<p>Their use of the word “guests” might be part of what they obviously thought was a clever strategy to throw future investigators off the track. In the same way, they coyly referred to Sandusky as “the subject” or some such – as if no one would be able to figure it out! </p>
<p>I wonder at what point Spanier remembered those emails floating around the university’s archives and realized just how scr*wed he was.</p>
<p>I suspect the attorney’s were looking for an out for PSU and this is the one they found.</p>
<p>From an earler post on p356:
"Required reporters—</p>
<p>(i) Persons who, in the course of their employment, occupation or practice of their profession come into contact with children and have reasonable cause to suspect, on the basis of their medical, professional or other training and experience, that a child coming before them in their professional or official capacity is a victim of child abuse."</p>
<p>It was pointed out that these PSU administrators would not likely be considered mandatory reporters because the victims were not children they would be responsible for “in the course of their employment, occupation or practice of their profession.” My suggestion, based on that legal interpretation, is that be referring to these victims as Sandusky’s “guests,” they could all hide behind this sad distinction, and insulate themselves from legal obligation. My thought (guess) is this question may have been raised by the attorney they contacted that Sunday night.</p>
<p>Attorney: Was the alleged victim in the shower a student or PSU athlete?
Curley, et al: No.<br>
Attorney: Well, you are not mandatory reporters for guests Mr. Sandusky brings onto campus. But to cover your a**, tell him not to bring such “guests” to campus anymore.</p>
<p>And perhaps further… </p>
<p>Joe P: The lawyers say we do not have to make a report? Well, then don’t do it. Just talk to Jerry. Tell him whatever the attorney advised. </p>
<p>And so forth.</p>
<p>“I wonder at what point Spanier remembered those emails floating around the university’s archives and realized just how scr*wed he was.”</p>
<p>apparently PSU changed their email system in '04 and all thought the older emails were irretrievable. At the time of the grand jury investigation, Curley et al did not believe anyone would ever have access to said emails. I had posted about that a few pages ago…I found that gratifying to think of their dismay learning they were retrieved. this was apparently what Spanier sued PSU about, he wanted to um, “refresh his memory by reading them” of course PSU refused him ;)</p>
<p>Ah, I didn’t know that about the email system changing in 04. I guess Spanier and Curley must have thought they really got away with it. Stupid – there’s always someone who can retrieve the irretrievable.</p>
<p>One expert says the NCAA will not and should not sanction Penn State–it would be like “shooting roadkill.”</p>
<p>[Expert:</a> PSU unlikely to face NCAA sanctions - York Dispatch](<a href=“http://www.yorkdispatch.com/sports/ci_21006641/expert-psu-unlikely-face-ncaa-sanctions]Expert:”>http://www.yorkdispatch.com/sports/ci_21006641/expert-psu-unlikely-face-ncaa-sanctions)</p>
<p>The article also has some facts and figures about the PSU athletic program.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>
Yes, By changing young victim to guest and rape to horseplay. They could tell the grand jury McQ told them Sandusky was only involved in horseplay w/ his guest in the shower.</p>
<p>clever and morally corrupt.</p>
<p>Two thoughts. …come in contact with children…Does that mean if I’m a soccer coach and I witness the coach of another team abusing one of his/her players, I am not a mandatory reporter? I’m a teacher on a fieldtrip and witness something from another student in another district?</p>
<p>Also," horseplay with a guest", cleverly change the words but can you change the fact that it was 9:00 or so at night, I’m guessing long after whatever event or activity took place was over. And that Sandusky and the young boy were the ONLY ones in the shower?</p>
<p>
Not clear. Did they “come before you in your professional or official capacity?” I think that language is intended to mean that those who come into contact with kids in their jobs or volunteer settings don’t thereby take on a liabiliy for failing to report outside those settings. Remember, there is no general legal duty to report. The difficulty comes, of course, when it’s a gray area. The ones you list might or might not be gray areas, depending on the facts.</p>
<p>What about the intent of the law? Does that make no difference? The intent is to protect a child from sexual abuse. I find this parsing of words and discussion of who is required to report disturbing. I think what is important in the law is the position and the authority of the required reporter, i.e. teacher, coach. Teachers, administrators, coaches, etc. should report abuse by virtue of their authority, imo.</p>
