<p>well, yeah, sonofopie-, I am well aware of that.</p>
<p>Actually, Son of Opie, I think other drugs can possibly affect the urge to push. I had Demerol with my first and I had trouble pushing. I’m not sure if it was the demerol or just me – I felt everything, but just had trouble getting the hang of it. Also, I think some women kind of freak out from the pain and really need to be coached to push. It does take a certain amount of focus in its own way.</p>
<p>At one point during labor, the epidural was so effective, the only way I knew I was having a contraction was by watching the monitor. That said, they had coordinated the timing and the dosage such that it was wearing off when it was time to push. I felt it and was able to participate and enjoy the delivery without being miaserable and in major pain. That was, at least for me, the way to go.</p>
<p>Check out the ads on this page. Kind of scary how closely we are tracked.</p>
<p>Interesting ads. I want my free belly bag. Dunno what it is, but its free. I want one.</p>
<p>***** ewww. I just googled it. No thanks!! Don’t need it, don’t want it. First link brought up a photo of an incontinent male playing tennis or something. Not quite sure. I closed the link too quickly to know fo rsure.!</p>
<p>Wait, how did you know he was incontinent? Never mind…</p>
<p>I walked to the hospital (a block away) to deliver our 1st child. The second one we walked down from the 6th floor to the ground (the power was out & elevator wasn’t working). </p>
<p>I think it’s very selfish for parents not to put their infant’s needs 1st and have the baby where there is trained staff and medical professionals & equipment to handle whatever MAY come up. Both of my kids’ births were pretty uncomplicated but the doc ended up making an episiodomy & sewing it up for each birth. Would not want to forgo that interention & risk a nasty & painful tear. </p>
<p>Wonder how the families would feel when things go badly awry & mom and/or baby suffer very bad consequences & possibly death due to poor decisions about where baby should be born.</p>
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<p>Haha, same with my son. He was 5 days before the due date, and that was the last time. 'Course, the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree. Now at the ripe old age of 50, my periods are finally coming at regular intervals. I think my body has realized that there’s a deadline for squeezing all those eggs out and we are behind.</p>
<p>I agree with INFORMED choice. The trouble is that most do not learn enough to be truly informed, there is a reason obstetricians do an entire OB/GYN residency after medical school. Medicine is full of “except for exceptions” and other qualifiers in making judgements. This forum is not the place to deal with all of the pro/con epidural and episiotomy arguments since there far too many reasons to do/not do either based on specific patients and conditions at the time. </p>
<p>A feeling of empowerment comes with knowing who you are- there is no reason to be intimidated by the world of hospitals and medical procedures even if those are not your area of expertise. Or- is it that knowledge is power, therefore become informed.</p>
<p>A lot of interesting anecdotal stories. All of us are parents and therefore have our pregnancy/birth (or adoption) stories to tell if we choose.</p>
<p>Right. The woman who chose no pre-natal care was not operating on the basis of informed choice. (shudder)</p>
<p>My daughter gave birth about a month ago and she reports they are not doing routine episiotomies anymore. I was amazed.</p>
<p>^^^ While reading this thread, I’ve been wondering what the routine procedures are these days. Glad to hear that episiotomies aren’t routine. I imagine they’re performed when necessary, which is a whole different thing. If it’s necessary, why object?</p>
<p>When #1 was born in 1983, it was a big deal not to be shaved when you were admitted. :rolleyes: And I knew I had a lemon in my OB with #2, when I told him I didn’t want to be shaved and he was startled, then said, “Oh, but it makes it so much easier for me to repair your episiotomy.” Reminded him that I didn’t want a routine episiotomy, to which he said, “Oh, everyone says that, but everyone gets one.” How did I wind up with this guy? His partner, who’d been my OB, retired when I was 6 months along. Dh and I discussed making a change at that point, but that would have been difficult for a lot of reasons. And then the 3rd partner, who turned out to be a great doc, delivered the baby (without episiotomy).</p>
<p>Dr. Lemon did not earn my affection when I asked how long it might take him to get in to the hospital, since he lived in a far-off suburb. He essentially said “Don’t worry. If I’m not there when it’s time to push, we’ll have you on an IV and you’ll puff till I get there.” (To which I thought, “Really? Puff yourself.” 
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In some areas - yes. In other areas - sadly no. It all depends on the “culture” of each hospital. Finally residents are being taught the technique of delivering a baby over an intact perineum. Yes, there is a technique.</p>
<p>wis75 - can a woman plan for every possible “event”? No. That is why she chooses a midwife or physician for care. But that is not informed choice. Informed choice is a woman and her provider having a discussion about possibilities - ahead of time. This discussion should revolve around - such things as - the risks/benefits of induced labor, continuous fetal heart monitoring, episiotomy, anesthesia and other medicines used in labor.
Did you ever witness a ob explaining to a laboring mom and the babies father the risks of demerol in labor? the risks of confinement in bed? the risk of a pitocin IV drip?
Moreover, there is a huge difference between routine interventions and necessary interventions. OB’s have a reputation of turning many interventions into <em>necessary</em> ones, making them routine.
