My son has virtually no requirements other than engineering. He seems to find something good and bad about every school he has seen. He’s fine with cold or heat, close to home or far away, big or small, public or private, trees or city, etc.
I guess this is good because he can just apply to a bunch of different types of schools and he should be fine with whatever decisions he gets.
I dropped S19 at XC camp at University of Wisconsin yesterday. He is so darn excited. He and his friends love this camp. The food is awesome (hello, he’s a 17-year old boy…this is key) and the counselors are the university’s XC team. They are so good to the boys. The kids play an ultimate frisbee tournament every night (after a day of running, lectures, etc) and that’s the best part for S19. His team has won the tournament for the last two years and he was named MVP both times so he’s really in his element. Six days of this, though, and he’s toast!
I am truly overwhelmed by the size of the campus. For those of you with kids looking at large universities, how do the kids get to class? UW is huge. The dorm the boys are living in for this camp is on the edge of campus and probably three miles to the other side of campus. Can’t always ride bikes with lots of snow. I’m assuming there are buses. And then there’s the issue that most kids move out of housing after freshman year, which means they need to find roommates by Nov/Dec to join together to find an apartment. Isn’t that stressful? So many kids love a big, fun campus. D21 might be one of them. I’ll have to get my head around how all of that works at some point.
Does anyone have an issue with a kid being undecided on major? I don’t expect kids to know their majors in high school but mine keeps wavering between history/political science and business. The problem is that at all his colleges these are in different schools. You must apply to either business or arts and science. In fact at some colleges (UMass I’m looking at you), history and political science are in different schools. S keeps asking me why he needs to decide now. Well, unfortunately, you have to check a box. I’m thinking about recommending he split his list. For his reach schools, apply to A&S. For those where he is more assured on acceptance, apply to business. Then in the spring he can decide. I think its easier in general to switch from business to A&S than the other way around. I didn’t have this problem with my older D. She was undecided on major but all the possibilities were in A&S so it wasn’t an issue.
@me29034 S19 is crazy undecided. Could be physics or English or history or geology or studio art. I’m not kidding. That’s why he’s looking at smaller schools where he doesn’t have to declare major until end of sophomore year. This is still a compromise because he would be giving up the engineering option. He’s not ready to be an engineering major and give up all of his other interests. As for the bigger schools and your undecided S, I think your plan sounds good. Start in business if you can and switch out if needed.
Can he look at the business courses and see what he thinks? There may be very little room for history, poli sci, etc and that might help him make the decision. If he’s ok with that, then apply to business. If that really bums him out, then maybe he’s more likely to be a history/poli sci major. Or maybe he could double major and do history or poli sci and econ. I was a poli sci/econ double major out of Northwestern and we had the exact same job offers as kids with business degrees.
Our niece will be a business major at Illinois. This was her parents’ decision, not hers. She wants to do something with environmental science or maybe even creative writing. She’s been investigating her options to take classes outside of the business school and it’s very difficult and virtually impossible to double major. The business kids pretty much have a set curriculum - the first sets of classes review all types of business and then the kids choose one to focus on like Finance or Marketing. She won’t be able to squeeze in something to her liking in the College of Arts and Sciences.
We were at an uber reach school recently and one thing I liked is that they don’t force the kids to declare a major until sophomore year and at the beginning of each semester you get " test out" the class for a few weeks before deciding to take it or not. That way you are not wasting your time studying stuff you don’t want to, or getting stuck with a teacher you don’t like.
That being said, my son already knows what he wants to major in, but maybe he could try some classes out and find a possible minor he might like to select.
My d19 is firmly decided but I still prefer she go to a college where there are many other options and where she can switch majors with little hassle, just in case she changed her mind.
@mom2twogirls That’s a good strategy. Especially if a student is gung-ho pre med or engineering, it’s best to have other options. Both of those have major drop out rates I was a biomedical engineering major to start and, if you asked me senior year if I would graduate with that degree, I would have said 100% yes.
