In practice, AP Calc is kind of compulsory these days at top schools, regardless of major.
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If she has any interest in possibly doing business, it might be worth it to take Calc. It seems like a lot of schools, much preferred potential business majors to have taken Calc. However, I agree with what others are saying about first semester Senior being tough- college applications are like a whole extra class or more. It’s important to keep that in mind and not overload. Both my kids opted to take one free period and that helped a lot.
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TonyGrace–I guess it depends whether the student wants “top schools.” We are content with our options from U.S. News rankings 40-100. But I am no expert on the necessity of certain math courses. Perhaps she could take regular high school Calc, online?
Our high school has a phenomenal BC Calc teacher, we are extremely lucky. As a bonus, this same teacher offers multivariable calc the following year. I think he may also be the AB Calc teacher.
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It was standard (though I agree a bit less “compulsary”) even 30 years ago when I went to a top school. I’d say 85% of my freshman year floor had taken at least AP Calc AB (for a variety of curricular reasons it was pretty obvious and there were lots of study groups within the floor). I recall one who hadn’t taken any calc, and they were a double-legacy and not a STEM student..
BC seems far more common now, though, and more kids going beyond that…(used to be almost none IME).
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re: HS Calc - in addition to thinking about your child’s major, and if the math is something colleges expect to see for that major, I’d look at what is normal for your high school. If all the advanced students are in calc, and those are the same students your child will be competing with for whatever school he/she is most interested in, then it may take a second thought before deciding no calc. (Whereas if it’s rare at your school, then no problem, that’s what the admissions officers would see as normal.) And if you do choose to not take the calc class, that’s ok! Most (all?) applications seem to have an optional short answer question that’s something like “Is there anything else you’d like to share with us about your academic performance?” If it made sense for your child, they could write something like “Senior year I opted to take [whatever class] instead of AP Calculus. I wanted to focus on forming strong building blocks to support future math classes while also having sufficient time to devote to [insert name of extracurricular or hobby or whatever]. This compromise on math level has ultimately benefitted me by strengthening my math foundation and letting me pursue my interest.”
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You still almost certainly want to take calculus, if offered, for a 40-100 school for a business major to be competitive.
BU (in 40s) said in their admission tour you need calc for business or engineering applicants (with extraordinarily few exceptions).
I am sure less important as you go down list towards 100…
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Fully agree that context matters. You need to see what is “normal” at your school. Colleges will not ding you for taking a lower math if that’s what is available at your school and what the strong academic kids take.
At our HS, we have Calc AB, Calc BC, Multivariable Calc (this is equivalent to college Calc 3, comes after BC Calc), Linear Algebra, etc .
The non-stem/less academic kids tend take AP Stats senior year instead of one of the Calc classes.
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If you haven’t seen it Wesleyan (which is obviously a top LAC) with 17% acceptance (so higher than, say, Northeastern at 53 for unis.) gives amazing context for their incoming class:
(from the site:)
- HS Preparation:
- 85% have taken calculus
- 80% have taken biology, chemistry and physics
- 78% have a fourth year (or equivalent) of one foreign language
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I agree the context is really important. D22 was/is very humanities pointy. AP AB was a given (that was the natural progression of her course work, so fine - our school offers MV and Linear Algebra post AP) but was encouraged by the CC to take AP Physics C to stay competitive. I will say that the vast majority of her college classmates completed BC at a minimum.
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I am pretty confident those numbers would be even higher if you controlled for the school offering those courses.
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Non-STEM, no. Less academic, yes. (at our school, but I think this is typical at well resourced HS)
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Yep - have a fair # of international students who may have programs that don’t allow that breadth..(I think in UK you have to choose subjects for A-levels, and sometimes IB makes it hard to do all the things? not my expertise but I believe its something like that).
This also includes in hooked kids who are legacy, recruits, huge donors or what not.
My conclusion if you are a “regular” applicant you need to check all those boxes. To be clear it doesn’t say AP calculus, but I would bet most of them are taking at AP level
You’re probably right. The non-stem but highly academic kids who can’t stomach BC calc probably take AB Calc at our school. However, if you’re gunning for T20, it’s got to be BC calc (at our school) regardless of where your strengths lay.
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I wouldn’t say this is true at our school. You don’t get a STEM pass but the AB/BC at our school generally has to do with decisions that were made way back when and whatever track you where on before HS. Our MS didn’t offer geometry, so that was that. I don’t really subscribe to taking summer classes to accelerate and don’t believe colleges expect that.
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L_NewEngland, I know that I’m a dinosaur, but I find it sad that you are assuming that this student will be a business major (if not the other majors that I named that need AP Calc). I am an English professor at a regional university, and I think that all sorts of majors are legitimate–Psychology, Political Science, History, Philosophy, Music, Foreign Languages, etc.. Yes, my daughter took AP Calc, but it was AP Calc AB, and she has lots of merit offers from schools ranking from 43-150. I’m not sure if you meant to say that students applying for those majors need AP Calc. Do you really think that schools from 40-100 are going to require their Sociology majors to have taken AP Calc? Like I said, I’m not an expert–but I don’t think so.
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Wow. Thank you for all the responses! That turned into quite the discussion! D25 goes to a smallish (1400 students) rural, public school. She is on the highest track in math currently (taking honors pre-calculus as a junior). Her only options for next year are AP Calc AB or Trig/Stats. Most kids in honors pre-calc will go on to take AP Calc. There are about 20 kids on her math track out of a class of about 360. Our high school only requires 2 years of math to graduate and A LOT of kids take that route. We are in CA and our A-G rate (for UC schools) is pretty dismal.
She doesn’t want to study anything that requires a lot of math, but she wants a job that pays well. LOL. She has taken the SAT once (paper version) and got 680R and 580M, so obviously her strengths lie not with math. She is studying to take it again and is hoping to get the reading above 700 and the math in the mid 600s.
She will probably apply to some UC and CSUs as well as privates that offer good merit.
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A little different perspective.
My D opted to not take AP Calc this year and instead took Accelerated Calculus that falls between AP and college prep calculus. I really questioned whether we should have pushed her to take AP Calc, but it was the best decision. Math was a struggle and Algebra II-Honors and PreCalc-Honors are her only Bs. She spent as much time on those classes than all of the others combined. For whatever reason it was not coming to her. This year Calc is much better and it has freed her up for so much other stuff and really lowered the stress level in the house.
That being said, she is still taking 4 APs this year and 5 APs next year (Inc. Stats).
Maybe not having AP Calc will hurt, but with 11 APs and multiple DE and other classes–I think/hope she will be OK.
Her counselor is still marking her for max rigor, even without AP Calc–she asked!
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1400 is smallish??? That’s really big in our neck of the woods. My HS had about 425 total!
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I was responding directly to the person that said they wanted to do a business major (or meant to be doing that!). Totally don’t assume everyone should be a business major In fact I wouldn’t even recommend it and I have an MBA too;)
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