<p>Just to be clear, I am NOT saying this is how most Asians act. Far from it. </p>
<p>I am saying that people seem to tolerate it as a cultural thing from some people in that community. Would it be so easliy accepted from other groups? I doubt it.</p>
<p>citygirlsmom,
It’s the same culture that don’t trust police(don’t report crime) and don’t trust bank(store money in mattress). That is why some Asian gangs know this and take advantage of it.
Other than that we’re perfect!(j/k)</p>
<p>Oh gosh. It’s not about tolerating abuse. It is about giving a young girl (I believe she is a girl) the right advice to deal with what sounds like a very very painful situation. To give advice in a painful situation you have to consider context. There is nothing wrong with saying " In the northern california culture we do not believe it is OK for a mother to say these things to a child. We believe you don’t have to internalize what she is saying to you". It is another thing altogether to tell a child that her mother is wrong. Are you familiar with the studies that show even abused children would rather be with their mothers than apart?</p>
<p>Like it or not our children for the most part are fated to love us. Like it or not children will love even those parents who to us might appear shaming or cruel. Like it or not it is very hard to leave our culture of origin behind. So what advice do we give to a child from another culture? How to help? Just telling someone their mother is wrong may not help. </p>
<p>It is our responsibility to give advice carefully. Support the child. Let them know alternatives exist. Hi Casper, alternatives exist. Your mom loves you. </p>
<p>Do not take a ray gun to family or culture. That is all.</p>
<p>Many people on this thread said that they could understand the behavior of the mother because she was Asian. I never brought up race until others did. Read my posts. I only talked about race when it was used as a possible reason for the reaction of the mother. It was not me who brought up the subject. I just pointed out that it was not a valid justification or excuse for such treatment of a child. My point was to not accept behavior because it is what is done in a certain culture. I did not slam Asians. I said that saying its an Asian way as a way to explain away behavior is not right. I said that bad behavior is bad behavior REGARDLESS of race. And to accept it from one person because of their race and culture is wrong.</p>
<p>There are some pretty ugly things done to children because of “culture”. And to just say, well, its their culture so we should be more tolertate is just wrong. The Irish put young girls in virtual slavery in this century because of culture. And, being Irish, I am disgusted by it. If it was still going on, I would fight it.</p>
<p>It may help saying the mother is wrong. Otherwise, a child might think there is something wrong with them. And they will not know when the behavior has crossed the line.</p>
<p>Read my posts. I DISLIKED the fact that people thought race or culture was an excuse. Its great how we pick and choose what is tolerable due to race. </p>
<p>I find it suprising in this enlightened age people would say, well, its your heritage so deal.</p>
<p>Bowing out.</p>
<p>I don’t think I bought up race but culture. Go see these 2 movies:
<p>1) Do you think the father is not supportive of the daughter, is he being being cruel for putting down the daughter?
2) Is the mother overbearing, money hungry and cruel to the daughter for making her daughter marry some one her daughter does not like?</p>
<p>May be in these culture it’s ok for parents not to be supportive(I know it’s not ideal parenting) but is it cruel?
Can one express disappointment in one kid’s choice?</p>
<p>Yes, they can, but not to the point of crying all the time, saying the to Casper what was said. HUGE difference . PS- Big fat greek wedding, ADULT WOMAN…and for the second movie, are you saying it is right to make the Daughter marry someone she does not like? That is right?</p>
<p>Not being supportive is one thing,but (this is from Casper) “tz getting very serious cuz my mom lately gets sick a lot. She used to be very nice and supportive but now the opposite. Many times she has threatened to die saying that I don’t listen to her but I think i know it all n do whatever i want. I’m not the type of teenager who thinks I know it all n i love my family n respect my parents. But I can’t listen to her on this.” Threatening to DIE goes way beyond not being supportive. Read the othe Casper posts. </p>
<p>Expressing dispointment is one thing, doing what Caspers mom is doing is beyond that.</p>
<p>CGM,</p>
<p>I agree that the mother’s behavior is absolutely wrong. I called it wrong too.</p>
<p>Alum,</p>
<p>I agree that this is her mom, there is a cultural context and OP needs to deal with her family from a place of understanding.</p>
<p>Both points of view can coexist. One can be nice & understanding to someone who is just plain wrong. Not mutually exclusive.</p>
<p>Knowing your parents have wronged you is one of the best ways to make sure not to repeat the pattern with your own kids.</p>
<p>Thank you, cheers.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>From my post, (since you posted below me, I was wondering if my post influenced yours), I don’t understand what is wrong with saying that I have an understanding of Casper’s mother because I am Asian myself? The way Casper’s mother acts is not abnormal in the Asian culture, or at least from what I have lived through. </p>
<p>No way did I say this EXCUSES her actions. I understand her mother because I see it in my own, I acknowledge that these actions occur. </p>
<p>No one is saying “lie down in the road and let your culture roll over you.” </p>
<p>Moreover, it’s more of a “I’ve been there, and this is how I dealt with it.” </p>
<p>I have lots to argue, but I don’t believe in debating when my emotions are taking control. It clouds my judgement. </p>
<p>So, I’m just going to end my post by giving my best wishes to Casper-- if you ever need someone to talk to, PM me. :)</p>
<p>Edit: Sorry, I was writing this in quick reply and didn’t send it soon enough. Four people beat me! </p>
<p>But I wanted to add that: I think Casper understands that her mother’s actions are not what they should be. I think right now its more of coping with it and living with it, rather then educating right from wrong.</p>
<p>Citygirlsmom,
Calm down. That is why I think it’s a culture thing. For example, in Vietnamese culture it is not such a big deal to call somebody stupid, I know a couple that they call each other stupid every 5 minutes and they are still very happily married today. While in western culture/hispanic culture it’s taken very seriously. I know my husband would be very offended If I said that everyday.