@homerdog sounds like a great camp for your kid. I did a two-year fellowship at UW after grad school and it seemed like such a fun campus and city. I loved how the campus stretched right into the city, and the capital with the farmers markets on weekends was great. Of course the winters were brutal for me and I used to think that if I had done undergrad at UW, I would have wanted to spend spring semesters somewhere else and take classes all summer in Msdison.
Speaking to the dark horse idea, I know I’ve said this before but I think it bears repeating. My D15 ended up at the school that was on the bottom of her list. She wanted urban, liberal, medium to smallish, and most importantly NOT IN THE SOUTH. She is currently heading into her final year at UVA and it has been the most awesome perfect place for her. I share this not to make any of you second guess the narrowing of lists (heaven knows our kids can’t apply everywhere) but just to hopefully lessen some anxiety heading into this application season. Most kids can thrive at most colleges. It will be okay.
@homerdog most large universities think carefully about how to help students get around. There are generally free shuttles and buses and in the smart phone era students can track when a bus is arriving at the stop and stay at that desk in the library until the last possible moment before rushing out to catch that bus and be deposited right outside their next class. Speaking as a parent of one student at a largish university, D15, and one at a small LAC, D16, there are some huge advantages to the big school. Big schools have numerous dining halls many open all day so it is easier to eat near where you are at the time you want as opposed to often limited hours and one or two locations for a small school. If you have a bad break up it is much easier to avoid your ex and/or form a new friend group. Large schools tend to attract a sizable just off campus restaurant/bar/shopping area that can be a nice walkable resource for students. D16’s school is a located in the suburbs and has really nothing walkable off campus and no great public transit options which is a routine frustration. Everything has its pluses and minuses.
@RightCoaster My S sounds kind of like yours with his lack of requirements in a college. As long as it’s “good”, he seems to not care much about location, size etc. By good I guess he means as least as highly ranked (with comparable academics) as our in state options with chances for FA or merit. He says he will enjoy college wherever he goes, but I’m thinking he would like some distance from me!
Yes, the large college we are looking at has constant shuttles around campuses. Additionally, I think all 4 my d is looking at also have many/most academic buildings connected by under or above ground tunnels/basements so that kids don’t have to go outside as much in the worst weather.
Thanks @homerdog ,The two things that he is absolutely set on from the start is a large school, in an urban setting. There are no small schools on his list. His stats aren’t high enough for the super reaches. At this point he is primarily looking at large publics and midsize urban catholics, and with a strong preference (at the moment) for the northeast.
@me29034 One of the things we liked about UMass was that they had a specific undecided track where the kids have a special guidance counselor who will guide them through the process of picking a major. Would this be a possibility for your son?
@homerdog My D16 longboards everywhere at her big public school campus (not as big as Wisconsin, but 22,000 undergrads or so)… Places that get a lot of snow tend to clear the walkways/roads/sidewalks immediately so it hasn’t been a problem even in winter. It was not a hassle to move off-campus and there was a shuttle right in front of her apartment building, which was essentially “assisted living for sophomores” even though it’s not affiliated with the university. She’s moving into a house next month with two friends.
S19 spent last week at Oberlin and had a wonderful time playing his bass all day every day. “Did you like the small town and campus, the food, the dorm, any of it?” “Not really, but I would just spend most of my time in the conservatory so it doesn’t matter.” I guess he’ll apply even though it’s a super reach? We’re visiting Temple this week which will be pretty much the opposite, I imagine.
S19 is firmly set on music and is not interested in anything else so it’s probably the right choice for him. If he didn’t go in with a focus, I feel that he would flounder around and never finish. So his main criteria for a college seems to be “who is the bass professor”. I think he’s more likely to end up at a large public based on his playing level at this point in time and he’s mostly focused on the mid-Atlantic and maybe Ohio.
UMass has an exploratory track in the College of Social and Behavioral Sciences. As far as I can tell its meant to help pick majors within that school. I don’t think its meant for those who are undecided between business and poly sci. From the UMass website: “The SBS Exploratory Track allows you to dip a toe into the different majors within the College of Social and Behavioral Sciences. You can learn first hand what best matches your interests, goals and skills before declaring your major.”
