While I suggest strongly that folks do the NPCs, there are some families that prefer to tease out the finances later in the process…
Plus, with the exceptions of Iowa and Bennington, I believe the other colleges on this student’s list do guarantee to meet full need…IF the student qualifies for need based aid as determined by the colleges.
And in addition, some of these schools that meet full need have deeper pockets and are more generous than others.
So yes…run the Net price calculators for all of these schools, in my opinion. And do each one. Do not assume that Denison will be as generous as Yale, for example.
Could you please clarify your financial position at Iowa? If it’s affordable then you don’t need to add multiple safeties.
Grinnell and Williams are two well funded LACs which are likely to offer need based aid similar to Yale’s. Williams would be a reach; Grinnell a match. Both are academically rigorous with nurturing, intellectual environments.
From Grinnell’s website:
“Grinnell’s proximity to Iowa City, site of the prestigious University of Iowa Writers’ Workshop, makes it an easy stop on the reading train, as authors with newly published books often arrange a mini Iowa circuit. (Our location also allows Grinnellians to zip into Iowa City to catch a famous writer who, for whatever reason, can’t make it to Grinnell.)”
Williams has several award winning fiction writers on their permanent faculty, including Jim Shepard and Andrea Barrett.
Wesleyan University 's actually a bit more rustic than Yale, but not as isolated as let’s say - Hamilton. Wesleyan’s Brownstone Row was built from the same quarry that supplied the stone for Yale’s Old Campus. So, there is that:
I know the outside appearance of a college matters to some. But in my opinion, one should be looking at what happens inside those buildings. Wesleyan is a very strong university, and seems to align with this OPs academic interests.
I hope they didn’t just apply to Yale because of the buildings.
I have to question the use of an ad hominem comment on Chace. Beyond this, there’s nothing incendiary in One Hundred Semesters regarding Wesleyan. Chace offers his perspective on his time there along with his interpretation of Wesleyan’s culture. Perhaps Wesleyan has changed since then, but I don’t know why this would be a good thing. In any case, I believe Chace’s book can be understood — or criticized — as generally representative or misrepresentative on its own terms by those who have read it.
You’ve gotten some great advice on colleges to check out, so I’ll start by telling you the weakness of Yale’s creative writing program, which is solid but not as dazzling as some of the other options listed here. The English department is good but kind of old fashioned and lots of annoying requirements (my daughter is an English major there).
Yale is by far the toughest school to get admitted to as a female prospective English major. There are so few English majors out there, but they all want Yale (particularly women). Youngarts finalists struggle to gain entry. So don’t let the rejection upset you too much!
Princeton on the other hand has historically been on the lookout for writers and has also historically recognized Iowa, so I wouldn’t rule that out. Obviously both the creative writing program and the financial aid there is tops. My theory there is the school is really looking for kids who are committed to the field. The overall student culture isn’t the same, I will admit, but those who can swim against a bit of current will be richly rewarded.
Another reach, but Barnard also came to mind. Good luck!
I’d second and third the mulitple mentions of Wesleyan here. Extremely strong across the creative arts, and this appears to permeate the culture of the school as a whole. Check out the website of the university’s Shapiro Center for Creative Writing and Criticism for a sense of this on the writing front: Welcome, Shapiro Center - Wesleyan University. Like Yale, Wesleyan is within the greater orbit of New York City (from where visiting faculty and speakers are drawn and many students hail), which I think helps drive much of the vibrancy of its programs in creative writing and the arts. The campus is indeed much different than Yale’s, but then that’s the case for just about anywhere!
If you want close-knit and Bennington was on your list, why not other SLACs in New England…Bates? Conn College, Colby? I think they have creative writing as majors/concentrations. They will be close-knits as a campus, not a major of course. Emerson is different vibe, but easier to get into than the others and is urban and small.
Not sure about fin aid at various schools in any depth or your exact details of course…need to do NPC, etc.
Have you looked at Rice? It’s another reach but in many ways similar to Yale. Great college news paper, residential college system, english is a smallish major so it’s probably a pretty tight knit group, etc.
