<p>hops-scout…The superintendent in my district has a job that most would consider easy…a handful of schools and a salary of over $200,000 a year. Yet the teachers are being cut and teachers are being lost. I don’t care that he takes a two or four hour lunch I don’t think we need him to manage a handful of schools. There could be a merging of services in our local towns which would give him a pay raise and yet there would be money left to leave some teachers in place. </p>
<p>I love how people are ready to get rid of teachers yet keep the administration at their current pay when we are obviously top heavy.</p>
<p>My D is certified to teach middle school social studies (BA in european history, minor in econ) and is working on her master’s in special ed. Her aspiration is to one day have a doctorate in urban education. She was a teaching scholar for two years at the toughest inner-city middle school in our area. Based on her experience, I absolutely believe teachers in very poor schools should either earn more or receive some sort of a stipend because it seems to actually cost more out of pocket to teach in those schools because there is no help coming from the parents. My daughter took a class in grant writing (on Saturdays that she paid for out of pocket) because she thinks that it will be one of the most useful skills to her career because if she can write grants well, perhaps she can get her kids things like paper and pens. Maybe even textbooks. I think there should be some support for a teacher to develop special skills that might be beneficial to their situations.</p>
<p>Seriously, a school district superintendent is effectively a CEO. They are managing multiple schools across the entire K-12 spectrum. They are dealing with children from 5 thru 18 years old. They are dealing with administrators, staff, parents, the school board, and the general public. All kinds of issues from providing an atmosphere to promote learning to drug/alcohol abuse to race tensions to suicides (we had a 12 year old in our district take his own life this year). </p>
<p>Personally, I wouldnt take the job for $200K.</p>
<p>^^^
I tend to agree with that. I do think it is an incredibly difficult job. Many towns near me have regional systems. My perception is that they are some of the lower performing school districts. I don’t know if there is a relationship between the performance and the regionalization or not.</p>
<p>I do think that administrators need to be part of the solution during budget difficulties. When teachers take pay freezes or give up contractual benefits due to fiscal issues, it would be much easier to stomach if we knew that our administrative counterparts were also sacrificing part of their own pay.</p>
<p>When teachers take pay freezes or give up contractual benefits due to fiscal issues, it would be much easier to stomach if we knew that our administrative counterparts were also sacrificing part of their own pay.</p>
<p>Or you could be like our district & lay off teachers, cut transportation & close schools & hire more district staff/give them raises. ( & fire the superintendent for doing a poor job but give her a year of severance pay * totaling almost $300K* anyway)</p>
<p>Yup. I was very impressed with a company that during a prior recession cut the CEO’s salary by something like 40-50%, VP salaries by 25%, salaries of everyone making over some amount (something like $75K back then) by 15%, 10% for people making between $40K and 75K, and froze them for everyone earning less than that. They got through the big recession with no layoffs, and I think built a stronger company because of it. </p>
<p>It isn’t just education where I’d like to see more of this – it is a sad commentary on more general management that so few leaders step forward like that. </p>
<p>(During this recession my husband’s company froze salaries for a couple years in order to avoid layoffs, and I was pretty sad to hear from him that some of his much younger co-workers said that they’d rather keep the salary increases even if it meant layoffs. I don’t think many of them had the life experience of trying to find a job in the midst of a deep recession.)</p>
<p>^Well now the salary will be capped as a result of Gov Cristi…The trickle effect has begun. The NJ superindendents have had it much easier in comparison to states where superindendents are in charge of 20 or 30 schools. There is too much griping in NJ, and there could be a lot more working going on. Teachers should not have a job for life just because they have worked for three years, and the time has come to get rid of those who have burned out or retired on the job. </p>
<p>There could be alot of cost savings except nobody rocks the boat. The purchasing of text books is another expense that could be curtailed as is all office supplies. Schools are only able to order from specific sources and would’nt you know those are the most expensive. Why aren’t these things looked at. If I ran my business buying the same materials at the most expensive prices I would go broke…no wonder there is so much finger pointing and back stabbing. The responsibility needs to be shifted on to how money can be saved without it costing the jobs of teachers or the education of students. I can’t even imagine what goes on in bigger states where districts are given budgets that require them to spend or to lose the money. There is so much waste and not nearly enough oversee. Don’t even get me started on the hiring of substitute teachers in my county. They are called in to sub for two classes, and are permitted to hang out in the teachers room for the day…or they are called in for the morning and released in the afternoon and get paid for the day. I know they don’t make a great deal of money, but the job calls for a full day. Why are they in a classroom for two classes and than dismissed or hiding somewhere in the school until the day is over.
