<p>The schools I have picked are very diverse. I would never go to a school 99% white, 99% catholic, 99% whatever. I do not want to be the only Indian male in a college. Trust me, I know what it feels like to be the only one of your race in a class. Until high school, I was the only Indian student in my grade, and grades in my school system were fairly segregated till half way through middle school. I want to go to a school with a significant Inian population. I do not want to be the only person who looks like me in every room every day.</p>
<p>Old Campus, I understand that gay people will want to have a strong gay/lesbean presence at a college. I couldnt care less if my college has a very strong gay/lesbean presence. It would turn me off if the gay/lesbean or the antigay/lesbean groups ran campus social life. I just find it strange that Middlebury would want to know if I am gay or straight.</p>
<p>Old Campus, I think you’re ignoring the issue of supply vs. demand here - - can every campus have a high percentage of gays? Can every top school have a high percentage of gays? What is a desirable number of gays? Is it above the rate of gays in the general population?</p>
<p>But, in terms of sexuality, if you’re straight you will never be a “small minority” at a college. No school I know (plenty, trust me) has a “50%” gay/straight split.</p>
<p>I have to agree with venkater. College applications are not the place for discussions of sexual orientation. I wouldn’t recommend students writing about love interests towards either sex for an essay topic. Gay students are not discriminated against in the admissions process—how would a college know what their orientation was? Therefore, why should they receive any “hook” for homosexuality? </p>
<p>I would wager that obesity is a bigger obstacle in acceptance to school (with interviews) than any sexual issue is.</p>
<p>Will schools now have a minimum number of homosexual applicants to admit. You know top schools will want to activly try to admit many qulified URMs. Will they now do this to attract gays? Will they have a maximum number of gays who can be admitted? I am against giving my race, income, sexuality, and maybe even gender in college admissions. Let them admit me for my qualifications, not my features I have no control over.</p>
<p>Cavalier,
I think YOU are ignoring the issue of diversity.
What is the desirable number of straights? 100 per cent? That’s above the rate of straights in the general population.
And, ANYWAY, Middlebury is a private institution and can do whatever it pleases.</p>
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<p>Wouldn’t it be great if the world worked that way?</p>
<p>“And, ANYWAY, Middlebury is a private institution and can do whatever it pleases.”</p>
<p>NO they cannot. Private colleges still get some funding from the federal government and/or other perks (tax exemption, free postage). They cannot do what they want if they want to be accredited either. They have to be fair in admissions. If they are not fair, then they will also lose applicants.</p>
<p>mkn56:
While I understand that you may think this:</p>
<p>“College applications are not the place for discussions of sexual orientation”</p>
<p>Be forewarned that college, the real thing, IS “a place for discussions of sexual orientation,” and has been so for sometime.</p>
<p>What Middlebury wants to do is have a more diverse population. Hey, having a college mirror the world is not a bad thing, you know.</p>
<p>What college mirrors the real world? It would have to be 1/6 chinese, 1/6 indian, and have a lot of blacks and hispanics.</p>
<p>“They have to be fair in admissions. If they are not fair, then they will also lose applicants”</p>
<p>MY point exactly.</p>
<p>They ARE l;osing applicants. Just the ones some people here want them to lose. And it so happens they want those applicants.</p>
<p>Well, at least at Yale I - who, by the way, am Hispanic, Venkater - had a diverse experience - Blacks, Hispanics, Europeans, gay, straight.</p>
<p>mini - you imply that having only 5 openly gay students is unacceptable. So what is the right number? And what morally superior being gets to decide that number? </p>
<p>I find it really questionable that one’s sexual orientation increases the quality of intellectual life at any university. I practice law with some awfully smart people - they all happen to be great lawyers, with superb critical thinking and writing skills. A few of them happen to be gay. But that is beside the point, isn’t it? They should be (and are) free to be who they are, and respected and treated well. But they shouldn’t be measured or evaluated differently than anyone else.</p>
<p>I don’t imply ANYTHING. Middlebury clearly thinks that is too few, and that gay students contribute “uniquely” to the campus life of ALL students.</p>
<p>Morally superior admissions offices decide how many legacies to admit, how many full-paying customers to admit, how many lacrosse players to admit, how many football players to admit, how friends of GCs to admit, how many ambassadors kids to admit, how many New Yorkers to admit, how many Hispanics to admit, how many Jews to admit, how many potential theater majors to admit, how many Palauans to admit, how many Pell Grantees to admit, and the list goes on…gay students join the list. What is “special” is that they know they need a critical mass of them if they want new ones to attend.</p>
<p>“I find it really questionable that one’s sexual orientation increases the quality of intellectual life at any university.”</p>
<p>You can find it questionable all you like. Me, too. They didn’t ask you, did they?</p>
