Good to know, thanks so much for your response!
Thanks so much- that’s super helpful!
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Thank you so much! Appreciate the info!
I’ll be the contrary one here. I think you honestly can’t go wrong with either choice. As you noticed, they are both great schools, with differences. BUT….
I would choose Wisconsin. I just think there is lots more going on there just due to size. We thought Richmond was a little too conservative, and really not all that near Richmond. Wisconsin is smack in the middle of Madison.
I do think you will have a better sense if you can go back and visit both again, now as an accepted student.
Really, you can’t go wrong and this will come down to personal choice!
Congratulations on two great acceptances.
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I know a female student who was very unhappy at Wisconsin last year and transferred to Lafayette College for her sophomore year, which is obviously much smaller. She prefers Lafayette. I know a freshman at Richmond, who loves it and is thriving. He’s in the Endeavor Program, which I think is the equivalent of the fellows program at my D’s college.
Maybe spend a weekend at both colleges and see how they feel?
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First, congratulations! Two outstanding, yet different choices. I attended both. Wisconsin for undergrad, Richmond for grad (although both schools have changed a little since then). Make a list of pros and cons and decide what factors are most important. First off, decide if you would be overwhelmed by size of Wisconsin. Students either LOVE it right off, or go through an adjustment. If you do not have direct entry for business school at Madison, I would lean towards Richmond for that aspect. Madison’s B-school is capped and plenty of high performing and qualified students do not get in. However, econ majors are placing into big firms if they have the requisite accounting, finance classes. You can also get your MBA in year 5 if you have enough undergrad classes that count for MBA. Confirm that B-School at Richmond is not capped - I don’t believe it is, subject to reasonable coursework and college GPA requirements. Richmond also has an MBA. You might also look into graduate student placement rates and also job placements. Do you want to go back to Midwest? I think WI and Richmond both place in East coast. Not sure how much Midwestern firms recognize Richmond. Big school spirit - WI wins all day, although Richmond has great spirit for its size. Study Abroad - equal, although Richmond provides a very generous stipend for all study abroad students. Greek life - less important socially at WI, but not as exclusive and competitive at Richmond compared to other southern schools (although Freshman boys are the drivers, so they have less fun). Car on campus - easy to have at Richmond - and if you cannot bring yours, someone else will have one - WI next to impossible. Reportedly, Richmond students move off campus in junior/senior year so you would NEED access to a car then. Small community feel - Richmond wins all day. Nurture - Richmond - fabulous student wellness center with salt meditation rooms, group counseling programs, yoga classes. Professor accessibility, Richmond wins. WI was excellent when I was there, but it certainly doesn’t compare to Richmond. On campus student employment - WI. Weather - Richmond. Diversity - ? Richmond has been working on this A LOT and trying to shift away from a dominant privileged student body; Richmond is now need-blind and guarantees 100% of demonstrated need! Resources - Richmond - huge endowment for the size and comparable with many much larger universities. Opportunities to explore lots of activities, clubs - Wisconsin — just a lot more. BUT, as an example, if you want to be on the dance team, Richmond far less competitive. But Wisconsin has at least 3 performing/competing dance teams, but many more talented dancers auditioning. Consider where you will feel happiest socially. Richmond attracts a lot of students from the Northeast, especially NJ. Wisconsin attracts students from all over, but will always have that Midwestern friendly feel with the majority of students coming from in state. Reportedly, very few VA residents attend Richmond, and are drawn more to UVA, JMU, VA Tech, and others that are less expensive for in state students except those seeking demonstrated need which Richmond now guarantees. Housing - Off-campus housing at Madison is far more expensive than Richmond. Culture - city of Richmond is heavy into arts. So many fun, eclectic sections of town. Richmond is a foodie‘s dream city! One comment referenced Richmond not being near the city. I disagreee. 10 minutes Uber drive. Everything is a 10-15 minute drive. But you have the benefit of going to school at a beautiful contained campus, conducive to building strong social connections. Do you want to be part of a big research university with some large lectures and classes taught by TA’s/grad students? Or do you want a larger LAC with smaller classes taught by professors? Hope this helps! Good luck!
P.S. And Virginia and Carolinas have beaches! VA Beach is 90 minute drive! We went to Hilton Head and Savannah for spring break! Wrightsville is a 4 hour drive.
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My opinion was a heavy UW lean over a Richmond but you’ve done a really nice job summarizing both schools, their environment, pros/cons.
