Given mother’s proclamation of not allowing OP to attend college out-of-state, as others have mentioned Community College may have to be looked at.
Bouders-
The OP seems very bright and can easily identify the schools with full pay scholarships (like the stamps scholarships) . But that didnt seem to be what the OP was asking. He was asking how to deal with his mom.
To be perfectly honest, if I were in your situation, I’d just attend a community college far away and then transfer to a better school. De Anza is a good one.
@boulders he has been pointed to lists of these types of schools in previous threads. In this one we are trying to answer the question he asked here.
@codemachine how would an out of state student with no money pay for living expenses in the Bay Area as well as OOS community college? If he attends a CC in his state he will at least be able to transfer instate in Indiana.
^^ full tuition, Chancellor’s distinguished scholarship. Room and board is listed at around $9,000.
U of Southern Indiana, Indiana State, IPFW, IUPUI, IU East, Purdue Calumet…
You do have options. Even Ivy Tech and Trine advertise a 3-2 deal. Make peace, maybe there a compromise in applied math. Or even CS with a math minor or double major, then plan on math for grad school.
I bet the more you insist on ND or Chi, the more she feels cornered. If you need her help even logistically, then it’s in your best interest to make peace and find a middle ground that works.
A lot of people go from a position like yours into the military and figure out how to get a degree that way. That’s a hard road; easier to make peace.
In total wouldn’t it cost less, and then by then he’d be independent enough to get full aid from a UC?
To be independent for FAFSA you have to be 24. CC would be much easier in state, more affordable instate tuition and articulation agreements. He would have to get there and find housing without family around. California is not realistic.
I would schedule a meeting with your school counselor. I would dress nicely (not dressy, but not a t shirt. This suggests maturity. I would take a one-page document that walks through the issue, specific examples, and what you are asking her/him to do.
Here is a very rough initial draft, based on your original post.
Issue: I want to study science and/or mathematics, much to her disdain. My mother is opposing me trying to conduct a college search and getting admitted to college.
Examples
- Doesn't realize how much an investment is when it comes to college. She thought because her brothers, paid for their college with a job their senior year+summer work in HS, there is no reason why I can't do the same.
- Her idea of college education is going to the nearby state university, studying a "career major" (not sure what the real term is) like Accounting and Engineering or trade school, getting a job, end of story.
- My mother now believes it is impossible for me to college and tells me I need to start preparing for trade school and to drop my AP classes because they're worthless now.
- She says, you can only go to college in Indiana and since we can't afford any of them (and religious schools scare her and U of Chicago is a war zone) you can't go to college. "Sorry son." Apparently because I am a somewhat quiet kind of kid, (I used to have social anxiety a few years ago, but now I'm pretty much over it) this translates to being "unable to function" in a faraway environment.
- Anytime I try to talk to her about colleges she insists on these previous points and yells at me for "arguing with her" and begins crying and screaming at me because I'm a "disrespectful expletive who hates his mom". I've recorded my conversations with her on this and played for her, showing that I was polite, calm, and amicable while she was interrupting, hostile and name-calling. This only results in more insults hurled my way for thinking I can "get away with such blatant disobedience" and her telling me to "MOVE OUT WHEN YOU TURN EIGHTEEN!!!!!!!"
What am I asking for?
I want to go to college, and I want to be able to work with my Mom and the school to identify options that may be feasible in terms of admission and cost. I am hoping for help explaining the process my mother. Because of her personality, I have been unable to do achieve this objective in several attempts. What would you recommend is the best approach/next steps for me to take?
Also, as you work to convince your Mom to give on several fronts, try to identify places where you can give something. This allows her to “save face.” Try to find a number of points where you can say, “you were right, Mom.” You don’t need to believe it, you are just throwing her a bone on non-critical points to improve your chances on more critical ones.
Potential examples
- You were right. I am not going to consider Notre Dame.
- I have decided not to major in math of science in college, I am going to major in engineering. For the first year these are identical to there is no cost to this and you can change later. If this makes her believe that your college years will be valuable in the future, then it is worth it. If she believes that it is thanks to her, then it is doubly worth it.
Also, consider Purdue and Indiana if going to a nearby state school would gain her support. They are world class schools. If you could get her involved in visiting them, she may see the benefits of supporting you more clearly. I know the money is a concern, but with her cooperation, you have a much better chance of working out the financial end. They may also have cooperative programs with local community colleges that would allow you to transfer after two years, and still graduate in four. That would be a solid back-up option.
I would look up some of the career information (salaries and percent employed) from Purdue and Indiana for engineering majors and math majors for example. They will be impressive. That may lessen her worries about your future.
I think a college visit where your mom is able to gain some understanding of how college works these days would be a great way to ease her into being more supportive. A more local university in your state would be a bonus. Hearing the staff talk about where graduates are getting jobs, percentage of grads employed within 6 months of their graduation, this could be helpful. If another adult your mom trusts could go with you, that would be a bonus. Of course, you are hoping this other adult is already on your side and will not talk negatively the whole time, so you might want to pick that companion carefully.l
I think the larger issue is that your mother may have mental health problems. Her behavior sounds like that of a person with borderline personality disorder. I don’t think reason and education will help her see your side.
