OOS tuition

Colleges & Universities University of Michigan
21

<p>UVA is 5k cheaper per year. Over 4 years, that’s 20,000 dollars less for the same education.</p>

<p>UNC is about 20k cheaper. Over 4 years, that’s 80,000 dollars. Cal is slightly more expensive, but the Bay Area is one of the top-5 most expensive living areas in the country. Last time I checked, the avg home in AA was around 250k. The avg. one in Berkeley is $750,000. When you factor that in, 1.5k more per year is virtually nothing.</p>

<p>

Like who? In a 2007 study by the Princeton Review, they found Michigan’s OOS tuition the most expensive of any public university in the country. The cold truth is that it isn’t “cheaper.” With all due respect, I believe your post is the one that is poorly thought out.</p>

22

<p>“I don’t have have financial aid figures, but I am pretty sure that none of those three universities are known for their generosity toward OOS students.”</p>

<p>If you had actually read my post, you would’ve seen that I very clearly put the average Out of State costs after financial aid…</p>

<p>(Average) Out-of-State Costs After Aid…
UVA- 24k
Michigan - 32.5k
Cal - 31.5
UNC -21.5k (I thought I’d add one)</p>

<p>[Kiplinger.com](<a href=“http://content.kiplinger.com/tools/colleges/pubcollege.php?sortby=INRANK04&orderby=flip&states]Kiplinger.com[/url][0]=ALL&myschool[0]=none&outputby=table”>http://content.kiplinger.com/tools/colleges/pubcollege.php?sortby=INRANK04&orderby=flip&states)[0]=ALL&myschool[0]=none&outputby=table</a></p>

<p>Alexandre, you are arguing over the sticker prices, which is absolutely ridiculous. Who cares what the sticker price of a college is? The data I just compiled is the average Out-of-State cost a person pays after financial aid.</p>

23

<p>crs, I was referring to the price of attendance for OOS students. I am not sure how accurate Kiplinger is. Even if those figures are correct, the UC system, Miami of Ohio and UIUC are roughly as expensive as Michigan to OOS students after aid is accounted for, and contracry to what some of you are suggesting, Michigan meets 90% of demonstrated need, which is no worse than what Cal and other peers are providing. And you did not have to add UNC since I fully admitted that UNC is a “best buy” in my post above.</p>

24

<p>learnmestuff, Michigan’s peers are the top 40 universities in the nation. Below is the cost of attendence at those 40 universities:</p>

<p>Georgetown University: $50,500
Boston College: $50,000
New York University: $50,000
Johns Hopkins University: $49,500
Tufts University: $49,500
University of Chicago: $49,500
Vanderbilt University: $49,500
Washington University-St Louis: $49,500
Brown University: $49,000
Carnegie Mellon University: $49,000
Cornell University: $49,000
Harvard University: $49,000
Northwestern University: $49,000
University of Pennsylvania: $49,000
University of Southern California: $49,000
Brandeis University: $48,500
Massachusetts Institute of Technology: $48,500
Stanford University: $48,500
Columbia University: $48,000
Dartmouth College: $48,000
Duke University: $48,000
Emory University: $48,000
Lehigh University: $48,000
Yale University: $48,000
Princeton University: $47,000
University of Notre Dame: $47,000</p>

<p>California Institute of Technology: $46,000
Wake Forest University: $46,000
University of California-Berkeley: $43,500
University of Michigan-Ann Arbor: $42,000
University of California-Los Angeles: $42,000
Rice University: $41,500
University of California-San Diego: $40,000
University of Virginia: $38,000</p>

<p>College of William & Mary: $37,000
University of Illinois-Urbana Champaign: $37,000
University of Texas-Austin: $33,500
University of Wisconsin-Madison: $32,500
Georgia Institute of Technology: $32,000
University of North Carolina-Chapel Hill: $31,500</p>

<p>As the figures above show, Michigan is not as expensive as most of its peers. In fact, 26 of its 39 (66.67%) peers are at least $5,000/year more expensive. Only 6 (15%) of Michigan’s 39 peers are more than $5,000 cheaper. </p>

