Paris deaths

@Matmaven. Yes, there are many Americans who dress like they would back home (sweats, athletic clothes) that make them stick out like sore thumbs. I try to stay as far away from them as I can :slight_smile:

I read in French a lot so I figure this may be useful to the topic of discussion. Those perspectives or topics are unlikely to be covered in the US, so if you’re interested in the situation I provide them to help; if the links are not authorized, please remove them as this is only meant to be of service to those who want to have more perspectives.

IF YOU ARE WITHOUT NEWS FROM SOMEONE IN PARIS, you can fill out information at the HOmeland Security’s website special form:
https://www.securite.interieur.gouv.fr/

If you can read French, those are some editorials.
This is one is by Le Monde:
http://www.lemonde.fr/attaques-a-paris/article/2015/11/14/l-effroi-et-le-sang-froid_4809971_4809495.html
It’s titled “Fright and sang froid” (in French, it rimes).
“France is at war. At war against totalitarian terrorism, blind, terribly murderous”.

Another editorial, here’s the lede, translated, because I think it’s behind a paywall:
http://www.mediapart.fr/journal/france/141115/la-peur-est-notre-ennemie
“Fear is our enemy: Friday November 13, an entire society was, in Paris and in St Denis, a target of terrorism : our society, our France, made of diversity and plurality, of encounters and mixes. This open-minded society is the one terror would like to close, to shut it up with fear, to make it disappear through horror. This is the society we must defend because it is our surer and most durable protection”.

They do have free reporting in English about the attacks; they include phone numbers to check on loved ones in hospitals.
http://www.mediapart.fr/en/journal/france/141115/least-129-dead-paris-terrorist-attacks-responsibility-claimed-islamic-state

About the concert hall, it’s well-known for avant-garde and cultural diversity:
http://www.telerama.fr/musique/le-bataclan-lieu-d-avant-garde-et-de-mixite-dans-les-annees-80,134142.php

A film about a group of French would-be djihadist planning an attack in Paris, due to be released on Wednesday, has been pushed back.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TiDhVoYPFTM

There’s the over-informed like me, and there’s the not-very-informed, such as my godchild, who was playing video games and was close enough that he heard the bombs go off (apparently it made buildings “shake”) but didn’t realize it was something “real” (sic). He had the good sense not to go outside to investigate, at least, and heard the news when his mother called to ask he stay in his apt. (I am not sure if I want to type :frowning: or :slight_smile: …)

“Carry on with your travel plans … everything will be OK. Just don’t display the American flag, even when you are actually in the US. We certainly don’t want to provoke the terrorists.”

I travel frequently internationally and I surely don’t display an American flag or try to outwardly signal that I’m American (though I’m sure it’s often obvious, especially when I’m not in Europe), I try to learn relevant phrases in the local language, I don’t wear gear that identifies me as American. That’s just common sense not to actively identify yourself that way - not for fear of provoking terrorists, but to avoid being a target for petty criminals. That’s just common sense, really. Nothing controversial. The only people who display American flags when they travel are inexperienced newbies who don’t know any better.

An excerpt from this interesting analysis in the Observer:

http://observer.com/2015/11/jihadists-attack-paris-again-the-world-is-horrified/

What makes you think we didn’t?

MYOS, are you yourself French, or an Americsn citizen living in France? (Or something else entirely)

Again, he was talking about car antennas. My car antenna resides here in the US.

In Travel as a Political Act Steves writes that displaying the American flag on car antennas “creates a fearful, schizophrenic dynamic that may stoke today’s terrorism and tomorrow’s international conflicts.” Steves, Rick (2009). Travel As a Political Act (Kindle ed.).

@pizzagirl: Neither, but part of my family is French living in France and I spend a lot of time there. I also happen to have family in intelligence.

123 Those on watch lists who are not French citizens should be deported and stricter border control measures should be implemented so that they cannot return. That would at least reduce the number that need to be watched.

MYOS, I also had been curious about your biography (for lack of a better word). You make me feel horrible uninformed, and I generally don’t think of myself that way. :slight_smile:

The actual number is closer to 11,000 if you add the “radicalized elements” to the “returnees”, and virtually all recruits are French. In the US we wouldn’t count “religious radicalization” as a factor for being in government files and normally it’d make me very, very uneasy to track people based on religious belief. Here, I’m not so sure.

The French government started to recruit more security after January but training takes time and most aren’t on the ground yet.

My biggest fear is that some of the many kids lured there out of idealism will be turned into suicide bombers. When the parents of “Léa” and “Clément” talk about their kids leaving, it’s as if we heard parents of Hannah and Aidan, HSfreshmen or sophomores who went off one day instead of going to school, vanished, and are now being brainwashed by ISIS, witnessing who knows what, forced to do who knows what.

“Travel as a Political Act Steves writes that displaying the American flag on car antennas “creates a fearful, schizophrenic dynamic that may stoke today’s terrorism and tomorrow’s international conflicts.” Steves, Rick (2009). Travel As a Political Act (Kindle ed.).”

Oh well. He’s entitled to his opinion. I never knew anyone really paid much attention to Rick Steves on any matter aside from travel guides. I certainly don’t care about his political opinions.

TatinG, perhaps I’m wrong, but I had assumed that most of the radical Islamists in France are French nationals, the descendants of immigrants and/or refugees from North Africa or the Middle East.

An interesting New Yorker article from a few months back about the despair in the Parisian banlieu cites.

http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2015/08/31/the-other-france

My son’s boss at the Princeton Art Museum (where he’s been working part time since the summer) is in Paris this week on business, and he’s very relieved to have just been able to find out that she’s OK.

Relieved that my cousin and his fiancé (of one week - he proposed in Paris one week ago) have at least been able to board a plane at CDG. Hoping they arrive home safely. Thoughts are with Paris and all affected. I believe that there are far more good people in the world than evil people. Good will eventually conquer evil.

My husband and I are in Rome on vacation right now. It’s weird being on vacation because you don’t really know what is going on but we do have wifi at our hotel and found sky news on the tv.

Anyways the town seems subdued. At the Roman forum we saw a couple speaking French and she was sobbing. I wanted to stop her and tell her we supported her and are so sorry but I felt dumb saying that so I let it go. She was sobbing and it was poignant.

We saw many more police than we have so far while we’ve been here. They closed the streets around the colosseum. I’m not sure how much this is because of the attacks or if this is because it’s Saturday. It’s hard to know because we are in a bubble and are not hearing any news. The traffic was very light in Rome and there were no street performers at the pantheon tonight.

Things feel odd but not. It’s hard to understand.

Just thought that some might be interested in how things seemed to me here in Rome. Lord know how things will be at the train station and the airport later in the week.

Now back to your regularly scheduled infighting :wink:

http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-cal-state-student-paris-shootings-20151114-story.html

The current tally is 128 dead, 99 critical, 352 wounded.

We were thinking about going to Europe in 2016–probably will go elsewhere instead. H prefers to stay out of Europe for now.

Violence is way too common and publicized. I don’t have answers and think the solutions will take time, resources and a lot of people working together.