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Awesome write-up @annaliese67 We toured the Richmond campus. Arguably, the cleanest of the 20-30 campuses we visited over two admissions cycles, the lake was absolutely exquisite and OMG, that wellness center! Ultimately, DD had other thoughts in mind. The humungous classes/TAs on the Wisc. side was a concern as well as the talk of housing difficulties as you moved through the college journey. They are two different experiences, no doubt. I would definitely go down the line with the FAFSA if $$$ is a concern. I would like to hear more evidence of students receiving aid from Richmond. We know first-hand that Wisconsin will offer aid to students that they want, or at the very least, match the FAFSA.
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Thank you! So coincidental since both schools are at the top of my student’s list. I honestly don’t know which she would choose if she gets the opportunity (she is in at WI, deferred at Richmond). Both terrific opportunities. I love both schools so much. I loved Wisconsin, but academically would likely have done better at Richmond without the freshman weed-out classes. If I were 18, determined to major in business and had the knowledge that I have now, I would probably pick Richmond (especially without the direct entry business at Wisconsin). I have heard several disappointing stories recently about students not getting into the B-School at Madison. OP should definitely get the B-School admission stats and find out how they decide who gets in and whether there is preference for in-state students? Also, look at average GPAs of graduates
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UW b-school has more students than the entire undergrad population of UR. If the school size is at the top of your list, it’s something to think about. Richmond b-school is their pride and joy, they pull out all stops to highlight its existence and accomplishments. Poets &Quants ranks Richmond higher by 10 or 15 spots than UW, if you pay attention to rankings. Richmond campus is so nice you’d wish you could buy a piece of land and build a house there. If you are not scared off by their COA- $80k+, then it’s easy choice. Not that UW is cheap, $60k OOS…
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Yes, the Richmond campus looks like a movie set, however it also looks boring. I would much rather live on/near the Wisconsin campus.
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I’d say that the Richmond campus is well-suited to those who do well with prosperity, which not everyone does.
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Do you have any first-hand knowledge about Richmond that makes its population and environment any more prosperous than many other schools, and their subset populations, including Wisconsin’s B-school and Greek population? Richmond has changed and continues to change. Is it a top choice for SJW? No. But neither are Wisconsin’s B-school and Langdon Street.
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I can’t address subset populations because there’s no data.
But looking at the school level, at Richmond, 63.5% of students are full pay (36.5% qualify for need based aid per the 2022-23 CDS section H). Richmond’s COA is around $82K per year. Chetty data shows us that the median family income of students is $149,200 and 63% of Richmond’s students are from the top 20%…hence why 63% of the families can afford to pay $82K per year (and I expect some of them are really stretching to do that).
Chetty data tells us that U Wisconsin student median family income is $95,700 with 40% from the top 20%, so these are different populations in terms of family income/relative affluence.
Wisconsin Madison doesn’t meet full need (and gives no need based institutional aid to OOS students) and starts out at a much lower direct COA (26K for in-state, $55K OOS) as compared to Richmond (~$82K COA) so comparing % full pay isn’t all that instructive. Regardless, 2022-23 CDS shows 33% received need based aid. Do I think there are many OOS students paying the full $55K per year COA at Wisconsin? Yes, but that full pay family at $55K COA doesn’t necessarily resemble the full pay family at Richmond with the $82K price. Not really close, on average.
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Great data. Thank you. Take a look at the disappointing race data though.
And yes, IMO based on my personal knowledge of OOS students who attend Wisconsin, the families can easily pay either tuition. Just speculation, but Wisconsin might be hoping to make up the difference in donations and future OOS tuition hikes since the WI legislature continues to deny any in-state tuition increases. And I totally get that. In state students and MN students should be able to afford to go to this wonderful institution. But TBH, WI is absolutely a destination for OOS students from wealthy families who seek a great education (often in business) at a big spirit school where they can still come back to Wall Street and careers with disproportionate income compared to the rest of the nation and WI alum. While they’re at Wisconsin, they run in similar circles. The OP seems like a great student and interested in exploring business and Greek life, but unclear about what environment she wants. She should understand what that experience could look like at WI where, IMO, it could be potentially more socially homogeneous than Richmond depending on her academic and ec path.
“Richmond campus is so nice you’d wish you could buy a piece of land and build a house there.”
“Yes, the Richmond campus looks like a movie set, however it also looks boring. I would much rather live on/near the Wisconsin campus.”
Yes, this 100% checks out. I actually said to my kid, “You can eat off the ground here.” We stumbled upon a LAX tailgate as we arrived on campus. There are some private schools that consider UR something of a pipeline for select students.
That data is pretty old at this point. From the study:
“These estimates are for the 1991 cohort (approximately the class of 2013.”
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My post was in response to the one preceding it. It was intended to refer to Richmond’s campus, which is spacious, well-resourced, aesthetically designed and energized by college students. Those who attend the University of Richmond will have to deal with these characteristics.
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