<p>“And, at the risk of repeating this broken record, only self-interest at the NCAA and the Big Ten allowed a game to take place this weeked. And, IMHO, that is shameful.”</p>
<p>Agreed, and the so-called punishment meted out by the NCAA had very little to do with Penn State, and everything to do with the NCAA maintaining its image and its pocketbook. But PSU had the capacity to take control of the situation, and muffed it. Every game of football they play reminds folks of the scandal, and their failure to get a handle on it. They would be in a much better position had they cancelled the next several seasons and regrouped. And the students, experiencing such unequivocal leadership, would be as well.</p>
<p>Clearly Joe Paterno was the whole problem at PSU. So, are you guys gonna get Jerry Sandusky set free? I know, I know, who the heck is Jerry Sandusky.</p>
<p>collegekidsmom, this is the second time on this thread you have viciously attacked me personally. I cannot fathom how any reasonable adult can consider my post sickening and outrageous. It was not I who allowed a child molester free access to a deserted locker room knowing full well he liked to get naked with children. Nor did I hurt your school’s reputation by making terrible choices in the name of protecting a sporting program. I question why you and others do not focus your anger and betrayal at the leaders of your school, most particularly the one man who held too much power and abused it. It was Paterno, not us, who let you all down. </p>
<p>Yet when I and others point these undeniable facts, your response is to call me an evil and twisted person? I think the terms “evil” and “twisted” belong to the molester and his accessories, don’t you? Really. </p>
<p>I do relatively little posting on this thread so I appreciate the others here who have posted they agreed with my questions. Why, then, collegekidsmom are you not posting that they, too, are all “evil and twisted”? Is it because you wish to bully me personally? </p>
<p>And all because I suggest you rethink your admiration and loyalty to the men who betrayed you all? You actually go on to accuse me of not caring for the victims of Sandusky’s abuse. You posted that your rightful anger is at ME? How ever can you live with yourself? What moral rationale do you have for such a disgusting and unsupported slur? I am offended and shocked at the lengths you will go to defend these criminals. And all because you love – beyond good sense-- a football team. </p>
<p>My original post: Why aren’t the PSU supporters, alumni, and parents of students who post to defend your students not aggravated, sickened and outraged at what JoePa did to you? Not what the NCAA did, or what posters here who would like to see the football program more severely altered did. It seems you represent a strong point of view that is frankly baffling. Who hurt you and hurt your great sports team? It was your own University President and a very old football coach covering up for a sex criminal. I suppose if we heard a sense of anger directed at the appropriate targets–the coach you all loved and respected and put on a pedestal, it would be easier to believe the university could see straight. But despite some posts that speak kindly about the children victims and decry molestation, where is your rightful anger at these men in charge of your football team for decades who hurt…Penn State?</p>
<p>The reply: Madbean, your post is aggravating, sickening and outragous. It also reflects the views of the media and other posters. You think the appropriate target is Joe Paterno? You are one very twisted and evil person. Yes, Paterno was guilty of failing to stop a child molester. Penn State needs to prevent that from happening ever again. Jerry Sandusky molested children. Remember him? Of course not. You don’t give one hoot about the molester or the victims. You are on a witch hunt and won’t stop until YOUR target is destroyed. My rightful anger is at people like you who are doing such a great job of taking the spotlight off of this crime against children, finding others who molest and help for the victims.</p>
In a recent discussion I was in regarding whether or not Penn State football should have been cancelled, I raised the subject of punishing the innocent. The opinion was that no football for a season or two was a change, not a punishment. A needed change that people would adapt to, and life would go on for everyone at Penn State without football. </p>
<p>I mentioned the $10 million generated for the local community by each home game. People were surprised it was that much, and it did give some pause. No one wanted small business owners to be hurt, and for that reason there were some opinions in favor of keeping football.</p>
