Rejected applicant alleges bias against Asians

<p>Tisthetruth, AGain, as others here have argued, you don’t seem to get that they are not looking for perfect 2400s. His(the Hispanic student I described) SAT was well within their range, and he had standout ECs in three areas.</p>

<p>The bar you describe doesn’t exist. Li didn’t have those qualifications either.</p>

<p>The question is are some applicatns who are not well qualified let in because of race? And I think, from my cohort of one, that is clearly not the case. This young man was very well qualified, and was turned down.</p>

<p>The fact is, we don’t know what the bar is. It may be different for each student–not because of race, but because the complete picture of each applicant is accepted or rejected because it fits or doesn’t fit the needs of the school. The student I know was certainly equipped to succeed there, as were many other applicants who were turned down. We don’t know why each was or wasn’t.</p>

<p>OTOH, my S was accpeted to an Ivy with similarly tiny acceptance rates when he had no discernible bar-clearing trait. HIgh but not 1600-high SATs, mediocre (for that level) SAT 2s, not val, not athlete, not legacy, musical but not at the level of the student I described above, good but not great ECs, no national nothing, white.</p>

<p>I have to assume that, after qualifying on the basic cut, clearing some bar, he was picked on intangibles–his essays, his short answers, recs, interview, etc. That he liked astronomy and music and conveyed those things well, maybe. I can’t know. But it was clear that that they picked for the whole package, not what his laundry list or stats commanded, but for their grasp of who he is.</p>

<p>Yes it is a ‘LOT’… 92% or 714 from an applicant pool of 776…It is like very one who applied with that score.</p>

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<p>That is indeed correct, expect for the fact you seemingly were saved by a poor use of double negations. </p>

<p>Legitimate as his “concerns” might be, his case, as presented, has already been found without merit, and will be swiftly dismissed again. If there were a case to be made, this was most definitely not the correct one.</p>

<p>“But it was clear that that they picked for the whole package”</p>

<p>I think there is some truth to that. My son also felt that his entire application was very cohesive. Everything fitted and supported each other. Nothing stuck out or was out of place.</p>

<p>Re universities that accept federal money following federal anti-discrimination rules:</p>

<p>Yes, that’s true. But even an EEOC run by this administration is going to have a rough time showing why Princeton’s race-aware system fails under Gratz and Grutter. The Supreme Court has spoken on the subject very recently, in a closely analogous case with similar facts, and that decision affirmed an earlier ruling that’s been around for 30 years. If anything, Princeton’s admissions system is MORE holistic than Michigan’s constitutionally acceptable program. I see no way to argue that as of April 2006, when Li got his decision, Princeton’s admissions system was violating federal law.</p>

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<p>Interesteddad:</p>

<p>please read my original post carefully, I was saying asian have higher admission bar then other ethnics, the data that you quoted above is just one of the proves…</p>

<p>you are comparing between black and white ethinics.</p>

<p>that’s why I said you only want to have your right, but doesn’t like to hear other ethnic people complain about their rights by calling them ‘jerk’.</p>

<p>“…you seemingly were saved by a poor use of double negations.”</p>

<p>Well, forgive me, Xiggi. I was going to type “You can’t deny that his concern was legitimate” but instead decided to make my statement more firm by changing “you” to “none of you.” In the process, I forgot to change “can’t” to “can.”</p>

<p>“None of you can deny that his concern is legitimate.”</p>

<p>I can. In fact, I think it will quickly be discovered that, putting aside the “slots”, Asian-Americans are overrepresented. I have no idea about Chinese nationals.</p>

<p>Mr Li is not an Asian-American. He is a Chinese national with a US residency permit. The Chinese are not allowed to hold dual citizenship.</p>

<p>That fact makes his sense of ‘entitlement’ all the more ridiculous, in my opinion. Do Americans need to remove affirmative action for URMs in order to make way for more Chinese nationals at our top universities? </p>

<p>Pullllleeeeeezzzzzeee.</p>

<p>Wow so he is not even a citizen…</p>

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<p>Yup… see my above quote from post #150. Pullleeeeezzzeeee, indeed!</p>

