<p>There are certain things in which the constitution attempts to protect the rights of the minority from the tyranny of the majority, and religion is one of them. Thankfully.</p>
<p>If it had been put to a vote of the citizens of North Carolina, do you think that blacks would be allowed to vote, or be free of Jim Crow laws? When do you think they would have ceased to be enslaved if left to a vote of the citizens of that state? I don’t mean to pick on North Carolina, in particular. Although it did send that beacon of human rights, Jesse Helms, to Congress for a long time, it is certainly not the only place where the popular vote would have obstructed what we now consider to be basic civil rights. </p>
<p>No one is preventing the citizens of North Carolina from erecting Christmas trees and manger scenes–or light up menorahs for that matter–on their own property.</p>
<p>One of the ironies of all this is, of course, that the date of “Christmas” was pegged to that of existing pagan celebrations in order to help with proselytizing. Or so they say. Another interesting factoid is that it the early religious colonies in New England, they were too puritanical and didn’t celebrate Christmas.</p>
<p>Yes, that is the irony of “Christmas” trees. They were invented by non-Christian pagans, during the celebration of Yule - the Winter Solstice. And there are some Christian factions who refuse to display trees because they are considered to be pagan symbols, and are apparently expressly prohibited by interpretation of some section of the new testament.</p>
<p>In West Chester, PA, the Freethought Society has mounted an alternative tree, the “Tree of Knowledge.”
From [Taking</a> the Christ out of Christmas - philadelphia weekly online](<a href=“http://www.philadelphiaweekly.com/articles/16080]Taking”>Taking the Christ out of Christmas - Philadelphia Weekly)
"But now it has the tree of knowledge—festooned with gold-sprayed pinecones and laminated color copies of book covers—for company. Some of the authors and titles are predictable: Richard Dawkins, Thomas Paine, Mark Twain, Christopher Hitchens. Others not so much, like the Bible and the Koran—both essential reading for anyone who wants to see how daft religion is, says Freethought Society president Margaret Downey.</p>
<p>I haven’t read the article but to me it is a waste of college resources to display trees. The students have almost all left the campuses by Dec. 25. They don’t need campus trees to remind them of the season. When I lived in a college dorm with 2 roomates (1 Catholic, 1 Protestant and 1 Jew) we put bell shapes on the door and called ourselves the belles.</p>
<p>My town has a really hideous display on the grounds of the municipal building. Flat wooden cutouts of santas and candy canes and toy soldiers and reindeer all mixed together. In the middle is a 3 dimensional plastic manger. Ugly, ugly. When Hanukkah begins, a wooden menorah is added. I don’t see the need for any of this. There is a tree lighting celebration somewhere, too. To me a few white lights and evergreen ropes would look nice and shouldn’t be offensive if it’s just a winter solstice display. Of course, that could be interpreted as pagan.</p>
<p>Jman–I agree red & green are not generally flattering as a color scheme. A Crate & Barrel store just opened near us, and I was excited about going in for the first time, but the ENTIRE store is only red and green items, accented with more red and green (and gold and silver.) Yech.</p>
<p>I don’t care whether they put up a tree or not – a Christmas tree has nothing to do with Christianity. It is not a “religious” symbol in any shape or form, and has no religious meaning to Christians. Christians do not worship trees. It comes from a pagan tradition and remains representative of that. That people are unable to distinguish a tree from religion seems part of the problem. As Bay mentioned earlier in this thread, Christmas trees are nothing more than part of a holiday tradition. Thus, there is no church and state issue to be made here with the possible exception of the Wiggans, who, I somehow doubt is the target.</p>
<p>From what I understand, the Christmas tree was developed from Yule Logs, which were a Pagan tradition. </p>
<p>I don’t see a problem with having Christmas trees in universities. There are a bunch of Christmas trees in our Administration building, and little plush figures of our mascots with Santa hats on. No one ever complains to the best of my knowledge.</p>
<p>The menorah is next to the creche – outside over there on the (privately owned) green.</p>