<p>But in general, in my small corner of the world, there is a feeling of disgust at the thought of Penn State football. Justified or not, it’s there. Sorry.</p>
<p>“JoePa brought this on the university, with the acquiescence of a weak President and Board whom he had bullied into submission. ALL of Penn State’s problems must ultimately be laid at JoePa’s door. He did this.”</p>
<p>LasMa–I have agreed with your position throughout this thread, however, this is in my opinion, one of the problems. Paterno has been held to a higher standard than Spanier. </p>
<p>Spanier was the PRESIDENT of PSU. As such the buck stopped with him. I don’t for one minute buy that he was bullied by Paterno, or simply acquiesced. He chose to conceal Sandusky’s crimes exactly as Curley, Schultz and Paterno did. He needed to LEAD, and if Paterno was pushing back on their plan, then he needed to tell Paterno NO. </p>
<p>To claim Paterno bullied Spanier is to pretend we are talking about 6th grade boys on the playground. Spanier was a grown man, a seasoned professional, he knew exactly what it was he was doing. He understood the risks of not following Paterno, but also stated out loud the risks of following him, yet still, he opted for that. For the life of me I don’t get how you can hold Paterno more accountable than Spanier, which the university is also doing. In this respect it is more about the true failure of leadership at a university and not about football.</p>
<p>I don;t think it an issue of who to hold more accountable, but rather what they did. In the case of Spanier, it may have been holding a blind eye. In the case of JoePa, it was active facilitation of a criminal enterprise - with money, title, prestige, position, facility, opportunity, and coverup; and did so well before Spanier entered the scene. Each should be held accountable for what they did. </p>
<p>Spanier’s failure also represents the failure of the academic side of the university, where faculty and programs benefited hugely from the profits and prestige of its football team. </p>
<p>So it’s not a question of who should be held more accountable, but what they should be held accountable for.</p>
<p>I agree with myturn on this. If Paterno attempted to overpower Spanier and Spanier stood firm I do not see how he could have lost. The minute he says I wanted to report suspected child abuse and the coach tried to stop me how does the BOT not support him?</p>
<p>I think people keep questioning the adoration for JoePa, the questions keep turning back to him, is not because Sandusky, Spanier, BOT, et al, don’t all share their own level of guilt in this, but because JoePa is the only one still held up on a pedestal by so many. No one is posing with life-sized cutouts or bobble-heads of Sandusky or Spanier during pre-game.</p>
<p>Exactly my feeling. If Paterno had power - then Spanier LET him have that power. Next to Sandusky - Spanier is the one most responsible for this mess.</p>
<p>But mini, Spanier could have reeled Paterno in, could have refused to permit Sandusky’s position and opportunity, ostensibly provided by Paterno…at least after the 2001 incident. This was a concerted concealment by all of them. I don’t believe Spanier when he says he didn’t know Sandusky, or McQueary. He insults everyone’s intelligence when he plays that one.</p>
<p>I do believe that Spanier was bullied by Paterno. Spanier wanted Paterno to leave in 2004 and not only did Paterno refuse, but Paterno publicly mocked him for even trying.</p>
<p>I think they should all be held accountable, but for different things. The trustees made it pretty clear, consistently, that JoePa had more power than Spanier. Spanier should have done more - his sins are sins of omission. JoePa’s are in an entirely different class - he facilitated a criminal enterprise. (Now if we find out that Spanier approved the checks that sent the former Professor Emeritus to the Alamo Bowl, then we are in different territory. I think it is likely, but I don’t know that Spanier approved the unusual $160k payout to the former Prof. Emeritus, and his title. But the action itself came from JoePa.)</p>
<p>He had more power as a succesful football coach not as someone who would protect a child molester. Now it is wrong for the football coach to ever be more powerful than the college president but I can see no way Paterno would not have lost the battle on that issue.</p>
<p>Since you agree with Coureur, Xiggi, please enlighten how statements such as this further a meaningful dialogue. Do you agree with using Nazi Germany to advance discussion? Are there better examples? </p>