@me29034 yes, D18 was undecided between studio art, chem, or physics! She is going to a LAC so signed up for art intro and some basic requirements while she figures it out. It’s hard because they are so different and I’m trying not to give strong opinions.
@homer that camp sounds awesome. WI is so pretty.
@mom23travelers yes! S19 has now totally flipped his focus and shook up his entire list. He originally wanted a big state school with lots of sports spirit. After visits, he realized the opposite. He still wants to watch sports but isn’t hung up on it. He’s now focused on the small privates, got rid of most big schools, and is researching how small he wants to get.
DD is about to drive herself back to work at camp right now. A 3 hour drive by herself. This will be a good test to see how she likes driving a distance to college.
She spent part of her break stressing over college choices and told me she was thinking about one in Minnesota. I thought it would be like 6 hours away but it’s only 4 and would have family just over an hour away (who happened to be visiting us this week so I could get their opinion). It has what she wants and is affordable. She said, “why don’t I just go there and be done with it?” We will definitely visit soon, but maybe she (and I) will relax for the rest of the summer knowing that there is one we both agree on at the moment.
We’ve definitely been avoiding those that require bussing to classes. Minnesota will be cold but it looks like the majority of the academic buildings connect and the campus is fairly compact. And living in Iowa she is familiar with winter 
@elena13 Sure, if you’re interested I can provide summaries of our visits. And yes, our visit with my aunt was really wonderful. She seemed well despite her brain tumor diagnosis (she’s undergoing outpatient micro-radiation treatments for two small tumors, a non-invasive option). And her home was remarkably unchanged from the 1970s when I was a small child visiting there every summer. She was full of stories and I did make a token 20-minute video of her. Our first college stop was Creighton.
Creighton University, Omaha NE: At about 4200 undergrads, this is a nice entry in the bigger-small category. They had a personalized touch – D19 was greeted with her name on a screen in the admissions office, and then was welcomed by two admissions officers who sat down with us. We weren’t there for an official summer preview day so we had our own tour guide afterward. Facilities here generally feel updated and posh, with the exception of the dorms which are just dorms. There’s a lovely church on campus that’s an active public parish. Lots of volunteering, with a center devoted to resources for volunteer opportunities. Respectable study abroad program w/ 20 official relationships and support for others, and a campus in the Dominican Republic. There’s a lot of Greek life, with about half the students joining, but no houses and they did seem relatively inclusive and relaxed. Downtown Omaha is pleasant and the pace is a reasonable match for D19. We were pleasantly surprised by a large impressive (free!) art museum within walking distance. In all, this is now D’s comfortable safety school where she would be happy. Main pros: solid academics & student quality, top 5% can be in Honors program, mellow, nice setting, likely-admit for D with probable merit offer and already-low sticker price making this very financially appealing. Main cons: no one in California gets excited about Nebraska, school isn’t as well known outside of the midwest and outside of medical circles.
Grinnell College: I put this on D19’s list because I spent time here myself as a high school student at a college-affiliated writing camp and I have fond memories. I didn’t know what to expect and D didn’t have a clue going in. But she was instantly charmed by the setting – we arrived early one evening and walked around. She was very energized, which again was surprising because it’s a sleepy summer evening in a town of 9200 and she’s all fired up. Lots of nice touches around town: public art and poetry, “All are welcome” signs, cute historic buildings. The next day’s info session was a partnership between a student and a thirtysomething AO, which was a nice vibe. Things they tout: no course requirements other than a first-year seminar and major requirements. That’s actually NOT a positive for me as Mom, but they sold me on it based on their close advising relationships with students (they have three advisors: academic, career, and residential), and opportunities to double major. They also have a lot of money and lavish students with resources: half million dollar budget for the student government, funding of research, internships, student groups. Definitely an environment of intellectual curiosity here. The elephant in the room is that it’s in a small town…but they play up their tight relationship with the townspeople, the peaceful vibe, their lavish funding of summer and study-abroad opportunities, and the fact that they therefore attract creative, dedicated students. One big negative for D19 is the housing policy, newly changed to not use gender as a criterion unless you opt for gender-specific floors and bathrooms. Otherwise, the new default is to assign roommates on personality and lifestyle factors only. This means even a first-year student could theoretically be assigned a roommate of the opposite sex. While D19 appreciates the inclusivity this allows for nonbinary students, she worries that the ethos here overall may be a bit too boundary-pushing for her comfort level. Since she could opt out and request gender-specific housing, it wasn’t a deal breaker but it definitely put some downward pull on her otherwise high level of enthusiasm. Main pros: wonderful intellectual spirit of inquiry, creative thinkers, relaxed vibe, Catholic church within easy walking distance, personalized, well-resourced experience. Main cons: chronic headache to get to Des Moines and then another hour to Grinnell, very liberal housing policy, D19 worries that she’s not quite liberal enough to really fit in, lots of Californians have never heard of it, no core requirements means D19 could probably get away with graduating very light on math and science.