<p>Of course, as we all know, financial aid and scholarships are the great equalizers. With the exception of Harvard and Princeton (both of which have endowments of $2 million/student, compared to Michigan’s $200,000/student), students attending most elite universities graduate with $15,000-$25,000 debt. That’s the unfortunate cost of attending elite universities. To suggest that Michigan is “unethical” and “immature”, or that it is somehow much worse than its peers is not a fair charge. Yes, Michigan is expensive and it can do more to help, but one must recognize its limitations and acknowledge that it is not appreciably worse than its peers.</p>

25

<p>I understand the private school situation. I explicitly stated several times though that I was comparing public schools.</p>

26

<p>Learnmestuff, a university is a university. Whether it is public or private does not matter. What matters is quality. That is why I listed Michigan’s peers above. They are not public or private. Michigan’s peers are the top 40 universities, private or public.</p>

27

<p>

Not bargain, in my eyes. According to the materials they send out about their honor program, they compare it to HYPS’s students stats. But clearly their FA package to OSS are not comparable. …</p>

28

<p>School / % of grads with debt Average / amount of debt
Seton Hall University (NJ) 61% $37,724
New York University 61% $34,417
Worcester Polytechnic Institute (MA) 83% $34,409
University of North Dakota * 72% $33,032
Pace University (NY) 72% $32,980
Iowa State University * 69% $32,130
Pepperdine University (CA) 62% $31,718
Nova Southeastern University (FL) 69% $31,368
Drexel University ¶ 75% $31,333
Hofstra University (NY) 52% $31,196
University of St. Thomas (MN) 66% $31,065
New School (NY) 68% $31,039
St. John’s University (NY) 73% $29,920
George Washington University (DC) 40% $29,304
University of La Verne (CA) 66% $28,856
Stevens Institute of Technology (NJ) 72% $28,829
St. Mary’s University of Minnesota 74% $28,500
Long Island University–C.W. Post Campus (NY) 79% $28,125
University of San Francisco 64% $28,000
Florida A&M University * 82% $27,640
University of Rochester (NY) 56% $27,497
Carnegie Mellon University ¶ 52% $27,395
Temple University ¶* 70% $27,355
Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute (NY) 75% $27,235
Duquesne University ¶ 80% $27,080
University of Denver 47% $27,008
Fordham University (NY) 64% $26,879
St. Louis University 67% $26,754
University of San Diego 38% $26,639
University of Notre Dame (IN) 57% $26,285
Florida Institute of Technology 66% $25,768
Marquette University (WI) 65% $25,753
University of Tulsa (OK) 54% $25,692
Pacific University (OR) 90% $25,683
Lehigh University ¶ 53% $25,603
Loyola University Chicago 67% $25,470
Andrews University (MI) 68% $25,084
Polytechnic University (NY) 75% $25,012
SUNY College of Environmental Science and Forestry * 92% $25,000
Cornell University (NY) 55% $24,928
Georgetown University (DC) 46% $24,816
University of Alaska–Fairbanks * 55% $24,698
University of Miami (FL) 58% $24,673
Emory University (GA) 39% $24,272
Case Western Reserve University (OH) 56% $24,098
University of New Hampshire * 72% $23,928
Michigan State University * 55% $23,620
University of Vermont * 61% $23,557
University of Michigan–Ann Arbor * 44% $23,533
Pennsylvania State University–University Park * 66% $23,500
Syracuse University (NY) 64% $23,500
Duke University (NC) 40% $23,499
Tennessee State University * 82% $23,119
Bowling Green State University (OH)* 74% $22,929
Boston University 59% $22,913
University of Maryland–Baltimore County * 46% $22,856
Clark University (MA) 93% $22,600