<p>OhioMom…hope you didn’t think I was looking for a way to “get out” of reporting potential abuse, only the absurdness of how the required reporter law is apparently written, applied, and enforced.</p>
<p>The intent of the law is to protect children, but it also is intended to be limited in terms of who can be held criminally liable for failing to report.</p>
<p>@bluejay, I understand. What I don’t understand is why it would ever be permissible under the law for a teacher, administrator or coach not to report a suspicion of child rape.</p>
<p>as others have mentioned, clearly Spanier himself recognized the legal need to report as he stated they could be vulnerable for not reporting. We don’t know if that was based on his professional awareness or their legal consultation. </p>
<p>Nonetheless they were willing to take a chance at this let’s instead just talk with the “person” as an alternative strategy. It defines who they are that they never even mentioned the child…their strategizing was completely about themselves, and not about protecting children. I certainly hope he is indicted, and that this impacts Spanier’s current position on a national security project.</p>
<p>how can it be justified that prior to the PSU scandal shaking out it was seen appropriate to put Spanier in a position protecting national security. Character references anyone? </p>
<p>“Former Penn State University President Graham Spanier, who was forced from office in the wake of the Jerry Sandusky child abuse scandal, is now working in Washington on a national security project, according to the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review.”</p>
<p>Even if they are found not to be mandatory reporters, it’s obviously true that they were vulnerable for failing to report.</p>
<p>
Again, it’s because the law doesn’t require even teachers to report all cases they see anywhere in their lives, just those they see in their professional capacity. In their private lives, their obligations in this regard are the same as yours and mine.</p>
<p>^^^
True but those obligations are should be determined by common decency.</p>
<p>My point is just that moral and legal obligations aren’t the same.</p>
<p>Standards for Making a Report
The circumstances under which a mandatory reporter must
make a report vary from State to State. Typically, a report
must be made when the reporter, in his or her official capacity,
suspects or has reasons to believe that a child has been abused
or neglected. ANOTHER standard frequently used is when the
reporter has knowledge of, or observes a child being subjected
to, conditions that would reasonably result in harm to the child.
Permissive reporters follow the same standards when electing to
make a report.</p>
<p>Pennsylvania
Professionals Required to Report
Cons. Stat. Tit. 23, § 6311
Persons required to report include, but are not limited to:
• Licensed physicians, osteopaths, medical examiners, coroners, funeral directors, dentists, optometrists,
chiropractors, podiatrists, interns, nurses, or hospital personnel
• Christian Science practitioners or members of the clergy
• School ADMINISTRATORS, teachers, school nurses, social services workers, daycare center workers, or any other child
care or foster care workers
• Mental health professionals
• Peace officers or law enforcement officials</p>
<p>As a mandated reporter myself, the professionals I know and I take this role quite seriously, and would never think of hiding behind some bs, when a child’s welfare is at stake.</p>
<p>If I was writing a mandatory reporting law, it might not occur to me to include coaches/administrators/etc at a college/university reporting the abuse of a minor child. I am not saying that anyone involved in this mess should not have called CPS or the police. I just think it’s possible that the situation was not covered in the law…an oversight, because before now, who would have thought this situation would occur (not the abuse, unfortunately, but the complete failure to call the police/CPS/etc). </p>
<p>I seem to recall a state recently enacting legislation to cover this situation.</p>
<p>My confusion, gray as described bu HUNT, does the child need to be in my direct contact? my class? my grade level? my school? my district?</p>
<p>A pretty detailed explanation of the lawsuits going forward:</p>
<p>[Tim</a> Curley’s Choice: Sell Out Joe Paterno And Penn State Football? - SBNation.com](<a href=“http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-football/2012/7/3/3134523/joe-paterno-penn-state-scandal-trial-tim-curley]Tim”>Tim Curley's Choice: Sell Out Joe Paterno And Penn State Football? - SBNation.com)</p>
<p>One point the author makes is that Pennsylvania law on the subject is “underdeveloped.” He also says that the statute of limitations for criminal prosecution of failure to report is 10 years, so Curley and Shultz are not on the hook (criminally) for the 2001 incident. Is that right? If so, which incident(s) have they been charged for?</p>
<p>Civil suits can be filed until the victims are 30, which seems too limiting to me.</p>