University of Notre Dame: Beautiful, manicured, well-designed campus with abundant open spaces and overall lovely collegiate feel. Gorgeous cathedral. D19 was absolutely charmed by the physical spaces. The info session vibe was less homey than our previous two stops but the young white male AO was an affable fellow from Montana with a self-deprecating sense of humor. They tout: tradition, history, loyal alumni, being an elite research institution, “very proud” to be Catholic. There is no Greek life here. Instead the social scene and sense of identity comes from dorm life, with students generally staying in the same dorm for their full 3-4 years on campus. We ended up with our own tour guide here too since they had a few too many at the ready, and she was likable and spunky. Surrounding areas that we saw seemed a bit economically depressed, and indeed there was very little discussion of students enjoying the town. This basically felt like a universe unto itself. D19 was charmed. I liked it too, but not as much as she did. It’s still her dreamy reach. Main pros: harnessing the mystique of a special place, spiritual vibe, residential life, everyone has actually heard of this school. Main cons: would be full price, selectivity may well make all this moot anyway, less personalized attention, D19 is not a natural sports fan.
Macalester College: I started to feel a touch of burnout after three schools in three days, 500 driving miles and another flight, so I was glad this was our last stop. We both really liked the St Paul neighborhood where this is nestled. Beautiful old homes, lush green lawns, nice sidewalks. Macalester definitely uses its location as a selling point – lots of arts and theater in the Twin Cities, medical centers, public transit, professional sports. I didn’t get a sense that they are at the Grinnell level in really hooking up lots of students with those internships and helping to fund them, so one probably has to be more of a self-starter. They had a lot of things set up for us, including a student Q&A panel and lunch with two students, which was nice. The AO who did the info session is new and it showed…he’s not from a LAC background and that too showed. In all, Mac seemed like a solid option for D19 with several positives combined with no deal-breakers, but she wasn’t sparkly/in love with it at first visit. Stays on the list though. Main pros: almost a perfect residential urban setting (in my estimation), a reasonable set of core requirements, lively, bright students, potential merit offer. Main cons: student chatter suggested a possible Carleton Complex among students, probably as liberal as Grinnell so questions about fit.
In all, I was pleasantly surprised that D19 was as into Grinnell as she was, and I was extremely pleased that she felt good and comfortable about Creighton. Mac is great as another solid option, and Notre Dame did not lose its panache as a dreamy reach.
@homerdog Big schools typically have shuttles running at all times. U of Michigan has two unconnected campuses and I’m amazed at the system they have down. That said, most kids eventually move of campus and when they do they go around central campus. My S19 is moving off campus at McGill this year. I thought he would end up in the McGill Ghetto which borders campus. Instead he has gone 15-20 minutes (walking) to get a nicer place but still surrounded by lots of kids. (And I note that it is closer to the clubs!) Kids in college just walk a lot!
@SDCounty3Mom I just called Grinnell because I wanted to clarify the housing issue. The only difference now is that, if a male and female student wanted to live together, they can. The two choices for housing are (1) all women’s floors or all male floors or (2) a mixed floor where roommates are almost always like-gender and the bathrooms are indeed co-ed. Kids sometimes find roommates in FB groups before school starts. If they do not then the school has a very long questionnaire that matches students. A female student will not be put with a male student unless they request that.