What hypocrisy, these jobs are going the way bank teller jobs have been going, I mean disappearing.
^Not sure if you were questioning my comment or humorously agreeing with me, Google, lol
I was merely referring to the fact that SF is generally a progressive city (pro-workers rights, anti-corporations, etc), which is why is surprises me that a company which blatantly replaces workers with computers is such a big hit there.
The unexpected consequences are starting to make themselves known. Although not a fast food place it is a sign of things to come.
Is the end of tipping coming our way? That would be a relief.
Really, though, is it actually all that wrong for a Big Mac to cost (insert random number here—maybe $5?), if that’s what it costs while (a) paying the workers at McDonald’s a living wage and (b) not offloading some of the benefits costs of those workers onto the federal and state welfare systems?
So if you tip about 15%, in effect the price is only going up about 6%? That’s not awful I suppose.
I’ve missed the discussion - is this minimum something that applies only to fast food workers or all workers, and if so why?
Big Macs are not Hermes Birkin bags. When the price of a Big Mac goes up, the market demand for them goes down.
I don’t know that it’d be a Bad Thing for demand for Big Macs to drop, really.
But I suppose that’s just me.
The people that run SF are progressive. But in general people still vote with their pocket and time. No hypocrisy there.
Do you want jobs for fast food workers, or don’t you?
I guess not.
@GMTplus7: Well, given the working conditions for fast-food workers, I’d like them to have jobs in a different sector.
That said, wages don’t have a clear inverse correlation with job availability. Yes, there’s almost certainly an effect at some extreme somewhere, but every time industry has claimed the number-of-jobs sky is falling because the minimum wage was increasing, the sky has stubbornly remained in place. In fact, many periods of job declines have occurred amidst long stretches of stagnant minimum wages. So I hope you’ll excuse me for not believing an increase in the minimum wage will suddenly result in all sorts of jobs suddenly vanishing with no hope of any sort of replacement for those positions.
Should we expect a lawsuit from the NY fast-food industry? Can just one industry be singled out for a minimum wage hike? I am not a lawyer but this seems unfair.
The last sushi restaurant i ate in had a touch-screen menu and an automated train that delivered the plate of fish to my table.
Yes, there's almost certainly an effect at some extreme somewhere, but every time industry has claimed the number-of-jobs sky is falling because the minimum wage was increasing, the sky has stubbornly remained in place.
@dfbdfb, but usually those wage increases are modest compared to what is being considered now (a 50%+ increase).
If the final goal is $15 in metropolitan areas (and maybe $12 in rural…), it should be increased in stages to allow markets to adjust without crashing.
For example:
- Businesses will be better able to deal with gradual and relatively lower cost increases: figuring out how to cut cost elsewhere to make up the difference in increased labor cost; or concentrating less on cost, keeping prices constant while engaging in improved promotion to drive sales; or raising prices relatively less, to offset the relatively modest cost increase. This all presumes they continue employing the same number of associates and for the same weekly hours; some firms might cut a job or two and implement process improvements to retain production levels.
- Consumers will be more likely to stick with a product if price increases gradually rather than sharply: if you throw a frog into boiling water, it will try to jump out; but if you put the frog into a pot of lukewarm water and heat the water slowly, the frog will remain calm as the water temp rises (or so I have heard). I have heard it said that paying those workers more means they will be able to buy more product; but i’m not sure that would make a difference in the fast food sector, since it’s possible (likely?) that it’s already the lower classes who are McDonald’s customers. They might buy more, of course, or more expensive menu items, with the increase in income… but we still need to be wary of the effect on the demand of those who are not going to benefit from the wage increase. So – i think gradual price increases (if any) are the way to go, and gradual wage increases might allow for that pricing strategy.
The worst-case scenario is this:
- Ownership cuts hours or jobs
- Business is unable to meet production demand
- Customer wait time increases, leading to queue backups
- Customers finally lose interest - who wants to wait for fast food? - and business folds
- employees in different fields currently making $10-$14 will quit their jobs to become fast-food workers
- $15/hr wage will attract college students or even college graduates who will displace current workers
For this kind of compensation the employers can be really picky.
When I compare workers at our regular chain supermarket with the Trader Joe’s employees I can clearly see the difference. It seems TJ employees are required to “socialize” with the customers and keep a happy demeanor at all times. They are more presentable with better social skills and I assume much better compensated.
Which system has been available in Japan for decades now, and is on its way here with or without any increases in the minimum wage.
Like I said earlier, I just don’t see the clear connection between minimum wage increases and decreased job availability. Yes, there are theoretical edge cases (and a nod is due to @prezbucky #254 here, even though I’m still not convinced that the proposed increase is of a magnitude that would lead to such a disruption), but in general minimum wage levels and employment rates (even limiting the view to the low-income end) appear to me to move pretty much independently.
Technology is already replacing a lot of people including waiter, not just fast food worker.
Olive Garden only has waiter to take your order but when it comes time to pay bill, there is already an electronic payment at your table. There is no need to wait for a waiter.
It’s hard to imagine there being a huge dip in demand due to the price of a double cheeseburger increasing from $1.39 to $1.49 – from $1.39 to $1.79 or $1.99, maybe, but not 10 cents. So – it might work to simply (modestly) raise prices to offset the increase in labor cost. We’ll see.
It’s not just the wages that increase. It is also all of the expenses that are tied to wages. Matching payroll taxes (7.65% of wages), workers compensation, and unemployment compensation. If wages go up 25% so do those costs.