<p>Good for you Old Campus, you had a diverse college experience. How diverse will my experience be if I go to (O say) Bob Jones U? How diverse will it be if I go to one of this country’s historically black colleges? I never said Yale was not diverse. There are many colleges that lack diversity and I am not too intersted in them.</p>
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<p>Exactly. Middlebury just labeled it affirmative action, because gay people are underrepresented at the school. This effort is similar to efforts to recruit more women to engineering programs and men to predominantly women liberal arts colleges.</p>
<p>It’s not even about recruiting gay people for their creative talent (which may be lacking in many) but for their unique perspective.</p>
<p>As previous posters mentioned, one challenge is making sure that applicants who self-identify as gay are truly gay. This is similar to the verification process for applicants claiming to have certain ECs/awards and marking URM status.</p>
<p>mini: I think you are truly just trying to pick a fight. (sorry) Your attitude is sort of “it’s their school, they can choose any student body they like” is certainly true – and I would never be one to force schools to do anything but that – but, really, to not call them on this total BS project is beyond me. And why do you keep comparing it to Yale? Where did Yale say they are giving a true edge to gay kids?</p>
<p>Rich white gay kids, rich white straight kids, rich straight black kids, rich gay black kids, rich Asian kids…no diversity there in my opinion! It’s a game!</p>
<p>I’ll give you just One example of why I think that. My neighbor is black. His wife is Hispanic. They are very well off (he is a top executive in a large company). Their kids have gone to college free on race-based scholarships. What diversity do they offer? Dark skin? That’s it. (Don’t get me wrong - they are great kids.) Other than that they come from the same very sheltered life, private school, very nice upscale neighborhood, very well-to-do church.</p>
<p>Meanwhile, I live in a region with some really hurting rural, predominantly white, high schools. They have cut languages, music, AP courses, you name it. Where are the scholarships for those kids? The college recruiters don’t even go to those schools! They wouldn’t know about Middlebury if it knocked on their door. But do they bring to school a truly different viewpoint? Well, yes, I’d say so. Many are first generation college kids, their families are farmers, these kids have worked since they could walk. Conservative? Yes. The same families who vote for someone like GWB. Now, how many kids at Middlebury can say that?! But in many ways they are the face of underrepresented America.</p>
<p>I just resent colleges acting like they’ve made some big inroads on diversity (actually giving a tip in admissions to a gay kid?!) when it is fake. It’s arbitrary. It’s no more valid than giving a tip to shy kids, or overweight kids, or non-blond kids. That’s all.</p>
<p>I’ll give you just One example of why I think that. My neighbor is black. His wife is Hispanic. They are very well off (he is a top executive in a large company). Their kids have gone to college free on race-based scholarships. What diversity do they offer? Dark skin? That’s it.</p>
<p>They offer an example (a very RARE example I might add) to other Black and minority students, coming from less well-off backgrounds, of SUCCESS, and the ability to exist successfully while navigating two worlds. They offer to other white students examples, of well-to-do, well-educated non-white students - the kind of which many well-educated, well-to-do white students may not have ever met in their entire lives? Doesn’t replace poor ones, and doesn’t increase economic diversity, but I don’t think you give credit where credit is due. (As to whether they should have received “scholarships”, that’s simply a recruitment matter in a competitive marketplace. Yale has scholarships for gay and lesbian students after the first year. Middlebury isn’t proposing to offer any.) </p>
<p>“Where did Yale say they are giving a true edge to gay kids?”</p>
<p>They didn’t have to. They set up their mission, admissions, and academic program in such a way that they’d get them anyway. In very large numbers. Took 'em maybe 20 years, and the leadership of John Boswell, a huge anonymous contribution to create the Research Fund for Lesbian and Gay Studies in 1992, and multi-million dollar donations from alumnus Larry Kramer. Then it took creation of a critical mass of both students and faculty. Middlebury should only be so lucky.</p>
<p>“Meanwhile, I live in a region with some really hurting rural, predominantly white, high schools. They have cut languages, music, AP courses, you name it. Where are the scholarships for those kids?”</p>
<p>Don’t you think that colleges (especially the top ones) take into consideration that a student is coming from a rich or poor area (say New England vs. Appalachia)? I’m also not opposed to the idea of treating these applicants differently, given the fewer opportunities they are exposed to in high school. As you know, many top colleges have now been actively seeking out such students through financial incentives and such.</p>
<p>My position on this issue is not firm yet. Maybe Middlebury should simply find ways to attract more gay applicants but not necessarily give them an automatic boost in admissions? I think they should decide on a case-by-case basis, since some gay applicants will be more interesting than others, some will be more involved than others, etc., although I would argue that, on the whole, their outlook on life are likely to be different from that of heterosexuals.</p>