<p>I’ve got trees and dreidels here, in organic catnip toys, also red and green snowmen with squeakers for the dogs, blue and white santa toss toys along with the rainbow reindeer. Ok so those are dog and cat toys – it’s the spirit of the season – peace hope and love that we want to promote. </p>
<p>For peace – try a rawhide crunchy during dinner. </p>
<p>(I think I have been running the pet shop for too many Christmases)</p>
<p>When I was growing up, for some reason the associate pastor at my church always had the task of delivering the sermon decrying the commercialization of Christmas. As a result of his efforts, I have always looked with a jaundiced eye on Santa, Christmas trees, store promotions based on Christmas, etc. (while participating in all of it). So I would argue that perhaps Christians should object to public institutions promoting the secular elements of Christmas, as further distractions from the religious basis of the holiday. In other words, the idea that the Christmas tree isn’t really a religious symbol is a reason to take it out of the college library, not a reason to leave it in.</p>
<p>Im not a big fan of religion. I think the separation of church and state is one of the most important tenets of our system of government.</p>
<p>That said, I love Christmas. I love the decorations, Santa Claus, Christmas trees, the whole shebang. I love seeing symbols of the holiday all over the place. Its fun. I dont care if Christmas is materialistic or religious or whatever each person wants to make it. But I wish all the politically correct out there would stop trying to 86 Christmas from the public arena. In America we celebrate Christmas. Celebrate it your own way, or no way if thats your choice, but its an American tradition, and I dont see why we all cant just accept it as that, without trying to turn it into a political football. </p>
<p>Why not work on changing the things that really hurt people. I dont see that Christmas trees should be high on that list.</p>
<p>Acknowledging that Christmas isn’t a tradition of all Americans isn’t engaging in “political football.” Christmas is not, has never been, and never will be my holiday, but I am an American. You don’t think Christmas trees can hurt people? It damn well hurts to feel alienated and excluded because public entities are pretending you don’t exist and acting like Christmas is universal. I’m glad you love Christmas; I hate it. I don’t begrudge my friends and family who enjoy it, but I do wish I wasn’t bombarded with it for months. The least we can do as a society is not allow exclusive, alienating displays that privilege one faith and one tradition over others to be funded with public money on public property.</p>
<p>See, I don’t understand the feelings of alienation and exclusion. Maybe it’s because religion is meaningless to me, so I don’t really feel like I’m being excluded from someone else’s religion. But I don’t think anyone is excluded from Christmas. You can do the tree & gifts or not do the tree & gifts, or whatever you decide. </p>
<p>It’s like Easter for me. I dont get Easter; it means nothing to me. But I always do the Easter bunny thing with my kids, and we have fun with it. I dont feel alienated or excluded, I just take it for what it is to me, a reason to have a little fun in life. Chocolate, bunnies, and my kids get a week off from school; it’s all good. </p>
<p>I guess I could make it so that I feel bad about Easter, but I don’t see how that would be a good thing.</p>
<p>blankmind, I’m not particularly religious, but I was raised Jewish and Christmas isn’t part of my tradition. If you were raised with Christmas as a part of your tradition, then I’m sure it seems innocuous to you, but it doesn’t feel that way to me and many others who are religious and cultural minorities in this country. It’s not a matter of “making it so that I feel bad,” it’s that I have different traditions and celebrations and I don’t like being treated like I’m less-than because of that.</p>
<p>“I have a Jewish friend who buys a tree every year and decorates it beautifully, all in blue”</p>
<p>Oy vey…and she calls it a “Chanukah Bush” right?</p>
<p>You know what…? we live in a Christian country; Christmas trees and all…but don’t tell me that I’m supposed to decorate my house with a “blue-decorated tree” if I don’t celebrate Christmas…if you are jealous of the traditions, you can always convert…</p>
<p>Yes, I am Jewish…but I think it’s ridiculous to have UNC eliminate Christmas trees when I think their student population is probably 95% Christian…wonder what the Hillel people would say…</p>