In terms of process with your daughter, perhaps ask her to visualize different scenarios: (1) competing at the D3; (2) attending the D1 with club or rec sports only; (3) getting career-ending injury at D3; and (4) not playing sport at all at D1. Do any of those envisioned experiences turn her off that option, or do any of them feel “just right.”
Of course, there is no “right” answer here. For what it’s worth, for my D3 athlete, competing in his sport was like breathing for him, he simply couldn’t imagine a college experience without it, so the big school experience had no appeal for him, without his sport. How gutted would your student be if they couldn’t play/compete? And do they love that school, not just for the opportunity to compete, but also independently, as their college experience?
Many large universities have quite competitive club sports , depending on the sport. Some of the skills of players and level of competition on club teams at large D1 schools could be just as rewarding as playing D3 for a serious player . Many club teams have competitive tryouts, tournaments, etc.
The overall fit of a school is so important. Your daughter sounds much more interested in a big school environment from what you’ve described. Applying ED (under some pressure) to a small D3 sounds risky, given her interest in bigger schools, so I do hope she carefully considers all the angles before committing to that path. Can she reach out to some club team contacts at larger D1 schools she may be interested in? Good luck with the decision!
My friends son last year had to make the exact decision. His sport is cross country though. He had several offers to run on D2 and D3 schools. In the end, he chose ASU and not being on a team. He still runs but is also doing more hiking, and training for triathlons and such. So he’s still doing his sport but in a different way.
(Now with covid hes living at home going to a state school for this year and hoping to transfer back next year to ASU when they can be in person).
As @Midwestmomofboys notes, there is no right answer. That also means that there are no wrong answers. In all likelihood, your daughter will be very happy no matter where she goes.
I do think your daughter should think through the “social” aspect of her concerns. What exactly does she think the social life of a large university would provide that a smaller D3 school would not. Without doubt, there will be more people at a large university, but that doesn’t necessarily mean that the social life will be better. Sometimes fewer people equates to fewer but stronger relationships.
Your daughter should drill down on what she thinks she will be missing at a smaller school, Is it fraternity parties? Some D3s still have fraternities. Is it the school or the fact that it is in a rural location. Simply articulating her concerns about a smaller school may reveal whether they are true concerns or simply what she thinks might limit her at a smaller school. Hopefully, this will help her determine whether she really prefers the large university or whether this is just nervousness over the college admission process.
I do feel for you. All of mine loved their D3 schools and loved athletics, but this is a very personal dilemma, and you are not able to have an OV to take a look under the hood. Push your daughter to think through the issues and choose the school that she likes the most. She will make the right choice.
@gointhruaphase bingo, i think that is her biggest dilemma. The D3 is stem, highly academic, techie types, 70/30 male to female ratio. She is super smart but also extroverted, social and outgoing. I know that is one of her issues.
This one D3 option she has truly does not sound like a good fit for her but I am going on your description of her so could be missing something. . One of my kids got some athletic interest out of the blue from a very top, elite STEM school years ago. It was flattering but a very poor fit for him . I didn’t tell him he couldn’t pursue it (he didn’t) but did not hesitate as his parent to tell him it seemed like a very poor fit for him.
I remember reading on here a long time ago that one way to try and get at your true feelings is to assign each of the two schools as heads or tails and then flip a coin to see how you feel when one school “wins.”
It sounds like in this case, it may not be strictly a D3 varsity sports vs. big school maybe club sports issue but more a this particular D3 school vs. big school issue.
FWIW I try to make my own difficult personal decisions by asking myself which decision am I likely to regret more later, i.e, am I more likely to later regret not having chosen A or B. Sometimes that helps put things in a different perspective for me.
@stacysmom21 ."bingo, i think that is her biggest dilemma. The D3 is stem, highly academic, techie types…
Just noting that many D1 schools, including some state universities, are academically rated quite high with some quite a bit higher than many D3 & D2 schools that may be well known in a certain area.
I am not sure of the school in question though in my opinion and experience, she will find just as many techie types and very smart, studious students at most D1 schools including the state universities, especially the higher ranked D1 schools.
I’d suggest looking at the academic experience the schools offer, and what learning environments she likes (if sports aren’t going to drive the decision).
Generally speaking, larger schools mean a lot more lectures until you start hitting graduate-level courses perhaps. Conversely, smaller colleges afford more opportunities to have Socratic learning and interactions with fellow students and professors (in the classroom). I wish someone had smacked my upside the head when I was picking 18 b/c I ended up sleeping through a lot of lectures.
To dork the numbers a little: a college of 2000 students means over 4 years, a person will have the “opportunity” to meet/interact with about 3500 different students. That seems like a lot - probably not going to meet most of them.
Small colleges can attract a lot of the same “types” whereas a university probably has a greater diversity of people - though I think the challenge in any setting is one’s own mindset to actively meet folks that are different than yourself. Arguably, the absolute number of “different from you” people might be lower in a college, but that setting might afford more chances to have meaningful interactions.