<p>Coureur: "Good point. At the risk of triggering Godwin’s law, the example of WWII is instructive. Coming out of the ashes the Germans did not carry on with the “Sieg Heil!,” the parades, the mass rallies, and one-armed saluting stuff. They didn’t go around saying “Hey I didn’t personally invade countries or create death camps; that was done by just a few bad guys at the top of the government. Nothing to do with me. So I want to carry on with all the same nationalism, attitudes, salutes, and public rituals that I enjoyed so much before the war.” No they quietly set about building a new and different Germany, one that is now the envy of Europe and is respected around the world.</p>
<p>Now in NO WAY am I equating Penn State with Nazi Germany, but I think it’s an instructive example of how an organization can quietly and humbly go about rebuilding itself to greatness and recover from a huge setback based on wrongdoing by its leaders.</p>
<p>Unfortunately, Penn State appears to be bent on clinging to the attitudes, rituals, and trappings of its former regime, including great reverence for its former leader."</p>
<p>Also, feel free to proofread my post and correct any typos or grammatical errors, if you feel the need. Amusing.</p>
<p>Grcxx3: Son thought the Blue Band was AWESOME! Appreciate your generous advice. </p>
<p>For those who are concerned that my son is now morally bankrupt or depraved because he attended a Penn State football game, he’s not.</p>
<p>I would be concerned that he is receiving mixed ethical messages from his university’s leadership, and I am sorry that he is expected to study in the JoePa Library. I wish him well.</p>
<p>Mini, I would add that I am sorry that the student is at a school where the faculty and the board do not unequivocably say enough with the football worship. We have a lot of great things here, but football does not make the school. We need to take a breather. I see more anger of faculty and board at the NCAA, rather than saying we need to change. PSU can view this as an opportunity to go from a good school to a great school. Or not.</p>
<p>It’s hard for me to read everyone who keeps writing “they just don’t get it”. Who are “they” and how do you know they don’t get it. From my persepctive, I see so much good happening. Really. There are so many amazing ideas for future classes, committees, conferences, funds for education, treatment, support, etc. etc. There are tens of thousands of students who get it and will take that understanding into their future communities, work places, and homes. Just think of how many children may be protected from future harm because so many people do “get it”. There are so many faculty (those in the School of Education is one such group - but many others), students and others who are working to make a difference. So - who are these people you’re so sure of don’t get it?</p>
<p>As I’ve mentioned already - I went to the football game on Saturday. And I’m glad I did. I had such a nice day with my family. I got to visit my son, who even though I only said goodbye to a short time before, I already missed him. I love visiting college towns - no matter where. It’s such a fun feeling and it brings back so many good memories from my days (not at Penn St.). I had a great weekend. SO - does that mean that I don’t get it? I clapped for Penn St. - I did. Does that make me not “get it”? As I’ve mentioned before - I’ve dedicated my career to child protection and investigating sexual abuse. Do I not “get it”? </p>
<p>Now - continuing issues with BOT, whether charges are filed against certain people, outcomes of criminal trials…those are all out of my hands - and the hands of all students, faculty, etc. I am outraged by what happened - and I’m saddened both for everyone affected by the abuse - and for the students, faculty and staff that are impacted now. But, I also see how my son has grown, how he’s being educated, the amazing opportunities he has had and will have and the person he is becoming and I know this is due to the education and support he receives. I am thankful for that and for Penn State. </p>
<p>Please realize that even if I am supported my son, his school and yes, even attending a football game - that doesn’t mean that I don’t get it. It doesn’t mean that the students, parents, faculty, and fans don’t get it. It means that we understand that the horrible thing that happened - was caused by a small number of people. We need to make sure that never happens again - at Penn state or anywhere. It is possible to move on - go back to school - go back to playing football - and even cheer on a University…but, that doesn’t mean we don’t “get it”. We do “get it”…I promise.</p>