I’m assuming military culture changes as the decades go by and there is better training and leadership with regard to people who do not fit the white-straight-guy norm.
I’d hope someone who served 10-20-30 years ago would find differences today.
This wasn’t banter, locker room or otherwise. It was targeted to ONLY black cadets and it was a direct command - “go home”. Not just a slur.
It depends on the context. Friends of different races ragging on each other about race or ethnicity is fine, so long as they realize nothing being said is serious. I had a friend in the military, who was Native American, tell me he would, “slap the white off my face.” I don’t remember what the conversation was about, but I remember that particular insult because it was so weird and I couldn’t stop laughing. That’s very typical of the kinds of things you’d hear people say to each other in the military, and it went on all the time. People who think otherwise simply don’t understand how guys in their late teens and early twenties, and who in the the military, talk to each other.
I can easily imagine someone jokingly telling a black friend, “Go home n*****.” and everyone laughing. The problem with an insult on a whiteboard is that you can’t tell if it was a genuine threat or a joke. And I still wouldn’t be surprised to learn that the supposed targets of the insult were the ones who wrote it on the whiteboards. That kind of thing has happened before. People who are absolutely convinced that this was a threat are jumping the gun.
I was in the Air Force in the late 70s-early 80s, but I’m not buying into the idea that what was acceptable to say then isn’t acceptable now. It’s just that people have become absurdly hypersensitive about it.
Friends telling ethnic jokes to each other happens in non-military contexts as well. Although it is often the case that people tell ethnic jokes about their own ethnicity’s stereotypes more than others.
However, most people know that telling such ethnic jokes outside of friends they know well can easily be misinterpreted in a bad way (especially when written where they can be photographed and blasted all over the place on social media), so they do not do that. Also, anonymously-written “go home [ethnic insult]”, particularly with lack of any context, is unlikely to be seen as just a joke.
Somebody needs to educate Lt. Gen. Silveria on how typical and acceptable this is in the military, because apparently he simply doesn’t understand either. Someone should also explain that he’s jumping the gun by assuming this was a threat.
In the absence of information indicating that this was a joke how else should this be treated? Should we tell the cadets “Get over this. You’re being too sensitive.”?
You said you had served in the late 70s. What makes you think what was ok then is ok now? Has the country not changed since then?
Also, what if this is a threat? What do you think should be done then?
Reserve judgement. There was no indication that it wasn’t a joke gone wrong, either. I’m reminded about how people jumped the gun in the Duke lacrosse and Virginia fraternity rape accusations. Last year you had the two girls at SUNY-Albany claim they were assaulted on a bus due to their race, and then it turned out to be false.
Once this became public, he had to say that for public consumption.
What’s changed is that people have become hypersensitive, and everything is over-interpreted to the extreme. Kids get suspended from school for pointing their hand like it’s a gun. I hate using the term “snowflake”, but that’s what lots of people have become.
What you call hypersensitivity I call progress.
I for one am glad that we as a country do not tolerate this kind of behavior.
For the record, even in the 70s the n- word was totally unacceptable, and for many people well before that.
Given the history of the military (not singling out a branch) and AA’s, its entirely possible that they never enjoyed the bantering, but did not feel empowered to act on it. While I’m sure there are/were one or two AA’s who were comfortable allowing other people to call them whatever (if we are using the it’s fun banter between friends excuse), I would never assume all were. I’d be inclined to believe most weren’t, but again did not feel they were in a position to say anything. Personal experience from AA family members who served in the military in the 60’s and 70’s (including Air Force) is quite different from what you are saying. They do not describe a racially harmonious environment with funny jokes. I am glad that in 2017, there are things that will not be tolerated.
For the record, I agree we should wait to see who did it and the intent. However, I’m not willing to ever be an apologist for this type of behavior. It is dangerous and divisive… it is most certainly not a prank.
I’m one who thinks that being drunk tends to reveals your true self. I don’t know anyone who would do this drunk or sober.
I get that in the context of bantering people may push boundaries, but IMO this is different. And the only way to stop it is to nip it in the bud.
A LOT has changed since the 1970s in the military. What a weird idea, that nothing would change in nearly 50 years.
There are a ton more female service members in it. There are openly gay service members in it. There are transgender service members in it.
Most relevant to this incident, there are far more not-white people, that number has grown since the draft ended and the military went all-volunteer.
Further, this academy is grooming cadets to enter officer training - leaders - not enlisted soldiers who can likely get away with more “jokes”.
What a shame, turns out the racial slurs were written by one of the alleged victims…
Turns out that the cadet wanted to divert attention from his own behavior so he wrote racial slurs against himself and other classmates, at least they booted him out.
@CU123 You’re right; http://gazette.com/air-force-academy-finds-cadet-candidate-responsible-for-racist-messages/article/1614770
It’s too bad, because when people make false reports, then the next time a real incident happens (and we know they will), people are more likely to dismiss it.
Who said that?? Oh, I said that! And got blasted for it.
I expect, nay, DEMAND, some apologies.
It’s been five minutes. Where are my apologies??
“Have you ever been in the locker room of a men’s sports team?”
My husband was on a high school varsity sports team and then in a fraternity in the 1980s. He heard and said plenty of explicit things, but not this, and also nothing about grabbing people by the genitals.
^^A lot more than 5 minutes now.
Some of the posts here are pretty damn pompous, and borderline funny, especially the;
“And to say that the A-A cadets might have done it themselves? That too is deeply offensive.”
Jumping to conclusions when a news story fits a narrative is becoming a national pastime. http://www.kansascity.com/news/local/article183086416.html
Occasionally, people in minority groups do this for…various reasons that don’t make any sense to anyone, least of all those of us from the group.
That does not, however, negate the fact that these things do actually happen and are in the VAST majority of cases not perpetrated by the victims themselves. This is the same as trying to redirect attention from sexual assault and rape by claiming “Well, sometimes people falsely report rape!” Sure, sometimes people do, and they should be held responsible for their actions. Just like this cadet should be held responsible for his really, really poor choices.
But I think it’s even more telling that people like to jump straight to that before anything leans one way or the other, or that people like to believe that it doesn’t happen at all, or - even worse - that people jump straight to minimizing racist slurs or sexist jokes as just “locker room talk” or “part of the culture” and people who are hurt by words that are deliberately intended to minimize and discriminate against people as “snowflakes”. That’s like saying if I kick you in the groin and it hurts, you’re a “snowflake,” even though I deliberately did something to hurt you. On purpose.
Why is it that other people’s ability to laugh and joke without guilt is deemed more important than my right to be treated like an equal human being?