<p>Wash your raw veggies, and ideally, get them from local and/or organic farmers so you know where they come from.</p>
<p>Just because there have been some highly-publicized outbreaks is no reason to stop eating all raw vegetables. I think the outbreaks were the result of poor farming techniques–spinach farms located next to agri-cattle farms with tremendous amounts of uncontrolled runoff.</p>
<p>OTOH, recent research has shown that the nutrients in some foods are MORE available to the body when they are cooked, so there you go. Scientists are discovering new things every day, some of which contradict the old things, as you have noted!</p>
<p>Oh, I didn’t mean restrict in an anorexic sense, I just meant not eat massive quanitities of low-nutrition food, which is what college and sorority life lends itself to quite well :). In fact, I’m off to dinner as soon as I post this :).</p>
<p>Also, just FYI, washing raw vegetables does NOT kill ingrown bacteria (bacteria in the vegetables, not just on them)… And there are far more then a few outbreaks each year and most aren’t well publicized… See the link in post #1.</p>
<p>Thanks for all the suggestions, by the way.</p>
<p>wolfpiper these outbreaks are still very rare occurances. I am 47 and have been eating raw fruits and vegetables my entire life. I have never been sickened by them, nor has anyone I know. Do you know anyone who has? Your fear seems a little unreasonable/overstated to me.</p>
<p>5 people get sick in Podunk and everyone in the US hears about it and freaks out. Toughening up on some bacteria is generally good for you–it makes you stronger. Many think being too clean and fearful has made people weaker.</p>
<p>Yeah. wolfpiper, there have been a number of instances where pedestrians were killed by vehicles running onto sidewalks! How can you walk outside given that imminent danger!?</p>
<p>I agree with the above posters. LOL, 1of42! Not to mention RIDING in a car really is dangerous.</p>
<p>But there is hope for the fainthearted veggie lover:
“Susan S. Sumner of Virginia Polytechnic Institute in Blacksburg finds that washing tainted produce with water “is better than doing nothing–but not a whole lot better.” Later this year, however, she and graduate student Jim Wright plan to report that they can infect apples with a deadly strain of E. coli at a concentration of 10,000 bacteria per gram, then eliminate them all by dipping the fruit in a nontoxic mix of vinegar and off-the-shelf hydrogen peroxide. This E. coli, known as O157:H7, has been implicated in the deaths of people who consumed tainted cider or hamburgers.”</p>
<p>And I have never heard of deadly bacteria that live IN the fruits/veggies. These live on the surface and are the result of contaminated water or poor hygiene among the farm workers.</p>
<p>I eat raw veggies but I just can’t go back to bagged baby spinach leaves. So many were killed or sickened… including that poor toddler who was served a shake with spinach. I read a follow-up article recently and they really haven’t corrected the problem that initially caused the outbreak. No more bagged produce for me…
Overreaction? Maybe…but I think I’ll do just fine without it. I actually like frozen spinach.</p>
<p>Not so. If the bacteria was only on the surface, then washing would help. The bacteria is internal, so cooking or irradiation is the best, most reliable way to kill it.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Not so! These outbreaks are almost NEVER reported in the media.</p>
<p>You know, comparing this to the MRSA thread is really funny; you people are hypocrites if I ever knew them!</p>
<p>And about cars–EVERYTHING is risky in some sense, but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t take precautions. By that logic, you people should all smoke, binge drink, do drugs, drive without a seatbelt, and drink the water in Mexico. Oh, and never, ever wash your hands! Heck, maybe I should go out and get wasted right now by your logic (not that I would; I don’t drink)…</p>
<p>Did you cross a street today? Drive a car? Probably more dangerous than that bagged spinach. When bagged spinach, bagged salad, pre washed and peeled carrots came out, I was thrilled, as finally there was fast food for me. Some may prefer to take their chances with McDonalds and whatever subsequent ills befall them. I’ll eat my vegetables, and hopefully feel better on the way to what I hear is an inevitable death, regardless. </p>
<p>All this talk of what is best to eat, worst food, is tendencies, not guarantees. You improve your chances with a good diet, reduce chances of a long healthy life with a poor diet. I don’t know statistics, but some of those chances are fairly small. Genetics triumph in some cases, environmental exposure wins in another. Mental health and social supports play a big factor in who lives a long and healthy life. Balance diet, as well as other factors in your life as best as possible, then relax about things. </p>
<p>Per O of M2 above</p>
<ol>
<li>exercise</li>
<li>rest</li>
<li>consume water
4 eat lots of foods but not alot of a food.
repeat. </li>
</ol>
<p>My D, living on dorm food, probably eats some version of bagged salad-baby greens-most days, as is one of the healthier choices in her dining hall. I’d be more concerned if she refused to eat it, than if she does.</p>
<p>GLM- I think if you read the article on how bagged spinach (and lettuce) is farmed, you might change your mind. They have not made any significant changes to the process in California and the leaves are still at significant risk of contamination by feces. Yuk.
NO, it’s not like crossing the street. That’s insulting. It’s more like choosing a Volvo over a Yugo when I drive. Or refusing to eat McDonalds food - since I know what is used to produce that junk.
