That was how it worked in K-12s I have been familiar with, for sure! One of the above postes indicates this is different for universities, which I have no familiarity with personally (and am not bothered to research in depth;)
Is there any update about college closings?? Seems like this thread has taken a road less traveled…
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This is an informative article: Closed Colleges: List, Statistics, and Major Closures | BestColleges.
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In looking at the enrollments of several of the colleges, it can be fairly well understood why they needed to close (less than 1000, particularly less than 500). But some of the schools’ enrollment numbers looked to be much stronger but closed anyway for financial reasons (I’m not counting mergers, loss of accreditation, or for-profit schools). Some examples include:
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Cabrini (PA ): 2267 enrollment; primary reason financial; June 2024
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College of Saint Rose (NY): 2786 enrollment; primary reason financial; May 2024
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Medaille (NY): 2937 enrollment; primary reason enrollment, financial; August 2023
Can anyone help me to understand how schools with these levels of enrollment would still be financially unable to continue?
My son had offers at two small universities (enrollments between 500-1500) to play hockey. Both were within our budget. The choice not to go there was largely the fear of the unknown, a history of declining enrolment, leadership turnover etc… I know Cabrini lost over 1,000 students over a decade.
A trend I have seen with schools with religious affiliations: divestment and monetization of assets.
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But have those schools’ enrollment numbers been on a downward trend? If so, then their finances may be designed for a business model that requires larger enrollment.
Or they need to offer greater discounts (FA and scholarships) to fill their classes than they used to. That would mean less net tuition revenue than before, even at the same enrollment levels.
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I think it’s as simple as revenues vs. expenses, like any business.
They didn’t have the fundraising chops to overcome.
It’s sad for those grads that their schools don’t exist.
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I’m not being argumentative- and I’m not stalking you. But the premise of your other comments on the “broken” thread is that the US model is broken because your son had NO affordable admissions despite what coaches told him.
So he DID have affordable admissions. Not just one- but two! A choice! And he chose not to take either one.
So I’m a bit confused. How is this a sign of a broken system?
You keep moving the goal posts here.
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There are many reasons a school might have financial issues even with what appears to be strong enrollment numbers. Increasing costs, endowment issues, the need to discount tuition to obtain enrollment, expenses of providing the programs in which students are currently enrolled, etc. There could be some issues we don’t know about, such as accreditation concerns or issues with administrative capability (which can impact the continuation of federal aid). Or they could see the writing on the wall and feel that it would not be ethical to recruit faculty, staff and students knowing that the end was on the horizon.
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My son had various offer letters. I’d say 20% were clear as to what the costs would be. The others not so much. The one he was leaning towards (call it choice A), kept changing the tuition costs and quoted numbers that were inconsistent with data elsewhere. What appeared within our budget suddenly gave us concerns about future price increases etc…In other words there were red flags. My son had other choices, well within our budget, but we had concerns about the financial stability of the schools. We feel sad about that. My son always had the back pocket of going to a local school in Montreal. There were other schools that he could have gone to but, we consider having to take on debt as “unaffordable”. That is just how we roll.
We don’t live in a bubble. My son has made a lot of friends within sports and just as classmates. So we’ve heard a lot of horror stories over the last two years. if you want to argue that system is fine, that is your choice. But as a posted earlier, if you at what has come to light in the last few years about how admissions at some schools has operated couple with the disclosure that the college board has been selling personal data of minors etc…You tell me, what is isn’t broken?
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In the U.S., data is protected by FERPA. The College Board is legally permitted to share directory information:
*Like other education service providers to schools, College Board is an outsourced “school official” for provision of certain educational services. Under FERPA, schools may disclose student personally identifiable information (PII) to outsourced “school officials” without parental consent, subject to certain requirements, most importantly that the “school official” only use the student PII to perform services to the school and for no other purposes not allowed by FERPA. Those services are defined in the contract between the school and College Board.
Additionally, a separate provision of FERPA allows schools to disclose “directory information” to third parties without parental consent. Directory information includes, among other things, name, telephone number, address, email address, date and place of birth, grade level, honors, awards received, and participation in activities and sports.*
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The conversation seems to have veered off-topic to this thread. Please continue in the appropriate thread. Thank you.
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Another issue not yet mentioned is taking on unsustainable debt—that’s a really, really big one.
And often the projects the debt is financing are designed to bring in money long term. (Like building a new dorm, or renovating the ones they already have.) And that’s good! Done correctly, debt can be leveraged to increase an institution’s strength, and in many cases is absolutely necessary for the institution to continue. But sometimes it doesn’t work out so well.
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In the most recent Your College Bound Kid episode, they started a 3-part interview of Jeff Selingo on the topic of how to figure out if a college is financially sound or not. It’s been interesting to listen to.
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There are a lot of people hurt when a college closes. The community that services the students and depends economically on the students suffers a huge blow. Students at these schools are often heavily involved in the communities from tutoring to volunteering time with local youth etc… These are real impacts beyond just numbers.
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Hechinger’s article on Wells closing
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There are some truly sobering points about teachout plans in that article:
“You often see these domino precipitous closures, where students will go to a school that closes and then they’ll be funneled into the school that most wants their money,” said Jessica Ranucci…“The school that most wants their money is a school that’s teetering on the brink, and then that school closes.”
Unfortunately, being an accreditor-approved teach-out college doesn’t necessarily mean an institution will stay open. Middle States had designated Wells as a teach-out school for Cazenovia College and Medaille University, both of which closed last year—forcing students who had just arrived at Wells in the fall to find a new college for the second time.
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Students from closed schools usually don’t make it to graduation. Fewer than half of students at closed colleges end up transferring to other institutions, according to a 2022 study, and more than half of those who did transfer left their new college without graduating.
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This one really smells. The administrators were actively involved in getting zoning changes to sell the property at the same time as getting student deposits?
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He added that the decision to close was “centered on what was best for our students, our prospective students, and their families.”
Hmm, that’s why they were accepting enrollment deposits, and a week before the closure was announced encouraging students to do an admitted student day, had current students register for the next semester and pick their dorm rooms, etc. All of this while they had signed teach-out agreements in the fall for its potential closure.
And they obviously didn’t care about the faculty and staff, as they were not mentioned about being centered in the plan, they were misled (if not flat out lied to) when they were asking sustainability questions, and in the end result,
“Not to mention, faculty and staff. It’s really hard to find other positions, and it’s completely out of the academic cycle. There’s no way that most people are going to be able to find something. All the hiring is done now.”
The good news…or, perhaps, bright side is that a state senator is trying to pass some legislation:
State Sen. Rachel May introduced a bill last week that would require colleges to provide notice of closure at least a year in advance, host public meetings about the decision and provide students with teach-out agreements at least six months in advance.
To provide some teeth, I’m thinking the board of trustees and chiefs of the university could be held civilly and/or criminally responsible. So even if the “university” can’t be held responsible, at least the decision-makers would be.
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I think they showed a shortfall of $4 million and the president was earning about $350K of income. There are some really hard questions that need to be asked.
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