Rice has the Rice Investment which gives up to full tuition and room and board depending on family income:
I think it’s important to mention that while 15K was my budget at the time of creating that previous thread, I’ve had some financial changes that affect my FAFSA (a little too specific of scenarios to feel comfortable disclosing on the internet) that do raise my budget (again, don’t feel fully comfortable sharing the number). I should be able to afford Iowa, for example; it would just be difficult to want to pay a higher amount for Iowa than say, the cheaper Princeton or a school like Denison or Kenyon that might offer me a good amount of scholarships
It’s great you’ve got a looser budget to work with. But it doesn’t change the other dynamics- you still need to make sure your colleges are affordable given the new constraints.
You are going to land somewhere great- just make sure that if you aren’t excited about Iowa, you’ve got another affordable, “sure bet” school on the list. It’s nice to reach for Princeton, Brown, Columbia… but you need a more robust set of schools with a higher statistical probability of acceptance which are within budget whatever that might be…
Time to invest your energy in the colleges you have a shot at. Kenyon’s creative writing program is renowned, possibly the best of these schools and it has amazing professors. You’ll probably get into Bennington. You have some nice schools on your list, but you need more matches and not more reaches. JHU is NOTHING like any of the others you’ve listed, nor Penn. You seem to want the more liberal arts vibe and you’re applying to Kenyon, so consider Grinnell and Oberlin. They are fantastic schools. Consider Carleton or Macalester. Dickinson might be safe for you and is not dissimilar to Denison. Think beyond rankings.
A word on financial aid at Wesleyan, about which I just posted above: though Wes does not offer merit awards, their need-based aid is among the best there is, newly loan-free as of next year. When we ran the NPC, Wes’s aid was significantly better than that from Rice, Vassar, and other schools mentioned here. Which is all to say: don’t make decisions based on hunches or assumptions, but do research and go ahead and apply if you’re really interested.
Sounds like a reasonable goal to me. And I think if you want more chances at that goal, you can think about more SLACs where either you would be competitive for merit, or they have need aid comparable to Yale/Princeton, understanding the former are generally going to be more likely admits than the latter.
But generally, I went back and read your top post above, and I think two things are worth emphasizing.
First, Yale may have felt magical to you, but it actually is not magic. It is just a college.
And conversely, even if no other college you now consider feels magical–good! None are actually magical, they are all just colleges.
So, the way you are thinking in this quote, balancing out pros and cons from a practical perspective, is exactly how you should be thinking. And indeed should have been thinking even about Yale.
It’s not a value judgement - this is a good school but not worth X $ - unless you have other options that also meet budget to compare. And right now you don’t.
And you don’t want to strangle yourself (loans) or impact your family’s long term financial well being - especially given the major.
If you get Iowa to an affordable for your family price point, then you have a fantastic landing - and anything and anywhere else that comes through - now you’re playing with house money - because you already have somewhere acceptable and leading edge in the field to attend. The quote on Grinnell above was telling - they (a top LAC) were in some ways riding on Iowa’s coattails in the field.
On the flipside, don’t assume SLACs will get you to a price. Many you are talking about r meet need (so check the NPC) but also have merit (which may be less than need and not stackable).
You can research all this in advance.
One other thought and I may be wrong to say this (others let me know) but if your budget has doubled - I read so much on here about SUNY Geneseo feeling like a New England LAC- town and all. It is the SUNY LAC. They have an English degree with creative writing track and are generous cost wise.
They have great aid, but are need aware. Not sure how much that impacts things (better to meet full need, imo, for all admits than be need blind and not meet full need) but thought it was worth a mention.
Great to hear a positive perspective on Bennington! I’m not set on urban necessarily, but I do prefer it to in the middle of nowhere. I loved New Haven in the sense that it was a smaller college town with great restaurants and shops, but also tangible opportunities for community service outreach. Anything similar to that would be great.
Brown is in a nice section of Providence, and so seems on track for this sort of goal.
This is also making me think of WUSTL again. WUSTL is actually in a suburb of St Louis, but just across the border and a straight metro ride into downtown. Its immediate surroundings are quite nice, but of course St Louis has many service opportunities.
Wesleyan is in what I would call a satellite town in the Hartford area. Again, I would think pretty good for service opportunities.
Macalester has a great location in a nice part of Minneapolis/St Paul. Again the immediate surroundings are very walkable and pleasant, but it is literally right between the two downtowns and there are going to be many convenient service opportunities.
So that is at least a bit of a range of colleges that might fit this set of preferences.