While some Vietnamese would feel offended if being callled Crazy or “mat day” meaning your family did not bring you up properly, it usually refers to single mom or children born out of wedlock.
I don’t know how serious Casper’s mom was when said she want to die, but may be she means her soul/hope is dying because she does not like what Casper going to study or may be she could also be sick physically. Or sometimes it’s just loose talk/complaint/nag.
I know people who says to their kids “I’m going to kill you if you don’t do homework” and I often scolded them NOT to say such things because it’s terrible/wrong but I don’t think I should take them literally.Sometimes when you hear this sort of loose talk, the best thing is to tell the person that is not right and not to repeat such thing again.
In this case, it’s best to calm things down and not fuel the emotion on either way.</p>
<p>Wow i got a lot of suggestions. Thank you again!
I came to the US with my family so I do understand the culture and the way it works.
My family isn’t into politics and although we lived in vietnam we didn’t care much about the past. It is very interesting to know that Vietnamese living in the US cares more about the past than the ones in VIetnam. In Vietnam, they care more about living a comfortable life rather than grieving the past.
I believe gradually my mom would understand. @ least it’s how it was with my dad. @ first he was like my mom but better. After I explained to him, he gradually approved of my decision. When he heard I also consider premed, he told my mom: “she’s going to premed, isn’ it what you want?”
They both think my personalities don’t fit to be a psychologist. THey think i’m simple and carefree which isn’t true at all. This also shows how many parents think they knwo their kids and teenagers don’t know anything. But since I’m so adamant about majoring in psychology, I think my dad’s realizing I’m not as simple as he thinks. It’s getting better slowly with my dad. I dont know about my mom because her pride is very important and even if she agrees with me she wouldn’t say it.
Again, Thank you for so many helpful advices.</p>
<p>It’s great your Dad is coming around. Let him work on your Mom while you enjoy college!</p>
<p>" I feel if i can ever be a good psychologist, y can’t i deal with these problems?"</p>
<p>Many people go into the mental health field because they grew up in families with problems and were not able to help their families.</p>
<p>One can’t judge one’s talent for being a mental health practitioner by whether one can help one’s family with their difficulties. It is impossible for children to solve their parents’ emotional problems. Even adult children with doctorates in psychology can only offer a limited amount of help with their parents’ emotional problems. They can’t be their parents’ therapists.</p>
<p>One of my closest friends is a respected psychologist who is the daughter of two Holocaust survivors who immigrated to the US after the war. My friend was born here.</p>
<p>My friends parents didn’t get along, and my friend suffered with being caught between her parents’ culture and American culture and having difficulty getting along with her mom, who very depressed and as a result, was a hard person to get along with. </p>
<p>Even as a middle aged adult, my friend, who is a really sweet person who is an excellent clinician, would get into screaming battles with her mom. My friend was in therapy to help her with her own emotional problems (it’s a myth that therapists are perfectly healthy. Everyone has their problems. Therapists are simply more likely to realize they need help and to get help) including her problems with her mom.</p>
<p>The therapy helped my friend improve her own emotional problems and helped her improve her relationship with her mom, but she could not get her very depressed mom into therapy or help her mom lead a truly happier life. It simply is not possible for us to be that responsible for other peoples’ lives. </p>
<p>It may be difficult for you now to get therapy to help you cope with your relationship with your mom and figure out how to handle the decisions you’ll eventually need to make about your life. When you go to college, though, you will have access to the college’s counseling center, which I hope you’ll use. </p>
<p>The difficulties you’re experiencing – feeling torn between wanting to follow your own desires and your immigrant mom’s desires – are common in children of immigrants, and many college counseling centers have the experience to help students sort through these dilemmas and figure out their place in a culture that’s new to their family.</p>
<p>I agree w/ everything northstarmom just said.
