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I think Ken was on the BoD of Ford, so he probably got the employee discount. He drove a Ford Tempo for many years too, I saw it all the time when I worked at the Mill.</p>
<p>I used DEC computers for years, and loved them. It was a nice company. I knew a number of people who worked there and they were all happy.</p>
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<p>In parts of the NE, you buy the volvo right before you bring the baby home from the hospital and that is the car you use to move the same baby to college. Sometimes the baby gets to have the volvo for college, depending on number of sibs.</p>
<p>I thought Volvos were looked down on by the upper class…too boring a car…</p>
<p>(I have nothing against Volvos…)</p>
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<p>dstark, I have watched you make excuse after excuse for people who walk away from loans. You blame the lenders instead of them for their personal failure to pay their mortgages. You should be consistent. You seem to excited to see rich people fail. When those rich people fail, they tend to pay less taxes, layoff their employees (oh wait, I guess I need to refer to them as servants) and experience significant personal trauma. You refer to the hedge fund guys as lazy. I doubt there is even one of them who is lazy. I don’t like it when anyone does not pay his or her debts. I always pay mine and I do without to avoid accumulating debts.</p>
<p>I am not excited to see rich people fail…</p>
<p>I am being a little sarcastic…</p>
<p>I don’t know if they should pay back the loans or not…</p>
<p>I work in the financial industry. There are some good people that work in this industry. The ones that aren’t good people or did stupid things…or were never as bright as they thought they were…screwed things up for the good people in this industry…and really screwed up the financial system of the US and the world…</p>
<p>You mentioned greed as being good…well there is a point where greed crosses the line…when it can take down the economy…</p>
<p>Certain financial people… certain financial firms…by their actions…have cost me a lot of money and are going to cost me money for a long time…have cost my family money…have cost my friends jobs and money…have cost people I don’t know jobs and money…and they don’t get a pass from me… Also…many of these firms are full of @@@@. </p>
<p>I don’t value people by their wealth either…</p>
<p>razorsharp…Do you see this photo?</p>
<p>[Occupy</a> San Francisco marches with labor - Media (2 of 12) Occupy-labor alliance seen as increasingly](<a href=“http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/object/article?f=/c/a/2011/11/06/MN9H1LQQH7.DTL&object=%2Fc%2Fpictures%2F2011%2F11%2F03%2Fba-occupysf04_PH_0504483873.jpg]Occupy”>http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/object/article?f=/c/a/2011/11/06/MN9H1LQQH7.DTL&object=%2Fc%2Fpictures%2F2011%2F11%2F03%2Fba-occupysf04_PH_0504483873.jpg)</p>
![http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/object/article?f=/c/a/2011/11/06/MN9H1LQQH7.DTL&object=%2Fc%2Fpictures%2F2011%2F11%2F03%2Fba-occupysf04_PH_0504483873.jpg]Occupy](http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/object/article?f=/c/a/2011/11/06/MN9H1LQQH7.DTL&object=%2Fc%2Fpictures%2F2011%2F11%2F03%2Fba-occupysf04_PH_0504483873.jpg%5DOccupy){kind=link}
<p>Can you see this photo?</p>
<p>On that banner…It says tax financial transactions…Signs say tax Wall Street.</p>
<p>When society gets as imbalanced as it is now…this is what happens… I don’t want this to happen…I would lose quite a bit if a financial transaction tax was implemented. I have been advocating for the wealthy to share their wealth…I have been arguing to go back to the Clinton tax rates…Are those rates really so onerous? Really? Would they really hurt the wealthy?</p>
<p>I am sure you have heard that pigs get slaughtered…Either the wealth is shared or the wealth is going to be taken away…I guess you would prefer the latter…</p>
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<p>I see stupid people in those photos. Most of them pay much less in income taxes than they cost the American people in government expenditures, but they have no problem saying someone else should pay more taxes. Their taxes are the taxes that should go up. Rich people are paying more than their fair share of taxes. Class warfare brings down a society. You can see that in socialist and communist societies where everyone is equal. That equality is unfortunately means equally poor. </p>
<p>I want more rich people because they pay more taxes and help more people become rich. Hating rich people is childish. As long as we strive for equal opportunity, then poor people should blame themselves for their poverty.</p>
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I would love to go back to the Clinton tax rates but for everyone not just the rich. The tax cuts in 2000 took 7 million people off the income tax rolls. They should be returned to broaden the tax base.</p>
<p>I know a little about communism…</p>
<p>We always have class warfare…</p>
<p>I don’t see the world the way you do…my definition of fairness is a little different than yours…</p>
<p>“Either the wealth is shared or the wealth is going to be taken away…I guess you would prefer the latter…”</p>
<p>I guess I was right about this…</p>
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<p>Your definition of fairness is that it is ok to take money from people who work hard and earn it in order to give it to those who do not work as hard and have not earned it. There is nothing worse than that scenario.</p>