  • 67% $22,542
    University of Missouri–Rolla * 65% $22,500
    University of New Orleans * 36% $22,350
    Miami University–Oxford (OH)* 52% $22,255
    Kent State University (OH)* 72% $22,230
    Golden Gate University (CA) 45% $21,780
    University of Memphis * 22% $21,703
    Dartmouth College (NH) 52% $21,561
    Auburn University (AL)* 64% $21,256
    Tulane University (LA) 43% $21,243
    University of Pennsylvania 41% $20,927
    Wichita State University (KS)* 61% $20,875
    Virginia Commonwealth University * 66% $20,828
    Indiana State University * 69% $20,764
    University of Dayton (OH) 76% $20,731
    South Dakota State University * 81% $20,682
    Wake Forest University (NC) 37% $20,655
    North Dakota State University * 62% $20,581
    Boston College 53% $20,350
    Texas Tech University * 55% $20,333
    University of Connecticut * 60% $20,303
    University of Wisconsin–Madison * 47% $20,282
    University of Alabama–Huntsville * 30% $20,273
    Idaho State University * 71% $20,253
    University of Iowa * 61% $20,234
    University of South Dakota * 88% $20,163
    Purdue University–West Lafayette (IN)* 47% $20,102
    University of Cincinnati * 47% $20,052
    University of Idaho * 69% $20,002
    Brandeis University (MA) 67% $19,892
    Virginia Tech * 52% $19,807
    Mississippi State University * 43% $19,780
    American University (DC) 50% $19,766
    Northern Illinois University * 38% $19,764
    Indiana University–Bloomington * 53% $19,756
    Oregon State University * 60% $19,550
    Oklahoma State University * 59% $19,547
    Vanderbilt University (TN) 38% $19,429
    University of South Carolina–Columbia * 44% $19,360
    University of Oklahoma * 52% $19,206
    University of Kansas * 43% $19,203
    Ohio University * 63% $19,194
    Texas A&M University–Commerce * 67% $19,032
    University of Missouri–Columbia * 59% $18,983
    Montana State University * 65% $18,914
    Northwestern University (IL) 46% $18,860
    University of Oregon * 59% $18,813
    University of North Carolina–Greensboro * 61% $18,804
    Azusa Pacific University (CA) 58% $18,777
    University of Alabama–Birmingham * 41% $18,764
    University of Alabama * 41% $18,700
    Washington State University * 60% $18,692
    Samford University (AL) 46% $18,501
    University of Southern California 54% $18,257
    University of Tennessee * 47% $18,254
    Texas A&M University–College Station * 50% $18,247
    University of Missouri–Kansas City * 97% $18,227
    University of Arkansas * 46% $18,172
    Georgia Southern University * 66% $18,146
    University of Missouri–St. Louis * 65% $18,143
    Ohio State University–Columbus * 56% $18,130
    University of Nebraska–Lincoln * 63% $18,119
    DePaul University (IL) 65% $18,053
    Yeshiva University (NY) 45% $18,034
    Colorado State University * 54% $17,975
    University of Nevada–Las Vegas * 43% $17,960
    Massachusetts Institute of Technology 45% $17,956
    George Fox University (OR) 78% $17,903
    University of Maryland–College Park * 44% $17,731
    Clemson University (SC)* 49% $17,544</p>
29

<p>AnotherNJmom, financially, Michigan cannot compete with HYP. Their endowment per student hovers around $2 million. But in terms of cost and academics, Michigan competes nicely with many of its peers, such as Cornell, Northwestern, Penn etc…</p>

30

<p>Thanks Sam. This pretty much backs my statement above. The average debt at graduation of students attending top 40 universities generally hovers between $15K and $25K. Michigan is no worse or better than its peers.</p>

<p>New York University 61% $34,417
Carnegie Mellon University ¶ 52% $27,395
University of Notre Dame (IN) 57% $26,285
Lehigh University ¶ 53% $25,603
Cornell University (NY) 55% $24,928
Georgetown University (DC) 46% $24,816
Emory University (GA) 39% $24,272
University of Michigan–Ann Arbor * 44% $23,533
Duke University (NC) 40% $23,499
Dartmouth College (NH) 52% $21,561
University of Pennsylvania 41% $20,927
Boston College 53% $20,350<br>
University of Wisconsin–Madison * 47% $20,282
Brandeis University (MA) 67% $19,892
Vanderbilt University (TN) 38% $19,429
Northwestern University (IL) 46% $18,860
University of Southern California 54% $18,257<br>
Massachusetts Institute of Technology 45% $17,956</p>

