The cost of letting people in versus keeping them out isn’t simply: 1 in x number but rather large numbers of people murdered and more wounded and millions, probably billions fairly soon, in additional security expenses plus the cost of fear, etc. I hate that kind of dramatic simplification: if you think we should let in people despite the terrible, terrible things that come with that and despite all the human and other costs associated, then say that but don’t talk dumb number comparisons. That bothers but not as much as the raft of articles that say in some version or another, “It’s the West’s fault …” because we do bad things, because we don’t mourn all people equally. That, to rant for a moment, is blunt racism: a form of the bigotry of low expectations in which we excuse whatever people do because they don’t qualify as full human beings who have minds and consciences and who actively choose to kill people.
A few points I haven’t seen mentioned, though I may have missed some:
The theatre was targeted, I'm sure, because it was believed to be Jewish-owned. That speaks to the hideous bigotry behind this, let alone the "political" carnage of war against the West. The theatre was sold 2 months ago but had been Jewish-owned for 40 years and I think it's reasonable to say the murderers thought it still was. The theatre had hosted Jewish events for many years.
The band playing had been in Tel Aviv this summer. In response to racist nutcase Roger Waters, they said, literally it has been reported, "**** you."
This was the new moon. Whether or no the murderers knew about the band, which could be a coincidence, that they attacked with the new moon is something right out of Islamic tradition. (To be clear, the crescent moon is very, very, very old as a symbol but it was adopted by the Ottoman Empire and has become the main Islamic symbol.)
I’ve mentioned this before, notably in the context of the Iranian bomb, but I’ve long said the main target of Islamic terror will be Paris. First, look at the contrast with Israel: knives and the occasional gun create fear but they’re not suicide bombs and automatic weapons in crowds. That speaks both to stronger security and, bluntly - which may shock a few people - much greater cooperation between the Israelis and Palestinians, both officially and unofficially, because people there share a small space in which violence does great harm immediately to all sorts of people and that creates incentives to cooperate to keep a lid on it. I’m not saying Israel is “better” but that many people share a desire to avoid hurting each other because they see the daily connection between this harm and that response and that harm and that response. In a big country, it’s much easier to turn your back, to avoid the conflict, to keep from getting involved. (In other words, like when Israeli undercover “troops” - whoever they are - went into a hospital this week and pulled out a Hamas guy who had stabbed a man they were tipped off, as they are nearly all the time raids occur. There is less of that in France (or Europe) because the physical areas are big so the relation between harm and your life is attenuated.)
But mostly Paris is a target because it is seen as the center of Western “thought” and “civilization”. Germany is the largest country and the largest economy but Paris is considered the heart. This is, in part, because the French speak about ideals and democracy and the meaning of citizenship.
How do you “fix” an eleven way civil war with 7 million refugees? This does not seem to me to be a simple problem that can be solved with money. Or even with money, an army and weapons.
Actually, the primary hypothesis in France is that Friday is a sacred Muslim day which the French, “land of whores and degenerates” as per Isis message (paraphrasing as I believe the words were stronger), use to go out, eat out, drink, meet up, flirt, etc.
Second, the areas targeted are located in Chinatown, as per the names (“Little cambodia” was hit and “Little Vietnam” was used as a rescue place), the pagoda, etc. They are nowadays half working-class (if you read a Tale of Two Cities, that’s where the French neighborhood would have been) and half hipsters. It’s a favorite place for people in their 20s and 30s to go out and get a drink and it’s known for being an ethnically very diverse crowd.
Think Brooklyn for a US equivalent, with a lot more Asians.
Third, the Bataclan MAY have been targeted because it used to be owned by Jews, but it’s also highly likely it was targeted because 1° for the past 30 years it’s been the symbol of avant-garde, indie bands, “métissage”, mixing of cultures, etc. 2° the 11th and 10th district targets were youth, because when you kill a young person, who affect their parents and grandparents, you kill youth and mark a generation, thus the impact is much bigger. 3° it’s not heavily secured unlike big, mainstream concert venues (for instance, the bombers didn’t manage to get into the Stadium because security is very tight there.)
Assad’s reaction was cynical and quite sickening (it was something like “oh well, too bad. You asked for it”. In better language.) Especially considering he’s the one who stoke the fire that made Isis so powerful.
Well, the West decided that Assad cannot continue to rule his country and has been arming the forces he is fighting.
How would you expect him to react?
Live in Iraq was stable under Saddam. It was horrible for many people, and many unthinkable things happened… but it was a stable and functioning country. Now, not so much. But, they have a democracy, woohoo!
