And don’t even get me started on fencing, another pretend “sport” where anyone who knows which end of the blade you hit with is assured a spot on a college roster. I can give you a real world example of what happens when real athletes decide to give it a try. I attended a tournament once that included a few college football players who had taken a one semester fencing class at their university. There were about 20 competitors, and one of the football players made it to the gold medal bout, where he faced a younger, smaller, but more experienced opponent.</p>
<p>In anticipation of the final bout, the crowd broke along predictable lines. The fencers thought the fencer’s skill would carry the day, while the football players were certain the football player’s strength and athleticism would overwhelm his opponent.</p>
<p>It wasn’t even close; as I recall it was 15-1 or 15-2. Skill prevailed over strength. In the football player’s defense, while the girl who beat him was only 13, she had been competing on the national circuit for three years.</p>
<p>Theyknow, I’m guessing that’s the number who belong to that particular organization, but these schools would be surprised they don’t have lacrosse:</p>
<p>Your source, for instance, doesn’t list a single high school in Texas, whereas lacrosse has been played in public high schools in the state since Westlake fielded the first boy’s lacrosse team in 1988. Not to mention the hundreds if not thousands of private high schools across the nation that have lacrosse teams.</p>
<p>Sue22, the NFHS is the recoginized national authority on interscholastic high school sports participation. Its data is considered accurate and often referenced for mainstream sports, so the fact that lacrosse is not recognized by it in certain states is likely indicative of its very limited presence there. I notice, for example, that the team ranked as 14th best in Missouri is 0-14 and 31st best in Tennesse is 0-9 suggesting there isn’t much going on beyond these limited lists of ranked teams. The Westlake lacrosse site indicates there are 45 teams in TX and LA. My guess is the 18-20 states not recognized by NFHS where lacrosse exists represent at most another 600-800 teams nationally and that’s likley generous at 30-40 per state. Even if that’s true, there’s still 3-4x more high school wrestling programs than lacrosse ones as compared to 50% more college lacrosse than wrestling teams, so the point remains unchanged.</p>
<p>And yes, lacrosse is played in many private high schools but so aren’t all the mainstream sports, so those schools would be additive to all sports. The difference is that unlike football, basketball, baseball and wrestling, college lacrosse rosters are full of players from these private/prep schools. If and when lacrosse becomes relevant in states known for producing large amounts of athletes for mainstream sports, that dynamic will change. Until then, the path to college participation for above average high school lacrosse players at prep schools and in certain northeast/mid-atlantic states will remain relatively easy. </p>
<p>The statistics reported by TheyKnow’s cite are self reported to that organization.</p>
<p>There are only 5 states on Laxpower that do not have Boys Lacrosse stats for high school, and they may HAVE lax, just not a big enough group for a state ranking system (Alaska, Arkansas, Iowa, North Dakota, and Wyoming). I believe there are Native Lacrosse teams from ND that play in regional and national tourneys, and there are a lot of hockey teams that play it for dry land training. U of Wyo has club level lax, so those students are picking it up somewhere.</p>
<p>TheyKnow’s statistic are way off, but it doesn’t matter. Those who want lacrosse scholarships will seek them out, or play club, or just get a group of friends and play for fun. Those who want wrestling can do the same if they can find the opportunities.</p>
<p>Colleges offer/sponsor lacrosse teams because students want them and want to watch lacrosse. If wrestling were as popular, more collegiate teams would be offered. It is certainly not an expensive sport to offer, so why are there not more teams if it is so popular?</p>
<p>NCAA reports that 494 colleges/universities had varsity lacrosse teams in 2013, with 12,781 men and 9,845 women participating; this doesn’t include the thousand participating at the club level, and many of these schools with varsity programs have club teams too. </p>
<p>Wrestling had 327 programs, with 9,530 men and 254 women participating.</p>
<p>Come on now. Let’s stick to reality here. Lacrosse is fraudulent! </p>
<p>Yes indeed, Mr. Theyknow is citing some irrefutable statistics. Just think about it for a minute from a fundamental standpoint. If Jadaveon Clowney (6’6” and 270 lbs with a 4.5 second 40 yard dash) picked up a lacrosse stick and was racing down the field towards the goal, what exactly is Miles Prescott Harrington III (5’6” 145 lbs with a 5.3 second 40 yard dash) going to do to stop him? He can’t catch him. If he were standing in front of him, he’d get run over like Kamala splashing that man Krueger. After any type of collision, Miles would be on the sideline dialing up his hot model girlfriend to console him. If doesn’t matter that Miles is wicked going left. After smashing into Clowney, he wouldn’t have a left or a right, he’d be D E D.</p>
<p>I have done my research and have been to these All Star lacrosse camps. More than half of the kids who are timed in the 40 yard dash can’t run under a 5 flat. More than half of them weigh less than 170 lbs. Basically you are drawing from an inferior athletic gene pool when you are feeding this college sport. So to the parents who want to brag about their kid getting phone calls from college coaches, I might as well brag about my dinner getting interrupted by a telemarketer. </p>