31

<p>School / % of grads with debt / Average amount of debt
New York University 61% $34,417
Carnegie Mellon University ¶ 52% $27,395
University of Notre Dame (IN) 57% $26,285
Cornell University (NY) 55% $24,928
Georgetown University (DC) 46% $24,816
Emory University (GA) 39% $24,272
Case Western Reserve University (OH) 56% $24,098
University of Michigan–Ann Arbor * 44% $23,533
Duke University (NC) 40% $23,499
Dartmouth College (NH) 52% $21,561
University of Pennsylvania 41% $20,927
University of Wisconsin–Madison * 47% $20,282
Vanderbilt University (TN) 38% $19,429
Northwestern University (IL) 46% $18,860
Columbia University (NY) 44% $17,275
Johns Hopkins University (MD) 53% $16,932
University of Virginia * 33% $16,903
University of California–Los Angeles * 46% $15,996
Rice University (TX) 41% $15,876
Stanford University (CA) 46% $15,758
University of California–Berkeley * 44% $14,751
University of North Carolina–Chapel Hill * 32% $14,487
Tufts University (MA) 36% $14,200
Yale University (CT) 32% $13,344
Harvard University (MA) 42% $9,717
Princeton University (NJ) 26% $4,965</p>

32

<p>Thanks Sam. As one can clearly see, regardless of cost, in most cases, financial aid and scholarships are the “great equalizer”. When all is said and done, most students attending elite universities graduate with $15k-25k debt.</p>

33

<p>To some degree, you need to look at this on a student by student basis. For instance, UM provides some substantial merit and merit/need scholarships (Shipman, LSA, Tradition, etc.), while many schools (Harvard & Princeton, for instance) provide only need based aid. This means that, in some circumstances, UM may be much less expensive than HP for high achieving students. While one can make inferences from statistical data, each student’s circumstances are unique and can produce widely varying results.</p>

34

<p>Seriously, the state of michigan is so broke they paid for so little of the funding of the university anyway. Last time i checked it was 17%, unlike around 50% for many other state univeristiys… So equally, in state tuition should be 17% less than OOS. Instead, it is more than 50% less. In other words, we OOS students are freaking paying for instate students. WHAT THE HECK.
And those hypocrites in the administrations who whine about state funding not being enough, well, dont offer in state tuition so the state would cut off the funding completely, instead charge everyone OOS tuition. I am sure you get more funds charging everyone OOS tuition when the state pays you 0% than charging instate tuition for michigan residents for the state’s pity@ss funding. U of M could care less about ****ing the state off, U of M thrive on a national base.</p>

35

<p>Bearcats, you speak my language! LOL! Personally, I don’t think Michigan should eliminate in-state tuition, but I agree that they should reduce their in-state population from 65% of undergrads to 25%.</p>

36

<p>

</p>

<p>This whining hypocrite (thanks, BTW) would like to see the numbers you have to back up the claim that OOS students subsidize instate students.</p>

<p>The truth is, both OOS and IS students are subsidized. IS students just get more – and therefore more price relief.</p>

37

<p>hoedown, OOS students are NOT subsidized by the state, but by the generous gifts of people who contributed to the endowment. The truth is, the pityful 17% from the state is not even enough to subsidize IS students themselves. The state’s money should all go to the IS people but the rest should be shared equally amongst everyone which would make the IS and OOS tuition gap much less than it is now.
IS students should not get more subsidy other than the state’s fund. That’s my point. The rest should be shared equally when determining the tuition.</p>

38

<p>bearcats, I get what you are saying in post #37. My argument was with your earlier statement, (which is now contradicted, I guess) where you claimed that OOS students are paying for IS students.</p>

<p>I wasn’t claiming that OOS students are subsidized by the state. They’re not, not really (although thankfully, the state does use full enrollment, not just resident enrollment, in some of their funding formulas). But OOS are subsidized but the other revenues the University gets (like gifts and endowment proceeds, as you say). But OOS are not overpaying with all the overage going to offer a discount IS students.</p>

39

<p>my logic is, the sum of the huge gap between IS and OOS is way more than the state fundings, which logically mean that even for the non-state fundings/gifts, the IS students receive more per person than an OOS student. That’s where the unfairness come in. What entitles an IS student to get more non-state funding than an OOS student, when in general the OOS student body is more academically qualified?</p>

40

<p>The State of Michigan contributed $320M do the general fund of UM for fiscal 2007-08. That represented 24% of the general fund revenues of UM. Total enrollment at UM (undergraduate and graduate) is about 41,000, so that represents about $7,800 per student. Those are rough numbers, but I wanted to get some idea of what the general landscape was.</p>