I realize that episiotomies are sometimes necessary. Epidurals and even demerol is sometimes necessary. C-sections save lives of moms and babies. What happens sometimes is that women’s desires are patronized or totally ignored.
When an OB tells you with a straight face that no birth is a <em>normal</em> birth - it’s time to scratch your head and wonder how the human race got this far and run to another OB.</p>
<p>“Women who don’t get epidurals can’t NOT push the whole time, because they feel EVERYTHING.” </p>
<p>I had the experience of NOT pushing (w/o epidural) during the “urge.” This happened on several deliveries–the nurse was telling me to push, and I said, “No, I’ll wait for the next contraction.” I needed to gather my strength and willpower for a good push, and sometimes I just wasn’t ready. For me, pushing was the most difficult and painful time–I didn’t want to do it. Sitting through the “urge” was, for me, easier than pushing. </p>
<p>OTOH, telling a woman, “Don’t push” when she is at the point of delivery is–well, only a man could think of something like that. When my friend was having her 3rd kid, a new/shy intern told her to “puff” and wait for the doc. My friend yelled at him, “You’re a doctor, aren’t you? Get over here and catch this baby!” And he did. (Yes, Ma’am!)</p>
<p>Routine episiotomies (I had two) went out sometime in the early/mid 90s (studies showed they did more harm than good)–though they will still do them if “necessary.” Of course, they are most often determined “necessary” on first-timers.
Another innovation since the 80s–stretchy disposable underwear replaced those awkward “belts.”</p>
<p>I found this in an article from 2005 that compares episiotomy to genital mutilation.</p>
<p>“The number of episiotomies began to decrease in the United States in the 1980s when studies started raising questions about their value. But the procedure is still estimated to be performed in about one-third of all vaginal births – more than 1 million of the estimated 4.2 million vaginal births that occur each year, making it more common than hysterectomies and Caesarean section deliveries. The rate varies widely around the country, but overall about 70 to 80 percent of first-time mothers undergo episiotomies.”</p>
<p>I have no statistics or evidence, but my personal experience was that the women who delivered babies 2 and 3 were incredibly receptive to my wishes and spent a lot of time talking about various risks and interventions. In the case of baby 2, the doctor sat with me and we hung around watching Oprah while I labored with no drugs. Birth was beautiful. Started out the same way with baby 3, but his position required some assistance. I shudder to think what would have become of us without that help available. Doctor for baby 1 was a youngish man (very nice) who hung around with my hubbby and his best buddy the anesthesiologist discussing football. I felt like an interloper in that birth and it was the least successful in terms of outcome (baby ended up in NICU for a couple of days) and recovery. Purely anecdotal, of course, but I do wonder.</p>
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<p>How did the human race get this far? Well, it’s pretty easy to have a high rate of natural “wastage” in birth, and the human race still survive, mathematically. If I had 4 pregnancies and 2 babies died, that’s a high rate of wastage … but I’m still perpetuating my genes. The argument that “it must not be dangerous, because the human race is still here and if it weren’t, we’d be extinct” is something that a smart high school kid skilled in stats could easily debunk.</p>
<p>No birth can be guaranteed to be a “normal” one except in retrospect, when it’s all over.</p>
<p>I don’t think I support the concept but I do like what has happened in the past twenty years. My first child was born before labor/delivery rooms. I was flat on my back, shot full of Pitocin, totally internally monitored, shifted to a cart at the most critical point, wheeled down to an operating room, had an episiotomy, oxygen mask over the face and literally had one of those suction cup things used to retrieve him. No pain killers or anything but the Pitocin…that was the only good part. I knew my body wasn’t ready to deliver but that was SOP if your water broke…you had x amount of time to get that baby out regardless of anything. I swore that would never happen again. Next time my water broke, the labor/delivery rooms were in use and I sat up which is far more comfortable for me, no drugs, no internal monitors, no rushing to get the delivery over, no episiotomy, no drugs and everything went pretty smoothly although there were people “barking” orders and “shouting 1,2,3,4,5 etc.” and “positioning my body for their maximum convenience” which was anoying. By the third time, my water broke again, and they asked me what was more comfortable, what I wanted to do, let me walk around, and when I was ready for delivery and they let me go until I was ready regardless of the fact that my water had broke, actually asked me what position was more comfortable and no yelling of “1,2,3,4 etc.” They asked if it was OK to give me Pitocin and I said after the baby is born and they said OK. So I think we’ve come along way. Because I’ve had three kids and friends who have had stillborn children and other birthing issues I doubt I’d want to be home alone, but to be in a medical facility and still be able to control the experience based on my knowledge of how my body works is ideal to me. Thanks for the memories!</p>
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<p>Not commenting on your situation specifically, but the risk of infection does go up after one’s water breaks – you can’t walk around indefinitely with water broken.</p>
<p>^^^ This was my situation back in 1983 - we were told 24 hours, no leeway. I understand that the rule became less rigid shortly after d1 was born. Also understand that the rate of infection goes down with fewer internal exams during labor? This per my current GYN, who is probably also a great OB, though I’m glad I’ll never have the opportunity to find out. :)</p>
<p>Gawd, I’m so glad this is all behind me.</p>