<p>I didn’t say the statistics were meaningless; I said they are incomplete and don’t have context.</p>
<p>For example (and I’m making this up) - to say that “70% of all drowning deaths occur in public pools with lifeguards” may be factually accurate, but it has no context unless you know what % of all swimming-man-hours occur in public pools with lifeguards.
If only 30% of all swimming-man-hours occur in public pools with lifeguards, but 70% of all drowning deaths happen there - wow, that’s pretty scary.
However, if 80% of all swimming-man-hours occur in public pools with lifeguards, but only 70% of all drowning deaths happen there - then, that’s not scary at all - if anything, they’re safer.
That’s all I mean. The number is meaningless without greater context.</p>
<p>If I say “10% of all murders in the US happen in my state,” do you feel differently if the state is California or Delaware? Why? Because having that gives you the CONTEXT if you’re talking about a state with 10% of the US population or a state with a miniscule amount of the US population.</p>
<p>Which is meaningless unless you know what % of black-swimming-hours, white-swimming-hours and Hisp-swimming-hours occur in public, residential and neighborhood pools. This may merely reflect where they are all swimming, not anything about the inherent safety of each venue.</p>
<p>For many years I’ve bought seasonal family memberships to community (semi-private–residents and guests only) and public (city) pools. These are nothing fancy and cost less than $100/year. I’ve seen various groups come and go at the pools and at other places like parks, skating rinks, etc. I suspect that the negative reaction had to do with the kids’ behavior and lack of adult supervision (I don’t mean lifeguards–I mean there is a big difference between a large group of kids with a few camp leaders and kids who come with siblings/parents) rather than skin tone. The type of behavior that is considered normal or acceptable among the day care kids was probably not what the pool members were expecting, and this contributed to an unpleasant experience. No excuse for racist comments. (Standards differ widely–what some adults think of as “kids will be kids” “just having fun” behavior would be defined as “loud, rude, hyper, obnoxious and completely out-of-line” by others). If all parents would teach their kids to be “good guests” even in public places, everyone could enjoy themselves with fewer complaints. If the pool finds it necessary to rent out to groups, they should let members know which groups are attending when so there will be no surprises. (If I knew that a day care group of 65 kids would be at the pool one afternoon, well, that’s the afternoon I’d stay home–doesn’t matter what color the kids are).</p>
<p>The kids behavior was never an issue even according to several club members present at the time who characterized the kids behavior as “exemplary”. There was also plenty of adult supervision. It would be easy to blame it on the kids or the camp counselors, but 'complexion" was the real issue, not noise or rowdy kids.</p>
<p>Obviously, I wasn’t there. But as I said, standards/expectations differ widely. One person might say “exemplary.” Someone else might be thinking “terrible.” (And possibly afraid to say it because they’d be called racist?)</p>
<p>Based on my experience, I can’t imagine any large group of kids NOT being noisy and rowdy at the pool.</p>
<p>I agree with you, atomom. And standards of behavior that might be fine at a public pool (raised voices, yelling / shouting, tossing around balls with glee, splashing water with vigor) might not be fine at a private pool. I might expect to deal with being splashed with water or being hit by a beach ball from overenthusiastic kids at a public pool; I wouldn’t expect that at my private pool, except by accident, and I’d expect the lifeguards to enforce a “tighter” standard of behavior.</p>
That’s a good question. I also have to wonder whether agreeing to rent your club out to public groups in limited circumstances means that all aspects of your club, including eligibility for membership, become subject to antidiscrimination laws. It may be that under some state laws, they do. (This is primarily about state law, by the way, a point that some seem to be missing here.)</p>
<p>I’d be satisfied if the club, during its own investigation, determined who ( were there many? ) insulted the students and dealt with them. The actions of a few caused this unfortunate incident.</p>
<p>PG’s point about behavior being more acceptable in one place than another brings me to another point. Just the perception on the part of the members as the daycare kids arrived that they WOULD BE out of hand is probably what led to the whole thing. Whether racial insults were uttered (which would be unacceptable), the members’ eyes probably rolled back in their heads in anticipation of what was likely to come.</p>
<p>Due to the lawsuit, Now nobody will open up their facilities for under privileged kids. It also keeps on reinforcing the perception that black social workers are fast and lose with crying racism when things don’t go their way.</p>
<p>Note that when this misunderstanding occurred, it’s pretty apparent that the majority of club members and management were NOT racist, felt apologetic as to how it was mishandled, and offered to reinstate the day camp as soon as some details could be worked out.</p>
<p>The day camp could be classy back and use this as a means of building bridges (you know, it wouldn’t be a bad idea for some black kids in NE Philly to befriend presumably-wealthier kids in HV). I understand that they are hurt, but one can learn to rise above and take the hand when it is offered.</p>
<p>PEOPLE, the reason why the day care is allowed to sue the private club is because the club TOOK their membership money. Therefore, this is no longer a private issue. Had the club not taken their money and refunded them so quickly, this wouldn’t even be an issue.</p>
<p>Private clubs can still open their pools to underprivileged kids. They must understand that once they accept membership money, they better let groups know their accommodations.</p>
<p>^^ Doesn’t matter. The club accepted the money. It’s technically a contract (legally-binding). What took place on that day was unfortunate and unacceptable. A lawsuit is very possible in this case. If there is any evidence of racial discrimination, the government has the right to investigate the matter. Considering this is a small private club, I don’t think this will go to trial. However, there is a high possibility of a settlement.</p>
<p>What settlement? Have you ever been to a pool like that one? Swimming pools are not posh ritzy establishments rolling in cash; most of them operate on a tight budget and are very lucky to break even to stay afloat. The CNN story says the club does not have any money for a settlement or even legal fees, and there is a good possibility that it will close for good. The daycare managers celebrate their victory, the pool members get angry, and the kids… lose. Are legal actions always the best solution?</p>
<p>“Considering this is a small private club, I don’t think this will go to trial. However, there is a high possibility of a settlement.”</p>
<p>This is all absurd. This is a neighborhood swim club. There is no deep pocket here. The club is apparently barely able to pay its operating expenses, let alone hire attorneys to defend this ridiculous lawsuit. They have no assets, other than the club itself. They will have to turn to their insurance policy and hope that this sort of silly lawsuit is covered, and then next season their rates will skyrocket. All of the board members will resign (do you suppose that this club has D&O insurance?), and NO ONE will want to replace them. Who wants or needs to spend their free time over the next few months or years answering interrogatories and attending depositions?</p>