It’s notable that the terrorists did not target iconic tourist sites. It would be easy to bomb the Metro at a tourist locale or the Champs Elysee. Those hop-on-hop-off open top buses all stop right inside the Louvre courtyard.
My take was that this particular attack was against the French people as payback for French airstrikes in Syria, not against Western Civilization. That’s not to say that future attacks won’t be against Western Civilization-- look at how those ISIS thugs butchered the ancient archeological site at Palmyra. Sickening…
In the US we mostly only have to worry about the run of the mill, armed-to-the-hilt, suicidal, mentally ill people w a chip on their shoulder.
We were in London on 7/7/05 and were in lockdown at the V&A for several hours while they were investigating a possible bomb outside. We weren’t staying too far from the attacks and the tube line which ran under the street we were on was shut down. Our younger daughter wouldn’t ride on a bus. Scary? Yes. We’ve gone back since and will travel again to Paris.
In response to someone’s earlier post that more carnage has been committed in the name of Christianity than in the name of ‘the religion of peace’, scroll down to the bar chart:
It’s disingenuous to be comparing deaths perpetrated by the Crusades in the Middle Ages to deaths in modern times. On the bar chart, note the increasing incidence of islamic terrorism deaths.
There are so many places to visit and not enough time anyway. I prefer H to be excited about where we will visit, so we chose destinations jointly (except when one of us has some commitment that drives the destination choice). There’s not much worse than traveling with a grumpy partner–not something I would purposely choose.
Another interesting article, about the Brussels connection: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/15/parking-ticket-paris-attacks-police-belgium-molenbeek. Separately, from what I’ve read, it seems that Brussels is a major center in Western Europe for buying illegal arms (you can easily buy just about anything there), a large percentage of them smuggled in from the Balkans. I have to wonder about the extent to which the major European organized crime groups – Corsicans, Italians, Russians, Albanians, and so on – are involved. I suppose it’s naive of me to think that any of them might care how the weapons they profit from are used.
Anyone see 60 Minutes last Sunday night? One segment was about what a poor job the federal government did in checking the background of those seeking classified security clearances. They missed known police reports and other red lights and people like the guy who shot up the Navy Yard were cleared.
Now consider that the government tells us that these unknown Syrian refugees who are coming to this country will be checked before being allowed to enter. I don’t have any faith that such checks can or will be done.
Yes, it is asking way too much. If you are wondering if criminals care how their weapons are used, then you and I have different definitions of the word criminal. I thought the definition of the word criminal essentially begins with “I do not care about [insert societal norms of criminals’ choice here].” Hence, that is why they are criminals.
Here is another article about how guns get throughout Europe. Pretty straight-forward in how guns are obtained. More importantly, this article destroys all this publication’s other articles about how to limit gun obtainability of criminals in pretty much every country on the globe.
Read the above carefully because this paragraph says any gun-restrictive country, which borders another country where guns are obtainable and borders are open, then there is no way to stop criminals from getting guns, regardless of the laws within the gun-restrictive country.
Anyone know a country with open borders that adjoins another country where guns and drugs are available. Hmm… Mexico adjoins a country that I currently cannot think of the name of…
I agree with @GMTplus7 - do not turn this into a gun control debate. However, France should serve as a lesson that criminals can always get guns, as long as there is something called trade between countries.
Our son left for a study abroad in London just shy of two months after those tube bombings in 2005. People thought we were crazy for sending him. We took the lead from his university which did not suspend the program’s abroad.
This is an awful situation. It is hard for me to understand how people can harm other people in this way.
@awcntdb Just like Iran and most other Arab countries, Syria always had its fair share of drinking, short skirts and somewhat reduced clothing for the past 65 or so years. Of course, there was a huge divide between larger cities and the countryside but Damascus and Aleppo certainly had their Westernized ways, both enlightened and enforced (as in universities studies abroad and “forced” exposure via human trafficking from Belarus and other former Soviet republics). Let’s just see whether the perpetrator was really Syrian or just had a Syrian passport and if he had been recruited recently or a long time ago.
This attack seems to have been planned and concerted on so many levels … my first thought was about the origin of “Friday or Tuesday the 13” which had to do with a French king killing hundreds of Knights Templar in the 14th century.
Source-wise this is just one theory of the origins but nevertheless an interesting connection to the Christian crusades.
I was being sarcastic. I do not buy into the fact that he was real Syrian refugee.
ISIS has been telling the West, since January, what they are going to do re refugees and infiltrating the West with sleeper cells and operatives. It is only Westerners who are not listening to them, as they continue to do exactly as they say.