I’ll tell you what I’d say to my own athletes: “you’re not majoring in (fill in the sport). You’re going to school to get an education and eventually a job; if you get to compete at one of your top choices, it’s a bonus.” I’d see it year after year, first signs come at winter break, then when they come home for summer and have to train on their own; the love of the sport can quickly fade when they’re training 2-a-days, lifting, going to class, missing other clubs and activities at a school they don’t really like. Sometimes good team chemistry and comradery can help an athlete connect; a bad team vibe can be the kiss of death for their love of their sport. It’s tough watching struggling D1 kids when it’s their “job” and they need the $ to afford tuition; it’s just as tough watching a D3 kid struggle at a school they don’t love but chose just to continue competing. I’m not saying don’t compete; I love to see athletes succeed, just make sure they’re doing so at a school where they could see themselves with, or more importantly WITHOUT their sport. Good luck!!
When my kids were looking at schools, we looked at a variety of shapes and sizes. One daughter was an athlete and was being recruited by coaches in all 3 divisions. She could tell if she liked a school after a visit. She was a STEM student through and through and even though some highly ranked Div 3 schools wanted her (Kenyon, Smith, Oberlin) she really had no interest in liberal arts. The D1s that wanted her were lower ranked both in academics and for her sport. One was a very small school (smallest D1 school out there) and I knew it couldn’t meet her academic needs. We were looking for a balance of academics, athletics, and (for me) financial aid.
I felt very claustrophobic at the small schools. There didn’t seem to be enough professors in certain departments, so if you don’t like Prof Brown or Prof Green, you may be out of luck. Miss signing up for French Lit as a sophomore, it may not be offered again for 2 years. I admit, I like big schools.
As they say, you can make a big school smaller but you can’t make a small school bigger (unless it is part of a consortium).
Circling back with some additional thoughts .Perhaps some of her concerns may arise from the fact that she is “done” – she’s made her decision and the process is over. For engaged, motivated students and student-athletes (and their families), the college search can be an exhausting but fun process, full of possibility. Once a student athlete has chosen to commit, the “shopping” period is over. It’s natural to wonder, at that stage, “what if.” Plenty of RD kids in the spring post on CC with worry about whether they chose “wrong,” so it is not unique to student athletes.
Perhaps she could reach out (directly, or through the coach) to future teammates, have some group conversations about the experience? That could help remind her why she chose what she did, or allow her the opportunity to explore whether her misgivings are warranted or just ordinary “what ifs.”
I really appreciate all the advice here. It is definitely helping me figure out how to best guide her. I think I have an answer but need to help her see it.
@stacysmom21
I am not sure if your D needs the coaches help to get in, or if this school has slots like a NESCAC, or how competitive the particular sports team is and where she would rank, but a simple option could be to choose to apply RD. That will allow your D and family to take some more time.
I understand coaches do not like this and I appreciate and get that, but they should understand. I do know recruited students that chose to apply RD over ED, were admitted and the coach still wanted them.
I think the same way as @recruitparent, who wrote “I did not like being forced ED for recruiting reasons . . .” When you wrote that this D3 is the only school interested in her as an athlete, that was even more true.
You wrote –
All of those sound like far more impressive attributes than her athletic talent.
Unless your daughter is a goalie (only one plays) or a basketball player (5 on the floor), it is hard to imagine she needs a roster spot held for her at a small D3 college with a 70/30 male/female ratio, if she can get in without the coach’s help.
I suggest that you take a hard look at the admissions statistics by going to the most recent Common Data Set and look at freshman profile 25%/50%/75% SAT/ACT scores (at C9). Then, look at the ratio of men admitted/applied and the ratio of women admitted/applied (at C1). A ratio of women admitted that is much higher than the men, might suggest she has a little extra cushion beyond the combined numbers. Applying ED makes less sense, if it looks like your daughter should get in without this coach’s help (Good grades and scores at 75%, maybe even 50%).
Communications between athletes/parents and coaches should always be respectful, honest and direct, in both directions. It may be better to know how this coach reacts to your daughter making decisions that are in her best interest now, rather than after you start paying for tuition, room and board.
@recruitparent and @KaiserS yes, we would much prefer to go RD and wait it out. Not just for reasons of her indecision, but also to weigh financial packages and review the Covid situation in the Spring. Unfortunately, she is a recruited athlete (top recruit) and coach said she couldn’t wait forever and that she would need to fill the roster spot and give the next athlete on the list the opportunity for an early read. Could there be a potential walk on spot for my daughter later? Maybe, I need to ask that question. My daughter is in the 25% range for the school, so admission is only guaranteed with ED and coaches tip. But given test optional applications this year, the odds are in her favor (her GPA, class ranking, academic rigor is all really good but her SAT is lower because its from sophomore year and she missed the Mar/May/Aug offerings of the SAT). The other thing that I think maybe would not be guaranteed is the merit offered in the likely letter although that seems unethical if they lowered it because we chose to go RD… not sure how that works. I think am willing to take the gamble because I see her struggling with this decision.
@KaiserS her athletic talent is also very good too but she has been picky about what schools to pursue. Most D2/D3’s have been in remote locations that do not interest her. This one D3 appeals to her because its in a large city. So the big city sorta balances the small campus if that makes any sense.
The coaches recruiting my son emphasized that D3 athletes are students first, athletes second. So it mattered very much to them that my son wanted to be at their school, not just that he wanted to be on their team. Seems like good guidance.
Your daughter could have an exceptional experience as a club athlete at a D1 school. A friend’s kid went that route, and there are athletes on his club team who were recruited but decided against the D1 athletic commitment. So the club team competes at a pretty high level but without the pressure of a varsity team. The club team practices regularly and competes all around the region, and the kids are very close as a team. It’s a great option!
