engineering-majors/2174743-first-year-engineering-programs-secondary-admission-to-major-criteria.html
I like @taverngirl’s suggestion of Clarkson. RIT could work as well.
Utah is a good low cost option for CA kids who like the outdoors (particularly the amazing skiing). You can get residency and instate tuition rates after the first year by staying through the summer. Total cost even paying OOS rates the first year is then comparable to the UCs. If CU Boulder is potentially of interest then definitely consider Utah at half the price.
Good points and nice link to the other thread. Now I know why you made that… Lol…
Most engineering programs suggest around 13-15 credits /semester. Don’t think he would get thrown off by taking 12 credits. My son took 18 credits with two sciences, math, sociology and maybe something else. So don’t do 2 sciences with labs back to back. Plus he can always take more classes and drop one before the deadline if things aren’t going well.
Also I do suggest using that freshman summer and take maybe 2 classes that would transfer (make sure), to yes, possibly lighten the load or maybe help add a minor etc. Things don’t get easier the next year. So even if he took at “lighter” semester to get acclimated he could take 1/2 classes at a cc over the summer to get caught up plus you will be amazed what the savings on those 2 classes would be. Warning : summer classes go twice as fast.
For a typical degree program requiring 120 credits in 8 semesters, the student needs to average 15 credits per semester. Some engineering majors at some colleges may have subject requirements that total to more than 120 credits, so the average credit load may be greater. Entering with useful (for subject credit) AP, IB, or college credit can reduce the number of credits needed. However, a student who does not enter with such credit (or who repeats it) and takes only 12 or 13 credits the first semester will be playing catch-up with credits or courses later, or need extra semesters or summer sessions to catch up.
Here is the ME major roadmap at SFSU for a student with no credit on entrance, but also no need for remedial courses: http://bulletin.sfsu.edu/colleges/science-engineering/engineering/bs-mechanical-engineering/roadmap-i-ii-eng/ . To graduate in 8 semesters, the student needs to take 15-17 credits each semester.
If there is any question about finishing in 8 semesters, it may be a good idea to budget for 9-10 semesters, noting that any scholarships are unlikely to continue beyond 8 semesters, and financial aid may have a semester limit as well.
I agree about looking into credit requirements. A 12 credit semester wouldn’t cut it at Purdue either to stay on track for graduation in 8 semesters. Plus course sequencing is such that students don’t have that much flexibility in putting off courses required for their major. My D hasn’t had a semester below 16 credit hours and she’s half way through.
I said to use the summer to catch up…take a class or two… At a cc. Many, many do. My son’s classes at a cc after freshman year were basically all engineering students from different colleges. He was doing it to get ahead. He’s never had a semester less then 16 but most were 18. But he’s also going for 2 minors.
Michigan’s also 16 credits /semester for 128 credits total https://bulletin.engin.umich.edu/ug-ed/reqs/
So it’s good for the OP son to note this and what it means. Maybe look at a few class plans. Most are similar but not exact but have to follow Abet guidelines.
Summer classes still cost money (granted, not so much at a community college) and time that could be used for jobs or internships.
Typically the summer after freshman year it’s hard to get an internship. Not impossible. Many, many kids take classes. 2 classes at our cc was less then $1,000 total (out of our district). Same 2 classes at Michigan with room /board was like $8,000 or more of I remember correctly. In my kids classes were engineering students from Georgia Tech, Michigan, Berkeley, Stanford, UIUC and so on. They were actually hard classes but much cheaper. So that was a win. Again, just different options.