I will buy organic and frozen spinach but I’ll stay away from the mass market bagged stuff. I call that being an informed consumer. I can choose to be picky with what I buy and with what I put in my mouth. You can choose to ignore what you consider to be minor risks. To each his own.</p>
<p>Sorry, as I was hit by a car crossing the street and woke up in the ER, more or less intact, that is my frame of reference for danger. The mom of my Ds friend died from that cause. I’m lucky. Drivers in our town can be a little nuts. Not meant to be insulting, just my reality. </p>
<p>My point is that risk is everywhere. We minimize it as best we can, but never know what will really get us in the end. I will look for more info on the bagged spinach, as it sounds there is something I need to know. Regardless, most spinach is cooked in this house, which may be a good thing. One of the failures of the American diet is insufficient produce, esp green vegetables, so most of my cooking is devoted to incorporating a maximum number of vegetables into what I eat. Dash diet, if you’ve heard of it, for hypertension. In my particular case, ill effects of high blood pressure will probably get me before bagged vegetables.</p>
<p>I’m sticking with the fresh fruits and veggies. Cook 'em if you want… Just eat them!</p>
<p>The risk/benefit analysis: ingesting low-quality (non nutritious, anti-nutritious, insufficient, or empty-calorie) fuel for my body is a MUCH greater health risk than the risk of possibly ingesting a tainted vegetable.</p>
<p>wolfpiper, do you realize how obsessive you are about eating/dieting/foods? </p>
<p>This is really an easy question that you are making unnecessarily complex. You should see a nutritionist instead of circling fruitlessly (pun intended).</p>
<p>I have that book, though loaned to a friend before I’d finished it. Am aware from our above exchange, that this is my issue, and need to watch a tendency to be prickly about it. I grew up in a strict natural foods home, where everything going into my mouth was questioned. This was at a time when it was distinctly odd. Many of my friends question foods and food choices quite a bit, do their research, as have I. It’s fascinating, and people like Michael Pollen push us as a culture in the right direction, if we can get authorities to listen. At the same time, my time and money are limited. I shop the farmer’s markets when possible, but scheduling doesn’t always allow. I get CSA organics, as my HMO gives a rebate these days, and I want to support that. But we eat way more produce than my ‘share’ so buy extra from the grocery store, esp in winter, and grow some in my garden. Our local co op, which I supported in my early days, is now terribly expensive. My mom, who spent almost all extra family money on suppliments and organics years ago, as now, is aging like her sisters, with her own set of health problems. The one thing I’ll say for her is that she’s never needed cataract surgery, despite living in Arizona and never wearing sunglasses. As in many things, I’m trying for balance, and where that balance point exists, is a never ending, and interesting discussion.</p>
<p>Back to the subject of what we should eat…are kids taught nutrition in HS health class anymore? or are they spending all their time on the dangers of tobacco & drugs?</p>
<p>Because I am amazed at the people who don’t know what basic good nutrition is, despite all the PSA’s about eating so many servings of fruits/veggies every day. etc. </p>
<p>They equate “jello salad” and “macaroni salad” with “green salad” because well, they all have the word “salad” in them. They think it’s ok to have Diet Coke as their breakfast drink. And the moms think fruit gummies made with 10% fruit juice are just as good as a piece of fresh fruit, probably because the advertising gives that impression.</p>
<p>The general knowledge about healthy diet choices, or lack of it, is a scary one. Much of this stuff is home based, your mom, or dad serves you bananas and squash, mentions potassium and Vit. A. You learn to eat it, you learn it’s good for you and why. A passing on of the culture. Unfortunately home cooked meals are not always part of the home environment. I’d think school based food education can be just theory, if never seen in practice. </p>
<p>I’m curious, students, what did you learn at home about food? I know my kids and community are not the norm.</p>
<p>The leader of the organic foods movement in Seattle just died barely making 50. Brain cancer. Maybe it was that last cheeseburger he ate in 1965.
OTOH</p>
<p>You can find evidence to support whichever diet you choose. The so-called ‘experts’ can’t agree among themselves. </p>
<p>Here are the simple guidelines I subscribe to:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Generally, the more processed something is, the less healthy it is. Example: Indigenous people have often thrived on raw sugar cane with nary a cavity. Blackstrap molasses, a supplement rich in iron and other minerals, is a by-product of the sugar refining process. It’s not the sugar cane that is unhealthy, but the processed sugar, which has been stripped of its nutrients and left in a crystalline, chemical form. When wheat is refined, some 70+ nutrients are removed, and the fiber, and meager 8+ are added back in. And so on. Try to eat foods in their most natural, unprocessed state as much as possible.</p></li>
<li><p>Avoid chemical preservatives, additives, colorings, etc. They may be safe in small quantities, but some would argue that they may have adverse cumalative effects on overall health. This includes, of course, known carcinogenic pesticides. Eat organic whenever possible. (Yeah, I know, virtually impossible while in college.)</p></li>
<li><p>Supplement with concentrated ‘superfoods’ because they help break down toxic chemicals and remove them from the body, as well as supplying the nutrients missing from a junk food diet. Examples are: various ‘green’ foods such as blue-green algae, chlorella, etc., flower pollen, etc. Also, since they are foods they are assimilated better than vitamin supplements.</p></li>
<li><p>Use vitamin and herb supplements if needed.</p></li>
<li><p>Don’t eat anything that runs, swims, or flies away from you when you try to harvest it.</p></li>
</ol>