<p>Assuming Clowney ran into Mr. Harrington III, he’d get a charging call. Mr. Clowney needs to pass the ball (a passed ball moves faster than feet), and Mr. Harrington III’s teammate Mr. Smithers V would intercept the pass (long stick defender), quickly sending it back over the midfield to Chip or Biff or Young Harry Jones (Ted’s boy) and whip that thing at 75 miles per hour right passed Bubba, playing goalie for the lax team but really a center on the football team. Bubba never sees it coming.</p>
<p>You don’t need to run in lax as you can just throw the ball. Some can run, but all don’t have to. If it were possible for a team to win at lacrosse by just having the biggest players, the Alabama lax team would just be the football team in other uniforms.</p>
<p>recruiting expert - You do not respect lacrosse or the kids who play it, yet you go to All Star lacrosse camps, most of which are invite-only? Why would you go to all that trouble to watch a bunch of non-athletic, prep school wusses play a sport you don’t like? I think I know. Also, do they even time kids in the 40 at all star showcases? I have never heard anyone speak of that. </p>
<p>It seems your biggest issue is the parents bragging about it. If one of my friends/acquaintances had a kid that got to do what they love in college (whether it be wrestling or basket weaving) and they wanted to talk about it, I’d be thrilled for that kid. I have watched these kids grow up. I’ve watched them work hard and fail. I’ve watched their parents sacrifice and worry. If they want to bend my ear at a cocktail party - have at it. I’m happy to listen. And when it gets too long - I down my drink, excuse myself and head to the bar.</p>
<p>twoinanddone, you say my stats are way off based on what? Your link on NCAA teams shows 219 DI/DII/DIII wrestling teams vs. 449 DI/DII/DIII lacrosse, so the source you’re referencing is showing that there’s more than 2x as many college lacrosse teams as college wrestling through DI/DII/DIII. Those were my stats. I’m purposely not including NAIA or junior/community college teams as quality levels vary greatly there, so they are much less relavant to the discussion of recrutied college athletes. My high school stats are being pulled from the primary entity that reports these things. I’m willing to grant lacrosse is played in states not reporting to the NFHS but 1) when the 14th best team in a state is 0-14, I’m guessing there’s not many relevant teams beyond that one and 2) the fact that there’s no acknowledgement by the NFHS of a sport in a state indicates to me its unlikely to be highly popular relative to other sports in that state. </p>
<p>Why there are so few college wrestling programs? The answer is Title IX, which has devasted the sport at the college level eliminating over 150 programs since its adoption. At the same time, wrestling remains a highly popular sport at the high school level. That’s the whole point of this thread – lots of HS wrestlers with relatively few college opportunities while lacrosse is on the other end of that spectrum. </p>
<p>You said there were only lacrosse teams in 23 states when there are high school teams in at least 45, and that only a few preppy east coast schools have teams. That’s wrong. You also implied that there was no high school play in Texas and Florida because they aren’t on your list, and I know that’s wrong since my daughter plays on her Florida high school team and there are hundreds of school teams, boys and girls, varsity and jv. There are huge tournaments at Disney throughout the year, and they come from many states. There is plenty of lacrosse in Florida. The UF woman’s team is in the top 10.</p>
<p>Don’t blame it on Title IX. Other sports add women’s teams or a similar sport for women. Why don’t they add women’s wrestling teams? Oh right, women don’t like wrestling. I don’t care if colleges have wrestling teams, so why do you care that they have lacrosse teams? </p>
<p>Also, how many of those who wrestle in high school also participate in another sport like football? Wrestling may not be their main sport but just a ‘winter filler’ sport like it was for my brothers. In my high school, all the wrestler played football too (except, of course, for the little skinny ones as they are too small to even be lax players), so if they went to college, it was with a scholarship in another sport. One of my brothers played college football, one lacrosse, but both would have been counted in your wrestling numbers as high school participants.</p>
<p>The numbers are off for crew as well. I have to assume it’s because most states don’t have state high school crew associations, so they’re not included in the NFHS survey. The NFHS websites lists only 107 men’s and 165 women’s high school crew teams, but its list is clearly incomplete. Just off the bat it ignores the entire state of Massachusetts, a state with at least 30 competitive high school rowing programs as well as Pennsylvania, with 43 and New York with 74. Contrary to the NHFS assertion that only 7 states have high school rowing, there are in fact competitive high school crew programs in 40 states. My daughter happens to row on a school based crew team in a state not listed by the NFHS as having any teams.</p>
<p>Year State Sport Boys Schools Girls Schools Boys Participation Girls Participation
2012/2013 CA Crew 40 103 407 2727
2012/2013 DC Crew 1 1 41 49
2012/2013 DE Crew 3 3 72 65
2012/2013 ME Crew 3 3 53 53
2012/2013 MI Crew 22 20 624 524
2012/2013 OH Crew 11 9 340 289
2012/2013 VA Crew 27 26 1022 921
Total 107 165 2559 4628</p>