I’m currently going to a psychologist myself (w/out my parents knowing) to seek help coping w/ all these family problems and others. I realized my other problems rooted since childhood and relate to my mom 
My psychologist also came from a broken family and she told me thats y she wanted to become a psychologist.
I guess it would have been a lot easier if my mom’s health hasn’t gotten worse.
My mom listens to my relatives (who’ve lived in the US for over 20 years). Even so, my relatives always push my mom to tell me to major in something good RIGHT AWAY when i get in college. They all expect me to major in bio (to them the only stable major that makes $$) and not to waste anytime on anything else (can’t double major). THey have many misconceptions and don’t know many facts related to college.
It’s very hard when half of my cousins are doctors/dentist/pharmacist. Everytime my mom talks about them she feels their moms are so lucky!
To her those careers are the best or something.
Despite the fact that half my cousins are drop outs, my mom only focuses on the other half who are doctors dentists… or the recent 1 who got into UCBerkeley…she thinks she’s very unfortunate to have a daughter like me who doesnt care at all about her. I was raised to not show love by hugging or saying: I love you (Asian culture) so although i love my parents, it’s hard to show. N even if i do that, it’d be awkward for them.
My family especially hates school counselors becuz they think school counselors brainwash kids like me with western ideas and not listen to Asian parents >.<</p>
<p>I am glad to hear that you have found a way to get help for yourself.</p>
<p>Is it possible for you to ask your relatives who are doctors/dentists to encourage your mom to see a doctor for herself? Since she esteems them so much, perhaps she’d follow their advice. </p>
<p>An Asian student whom I encountered had some similar problems with her mom. The student told me that to demonstrate her love to her mom, she’d make a point of doing chores along with her mom, such as helping to chop vegetables for dinner, or pitching in in other ways without being asked.</p>
<p>The other thing that the student did was acknowedging her mom’s concern and interest in the student’s getting a good education. One can do this without promising that one will do exactly what the parent wants. Sometimes parents will back off if one says something like, “I appreciate it that you want me to be in a well paying career so I won’t have to struggle.” Then, it’s good to change the subject to a neutral one.</p>
<p>“My family especially hates school counselors becuz they think school counselors brainwash kids like me with western ideas and not listen to Asian parents.”</p>
<p>Painful as this is, it is not unusual for immigrant parents to feel this way. Parents come here to have a better life for themselves and their kids, and then are surprised to learn that in having a “better life,” their children also will leave behind some aspects of the old culture that the parents treasure.</p>
<p>Casper:</p>
<p>Your dad’s coming around is the best illustration that your best ally is time. Time for your mom to get used to the idea of your going to UCI and time to think there are many ways of being premed. As I suggested, just remember that you won’t be required to choose a major until your second year in college. You can tell your mom that you will of course take her wishes seriously but that you will also need to consult with profs about required courses, etc… Best of all, let it ride. Your mom will come around, just like your dad.</p>
<p>Casper, I am carryng good thoughts for you and praying that it works out best according to what you are planning for yourself. From experience, I know moms can be overbearing. I am talking about myself not my mom. but twenty years from now it will be about the choices you made, not the ones you let get made for you. I am so happy you came to this board. These parents are incredible and have offered so much to me, i know you will pick up some good advice for you.</p>
<p>Casper -
“I was raised to not show love by hugging or saying: I love you (Asian culture) so although i love my parents, it’s hard to show. N even if i do that, it’d be awkward for them.”</p>
<p>Could you write each of them a thank-you note, poem or card honoring your upbringing and their giving you the opportunity to attend a fine university? Don’t know if you would dare use the ‘L’ word, but sometimes the written word squeaks through better than the spoken.</p>
<p>I guess I got wound up, I do that when a young person is hurting. It must be a matter of semantics: when we use the word “understandable” it can mean accept or sympathize with, not just be aware of…so to me, when I read the word understand/undestandable, it can imply acceptance and tolerance. So I went from there. I also worry when old ways of doing things are used so something can be “understandable”. </p>
<p>My other point is that even if the mom was only saying “I am going to die”, the effect was very profound on Casper. So mom’s seeming uncariing of the consequences of her words was worrisome. Casper reacted very strongly to mom’s actions, so even if mom was being flip, from Casper’s postings, it was more than that to him/her. It was much more. A child’s reactions to a parents words are very telling. My other point was that just because that is how people treat people, doesn’t make it “understandable”. And, to tell a child, will, I understand your mom, to a child, that can mean I get her, I have had that experience, OR, I tolerate and sympathize with her.</p>
<p>I am glad Casper is getting some guidance. Parents here are very smart.</p>
<p>cgm,
my mom prepared for her demise a couple of times a year the last twenty-five years. She was finally right last year - at 89. It distressed me, too, but I sort of got used to it. Not asian, though - Russian. Kind of like growing up in a Russian novel. I did get her to talk to her doctor after her brother died, and it did help a bit.</p>