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<p>That’s not what they say on their website:</p>

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from <a href=“http://www.prepforprep.org/prepforprep/accomplish.asp[/url]”>http://www.prepforprep.org/prepforprep/accomplish.asp&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Hanna, you may well be correct. However, the Dept of Ed concluded–for whatever reason–that there is enough of a question to investigate, so let the investigating begin. I first read about this specific case last weekend in the weekend WSJ. I turned to my husband and said, “I’m afraid Li may not have a leg to stand on”. That is still where I stand. However, the blatant stereotyping and hostility toward Asians displayed in this thread has shocked me. I have found that the various Asian ethnicities in this college town have brought about a vast improvement in our previously undistinguished public schools. But then, I’m not a big sports fan, and I don’t think the quality of the schools depends solely on how many teams “get to State”. </p>

<p>Cheers, Li is a permanent alien “green card” holder. (He can decide when he is 18 if he wants to be a citizen.) Get ready to do your own science and medical research if the idea of foreigners in the universities really bothers you.</p>

<p>“Get ready to do your own science and medical research if the idea of foreigners in the universities really bothers you.”</p>

<p>I think you misunderstood the point of mentioning that. US citizens would have more of an advantage over an international. That is just one more possible reason he wasn’t accepted to 5 different schools.</p>

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midmo, are you implying that there is no value to sports participation? You don’t have to be a fan to admit there are many valuable lessons learned and character building opportunities in sports participation, regardless of the team’s win/loss record. I’m not a fan of forensic competitions, but I see value in them.</p>

<p>There is far more “value” in the big sports, “value” as in “money”. Money that flows from alumni, keeps the research labs humming and the campus nicely appointed, and the faculty paid.</p>

<p>This is especially true at Ivies and Ivy-like institutions where the cost of athletics is a pittance - a bunch of places in the admitted classes, a field, some pads and helmets, 3 or 4 coaches. </p>

<p>Cheap at the price! ;)</p>

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<p>Really?</p>

<p>Last year, UMich accepted 578 Asian American applicants with combined SAT scores below 1320. It doesn’t seem like the SAT “bar” is set that high.</p>

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That is not the case in my town. The frenzy to pile on AP courses and jam schedules full of these courses has made kids afraid to take courses in the arts. They don’t want their GPAs to suffer with unweighted courses. I think that is a shame. It is pressure from Asian parents that drive that trend in this town. (Frankly, the caliber of the new APs is not great because the BOE approved courses before the high school had hired competent teachers for them.) I think kids should have a relaxing lunch period rather than cram in another course. Athletic kids who were bused to a far away game or those who were traveling to Carnegie Hall to sing in a choral performance shouldn’t have to go to 0 period classes at the crack of dawn to remain competitive. I don’t think this is a hostile attitude. I don’t begrudge any success that hard working kids earn. I’m just saddened that rather than improve the curriculum across the board, the school allows kids to try to stand out by tackling unrealistic & unhealthy schedules. Around here, that is an Asian approach.</p>

<p>SS: I didn’t say there was “no value” and I didn’t imply it. Do I think it is over-rated? If you are interested, I would say yes to that, but it isn’t relevant to this thread. FWIW, my now-12th grade son played basketball, ran cross-country and played on the tennis team in 9th grade. He played hard, had some fun, got pretty good at tennis, and decided competitive team sports took too much time away from the activities that he thought were good character-building, team-building activities that worked well for HIM, to wit, math, engineering and science teams, as well as some outdoor activities not related to team sports. My big complaint with big-deal sports is that they get more than their fair share of attention–and funds–at the high school level. But really, I hope the lack of sports participation is not why Mr. Li did not get accepted to some colleges.</p>

<p>Gosh, I’d almost think you were from the midwest. You can’t talk about religion or lack of fondness for sports around here without being branded a heretic, but I didn’t think that was true in NJ!</p>

<p>Sweetny007, applicants who have PR status are not considered internationals in the admissions process.</p>