Teachers are having a hard time in my state right now but the reality is that the waste is out of control…that is what needs to be addressed first…why are office supplies and text books costing top price with high priced vendors? There are so many ways to reduce costs and teachers are not the first place they should be looking.</p>
<p>Whatever is pay, system does not work. American k -12 has pitiful results, kids are struggling at colleges, even top kids, and yes, even top kids from private schools at state colleges. Many need help to bring them up to college level. Kudoes for those who realize that and are not too proud to seek help either thru college tutoring system, profs office hours or hiring private tutors.<br>
It absolutely does not have to be this way!!! And it is not in many other countries. My D. just started Med. School. Who is majority in her class? Asian kids from Ivy’s! Yes, even the ones who were educated in American k -12, I am sure got lots of help and support at home from parents who are still able to help with calculus without ever using it in their life…because these people who barely speak English and some of them not even driving cars, they still know their math, science. If you teach them properly in k - 12, they will know it for the rest of their lives, just like they know how to speak. </p>
<p>All this pay talk means nothing. Teachers are paid well for 9 months work, better than most others. Who do not feel so, can look for job in industry. I know several people who did. Everybody do whatever makes them happy. Nobody is capable of forcing you to stay in teaching position. I myself completely changed my profession because I was not happy with my first choice. I went ot school until I was 40 working full time since 19 and having family. Everything is possible, it is up to individual, not the system. Education, compensation, job security, there are choices, you are free to choose.</p>
<p>“Teachers are paid well for 9 months work, better than most others. Who do not feel so, can look for job in industry.”</p>
<p>This is always my favorite quote. I can turn that right around. Those who feel teachers are overpaid and underworked are free to look for a job in that industry. </p>
<p>Oh yeah, you’d need education credits and certifications. Oh yeah, you’d have to engage 25 children indoors, on rainy days, for 6 hours when their minds are somewhere else. Oh yeah, everyone will think you’re a greedy slacker who doesn’t care about the kids. That you’re in it for the “gravy train” it is. Oh yeah, for every well-intentioned parent who wants to be involved, you’ll have to deal with one who unreasonably expects you to spend an hour a day just on their child. …… </p>
<p>fwiw, i’m not a teacher. I just recognize that their job is not near as easy as others think it is. And no one has ever become independently wealthy by becoming a teacher!</p>
<p>"This is always my favorite quote. I can turn that right around. Those who feel teachers are overpaid and underworked are free to look for a job in that industry. "</p>
<p>-Yes, exactly my point. We are all free to pursue whatever we want. More so, we can change our pursuit whenever we want. There are people who start Med. School in their late 40s, believe it or not. And why not? Go and try! I have with very satisfying results. Hate my first choice, love the second.</p>
While I agree that good teachers work hard and don’t get paid a whole lot, I disagree with your turnaround. The people that view teaching as a career where you can get a decent salary with little work are a large part of the problem with education in America.</p>
<p>I have immense respect for my teachers who put in a noticeable effort, and I have no respect for those who clearly want an easy job. But it is a job where you can often get away with going through the motions.</p>
<p>When I was a kid, I had several teachers who had a profound impact on me. Most of them were impactful in a good way. One was damaging to me.</p>
<p>When I was trying to decide what I wanted to do with my life, it was those good teachers that I thought about. It seemed like a wonderful idea to become like them. When I graduated with my degree I was very proud to be a licensed teacher. That pride stayed with me and every time I told someone that I was a teacher, I really expected them to be as excited about it as I was! lol.
Even now, I find myself so surprised by the contempt and negativity that I get at times in relation to my profession. It still surprises me! </p>
<p>I still love my job and am honored to do it but, truly, it gets wearing to feel like you have to be on the defensive all the time. I know that the system isn’t perfect and there is certainly room for change and improvement but, overall, it works pretty well. Our public schools give EVERY child an opportunity to learn. There are not many countries that can claim that.</p>
<p>Were those complaining about the pay freezes were relatively low paid employees who got stellar performance reviews, so that the pay freezes likely cost them larger raises (especially as a percentage of then current pay) compared to other employees?</p>
<p>My daughter interviewed for a teaching position in WI yesterday. Starting salary was 31K, and 20% of that goes back to the district to pay for insurance and pension. </p>
<p>She will barely make enough to pay for rent and her student loans, and will have to continue to nurse her 12 year old car if she’s lucky enough to be offered the job.</p>
<p>^ It is unacceptable that a professional such as a teacher is barely making enough money to cover rent and loans. I really feel for these kids trying to make their way as independant young adults.</p>
<p>^ Does it bother you that graduate students in academia make less than that? A lot (most?) innovative, forward-looking, society-advancing research comes from graduate students’ efforts, and yet they usually live at or below the poverty line. Not to mention loans.</p>
<p>Really, as long as there are people willing to take teaching jobs for crappy pay, nothing is going to change. We need to convince young people not to go into teaching… that way, if society cares about education, things will change.</p>
<p>Or recognize that the rigid salary schedule employed by most school districts was negotiated by unions that aren’t much invested in shifting more money into starting salaries and away from big jumps in much later years. I’ve seen districts offer to raise starting salaries while capping experience increases (not COLA) at 15 years, and been thoroughly rebuffed. Makes sense if you consider that none of the people sitting at the table represent teachers yet to be hired.</p>
<p>Similarly, the unions have often opposed salary boosts for teaching in Title I (high poverty) schools, though there is rather general agreement that those schools pose the greatest challenges for teachers.</p>
<p>There’s a difference-- graduate student and teacher. Two different things. </p>
<p>Education isn’t the only place it’s like that. I will make somewhere between $28-30,000 this year. And then I’m headed back to school in fall 2012 to make my $10,000 a year for a couple of years. Oh well, it’s only money…</p>
<p>Why we are so bothered who is making what. Do not like, you have a veto power, leave, find another place. I have left and was laid off many times. At my place #9. Sometime my salary was cut by 50% at new place, sometime I got 50% increase. sometime they ask how much I wanted, sometime they gave more than I expected without even asking me. My H’s salary was not just frozen. Freeze is a very good thing. Many places oficially cut hours to 30 and paid only for 30. Did he work less than his usual 60 - 70hrs, no day off. Nope, continued the same. You do what you need to do. All this talks about fair/no fair are irrelevent. Do not like, quit, find what you like. It includes profession itself. I have changed it also, went back to school while working full time. Everything is possible. People even go to other countries to work if they choose to do so. There are no slaves here, free to be in charge of your own life, nobody else will do it for you, fairness is irrelevent. Like positions compensated at millions of dollars, go for them, who said you are worse than the next person?</p>
Sure they’re different, but aren’t graduate students important? It would seem a little hypocritical to bemoan negative views of teachers’ compensation and then dismiss the low pay afforded graduate assistants (note: you can be a graduate student without being an assistant… being a student doesn’t get you paid a dime).</p>