<p>Wealth is not something that is a set amount of money that can be allocated between people. Wealth is created. It can be increased even by those idiots in the photos. Rich people are not taking wealth from poor people. Most poor people do not have wealth because they do not engage in behavior that creates wealth. I am not responsible for whether my neighbor is poor or rich and neither is anyone else.</p>
<p>razor,
are hedge funds really creating wealth?</p>
<p>razorsharp…cutting the debt of this country…</p>
<p>…a family saves 1,500 a year in taxes for 8 years…then the age required to receive SS is raised two years costing this family 24,000…so the family is a net 12,000 loser…</p>
<p>Another family saves 1,000,000 a year in taxes for 8 years…then SS is cut off for them for 30 years…at an average of 75,000 a year (cost of living adjustments) …this family comes out 5.75 million ahead…</p>
<p>Is this fair?</p>
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<p>Does my dentist create wealth? How about college professors? How about professional athletes? I say yes. And the harder they work and the more money they make, the more wealth they create. </p>
<p>Our financial system generates capital so that businesses can purchase equipment, hire employees, pay off debts, and even purchase other companies. Liquidity is an essential function of a healthy financial system. For every seller of a stock there is a buyer. If there were no buyers, there could be no sellers and vice versa. Hedge funds are part of the buying and selling and they provide liquidity in the market place. If you don’t like what they are doing, then change the regulations but please do not blame them for engaging in lawful behavior and trying to earn money to feed their families. Contrary to popular belief, just because you are a hedge fund owner does not mean you are rich. There are many hedge funds that are not profitable but the media does not point them out because stories about rich people “stealing” from others is far more entertaining to them.</p>
<p>In short, hedge funds create wealth just as does my dentist and anyone else who works hard and tried to make a profitable living.</p>
<p>What happens razorsharp, when a person creates wealth for himself or his firm…even a billion or more…but his actions and actions by people in similar situations cost society 5 trillion?</p>
<p>" If you don’t like what they are doing, then change the regulations"</p>
<p>That’s good…that is what is happening…so don’t complain…because society doesn’t like what they are doing…</p>
<p>Liquidity, capital- some hedge funds make a contribution to this. So do the financial markets, so I am not sure if hedge funds and PE funds are really “necessary”… </p>
<p>Asset value arbitrage, cost of capital arbitrage, restructuring balance sheets, cost-cutting, all these things sound great.</p>
<p>The problem is that so much of it is financed with leverage, other people’s money, including taxpayers’. And not that much is about innovation or competitive advantages.</p>
<p>Do you think that the large hedge funds and PE funds are advantaged unfairly, in terms of inside info, in terms of tax rates? I do.</p>
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<p>I am not part of the top 1 percent but I would love to be part of that group. What I do know is that I pay a lot of income taxes. What I am tired of is listening to greedy people demanding that someone else’s taxes go up without first asking if their taxes should go up. If you are paying less in income taxes than the federal government is giving you in benefits, then you are not paying your fair share of the cost of government. Military bases cost a lot of money and they do not exist to benefit only the rich and not the poor. Poor people are just as free as rich people. </p>
<p>I am saddened by the current culture which seems to suggest there is something wrong with being rich. For most people, wealth is directly related to their skill level. A brain doctor makes a whole lot more than I do because his or her job is a lot more difficult than what I do. Very few people have the skill level to be brain doctors. Professional football players make a lot more than I do because they have skills I do not have. The high school drop outs who drinks his paycheck makes a lot less than I do because of his behavior. It is none of my business how those people live their lives. Take away all the rich people and all you have left is a society where everyone is equally poor.</p>
<p>“The only policy I support is that you should pay your fair share of taxes based on the benefits you receive from government.”</p>
<p>So…people who can’t afford this should do what?</p>
<p>And don’t say get a job…</p>
<p>people with jobs need government help too…</p>
<p>and what about those that can’t work…</p>
<p>taxing rich people more does not get rid of rich people…or stop people from being rich…</p>
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<p>Very few hedge funds get inside info. Those that get caught with inside info pay a heavy price. That Raj guy just got sent up the river for several years. If you do not like how hedge funds are taxed, change how they are taxed, but don’t blame hedge funds for paying the game under the rules as they exist. </p>
<p>I fail to see why hedge funds are so bad but guys who buy and sell stocks at the same time with their savings are some how good. There is no difference. Hedge funds are professional investors and they take money from people who have less expertise and less time to invest. It is a service like any other.</p>