You need to go to your guidance counselor and explain that you do not expect financial help from your parents, and ask for help researching schools that you can afford even without their help. You may need to work and attend a CC for the first two years, for example.
@BurgerMan1 -I think one possibility everyone here has overlooked is for you to declare yourself financially independent. This would make you eligible for financial aid, as I’m making the assumption (a safe one, I think) that your wealth would decrease significantly if your parents’ incomes are no longer considered.
For more details, see this link:
http://www.dailyfinance.com/2013/07/22/how-to-declare-your-independence-for-student-financial-aid/
It’s a long shot, given some of the conditions, but it’s worth a try. A classmate of my mother’s did much the same thing when they were both at the University of Chicago, as his father had some very serious mental issues and wouldn’t pay a cent of his tuition.
You may also, as the article notes, be eligible for Stafford loans. Of course a lot of people don’t like the idea of large student debt, but If you’re planning on a STEM major, the odds are good that you’ll have little trouble finding a well-paid job. And in the end, there are any number of studies showing that college is generally a worthwhile investment from a financial standpoint (to say nothing of the intangible benefits).
Your situation sounds really difficult, but I hope everything works out.
Some info I may have left out: My mom has saved up between $4-5k for a car for me. This is independent of the 5k I may receive per year in college. That number is subject to change though. Is a car necessary for college? If I take this money and use it for college, is it a “game changer” in any shape or form?
Also if I go to a CC and then transfer, how would that impact my chance of financial aid? I’d have to get a car and live at home (something I want to avoid if plausible). I still couldn’t afford in-state options. Do those mentioned scholarships count for transfers as well?
You need a merit scholarship, it seems. The CC would not affect need-based financial aid, but would impact the number of merit scholarship opportunities, as most of those are offered to incoming freshmen. There are merit scholarships for transfer students, but there are many more for entering freshmen. You have the stats for them now- out of CC if you have lower grades or some other glitch, you may not qualify.
You know you can do Alabama and LA Tech, and a few others. A place like Alabama would be a great home. If you are going into math or science, you are likely aiming at a graduate degree- and I am sure you will find support (i.e. full ride) for that degree. Alabama would really be a great undergraduate base for that kind of grad school.
I would think going for a merit scholarship would be a better strategy than community college --> 4-year. It’s not like you have a plan for the last two years; you are just deferring the problem and taking away possible solutions (entering-freshman scholarships).
You do not need a car for a “residential college”, one where you live on-campus.
I would strategize some full tuition and full ride options. Generally, even for financial aid recipients, the student is expected to earn $2K - $3K during the school year and another $2K - $3K over the summer. Add the $5.5K loan, and you have about $10K towards your COA. It sounds like your Mom will support you. She is just overwhelmed/freaked out thinking about it.
She will be saving on groceries and “incidental” monies when you take off. When all this becomes more real (like in the couple of months before the first day of classes), she may soften a bit.
If mom is against OOS schools it would be better to stay instate and get full tuition at one of those schools. Like I posted above IPFW would be free tuition and about $10k for remaining costs. If you stay instate and mom helps with $5 k, then you only need the $5.5 k loan. You can get a campus job and work summers to help with next year.
Maybe if you compromise on location then mom will compromise on major.
At UA the remaining cost would be more than $10 k for a math major I would think. And travel costs are much higher as well. Mom might not help at all if he goes OOS.
@mommdc She may not help at all even if I stay in-state. Because my sibilings didn’t need help she assumes that I am lazy and “weak” for asking that she help me pay for college. I try to bring up how they got their college for pennies on the dollar, but she won’t let me.
@ItsJustSchool My sibiling who dropped out of college (he may return, I don’t know) is currently living with us, so there’s not really much room for that 5k to go up. We’re living meagerly as it is and I have a feeling it’s just going to get worse.
@mommdc, all of this could be very true. I would rather push for U Alabama (if it were me) than IPFW, since I think the quality of the experience would be better for a high-stats student- as well as potential placement in a top grad program. That is my bias. I would also be pushing for Stamps (Tulane, mentioned up-thread by another respondent) and whatever other competitive scholarships are out there.
The mom sounds to me like she really loves the OP, but that she is overwhelmed and makes decisions based heavily on emotions and concrete facts on the ground rather than "what-if"s in the long-term future. Again, I am projecting here; so the OP can read it & reject it, or maybe it sparks an idea or two. I could be very wrong.
Duke has great competitive merit scholarships; and Chicago has the Odyssey Scholarship (assuming your parents did not attend college). There is hope. Forge ahead. A lot could change over the coming year in terms of attitudes and beliefs- be sure that when changes occur, the opportunities are there to seize!