Should you take 3 years of English in high school if accelerated [9th grade English taken in 8th grade]

Parents Forum
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Our school had this type of progression. Freshman year, everyone took Human Geography. Sophomore year, a world history class, junior year us history, senior year – macro and micro econ, or psych, or modern history, or government or politics. Some kids did a science senior year instead of one of these. They also had an option to do US history online over the summer.

You need to carefully read what your school requires for graduation.

My kid finished AP FL junior year so freed time that way. He put in a philosophy class and took econ instead of history.

Schools offer varying levels of choice and customization. Colleges will understand your choices in this context.

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My D’s HS didn’t offer a history class for freshmen because they used that period for the required state health requirement one semester and an intro to the school type class for the other. After that the history progression was Euro in 10th, US in 11th, and then 1 semester of Gov and 1 semester of Econ in 12th. It meant Gov and Econ moved very quickly but very doable.

I think it’s hard to advise without knowing the specifics of what’s offered at your child’s HS and what is the normal course progression.

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43

The question I actually want to ask is:
Is a very selective college fine with students to not taking 4 years of a core subject in high school if he has completed 4 high school courses before senior since he took high school courses in middle school. No skipping here. The consensus here is he needs to take all core courses in 4 high school years no matter what credits he got before starting high school. So by doing that, my son will eventually have the following on his high school transcript: 7 years of high school math ( 3 took in middle school), 5 years of ELA and science ( took one of each in middle school) and 4 years of social studies. Is my understanding correct?

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There are 3 years of Social Studies here. Health/School Intro is not. Right? Does she need to take another year social studies to make it 4 years?

Our graduation requires 3 years of social studies as well as 1 semester of health and 1 semester of PE. We will take the health in the summer. And PE can be waived by marching band.

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Not sure of your exact situation, but generally courses taken in middle school are not given high school credit nor do they appear on the high school transcript. Talk to your hs guidance counselor about what actually appears on the transcript that accompanies the college applications.

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46

Seems like one of the factors is whether the school allows 6 versus 7 classes at a time. At schools where only 6 classes are allowed, that tends to be more limiting in what students can choose:

  • 24 total year long classes.
  • 20 used for 4 years each of English, math, social studies, science, foreign language.
  • 1+ used for arts (required or recommended by some colleges).
  • 0.5+ used for health or other requirements like PE.
  • That leaves at most 2.5 year long (or 5 semesters) electives, unless the student tops out foreign language or math early, or takes <4 years of social studies or science.
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Depends on the subject. If a student completes the highest level of math or foreign language with only 3 years, that tends to be more acceptable than taking only 3 years of English, which is not as strictly leveled.

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Closing temporarily for review. @ivymcginnis please check your messages.

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51

I edited the original post to clarify that this student is currently in 8th grade.

My two cents… At least some of the energy you’re spending on crafting an ideal schedule would be better spent on him cultivating exceptional EC’s. That is what will make him stand out. He is young enough to make an impact before he is a senior, if he has genuine enthusiasm for activities outside of schoolwork. Almost all successful applicants are going to have excellent academics. It’s the other stuff that sets kids apart. But it really needs to come from him.

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52

There might be some miscommunication. Sorry about that.

It is probably more about if a college prefer to see no gap year for a core subject. Maybe they don’t want to see a student not having a math class in senior even he has exceeded. Is that the case?

I can access the “in progress” high school transcript now. The high school courses my son took or taking in middle school are all there: 3 math, 1 English and 1 science. For example, he will complete 9th ELA honor by end of this school year (8th grade). He will do AP Seminar/10th grade ELA combo in freshman, AP language in sophomore, AP Lit in Junior. Will that open a spot for him to take a AP science course in senior or should he find another ELA ( the option for us is either 12th Adv Comp or a dual enrollment ELA)? We prefer to take a AP science in senior if that is not going to hurt his chance to a very selective college.

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My kids both took HS level courses in middle school. This enabled them to take a higher level course once they started 9th grade. NONE of the middle school courses or grades appeared on their high school transcripts.

I would VERY strongly suggest that you NOT plan the next four years of high school with top/elite schools as the reason for doing so. Let your kid take the sequence of courses, and do ECs he enjoys. If he ends up being well suited to apply to elite schools, then he will do so.

My opinion.

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54

Re: this question -
It depends. What does it depend on? Here’s some possible factors:

  • What does the ‘school profile’ look like for this high school?
  • How far above the ‘average’ student for this particular high school does the applicant compare?
  • What are the specific requirements for graduation from that high school?
  • What are the specific minimum requirements that the college you’re applying to has?
  • What is listed in the Common Data Set (CDS) for admitted students for that college? (you can look this up on pretty much every college website…go to the school’s search engine and look up “CDS” or “common data set”)

etc., etc.

What the super-mega-elite colleges will probably NOT tell you is something like “Here’s the formula to get accepted here and yes, if your kid takes Band + Drama and skips a 4th social studies class and skips a 4th english class, he/she will get admitted here.”

You should start listening to the “Your College Bound Kid” podcast. They have episodes twice a week and offer up a lot of really great info and advice. Also check out the “College Essay Guy” podcast.

My kid’s HS transcript does list a couple of middle school classes. But just because middle school classes are on the transcript, that doesn’t mean that a college takes those middle school classes into account when they’re calculating what your kid’s HS GPA is or anything like that…that’s where it’ll entirely depend on the specific college.

What you REALLY should do is contact the admissions department of a couple of the schools you’re wondering about and ask them some of these questions directly.

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55

Are you planning on camping out at the high school?

Okay, Ive read through all of these posts and the advice that has been given has been for the benefit of your child.

My children were accepted to Top 20 Schools. Our son attended a Top 10. They all took the prescribed high school courses.
What you need to realize is that other parents, on this web site, have children who have had advanced courses in middle school and have been through the admissions process to get into elites. They are giving you the best advice.

My son also had middle school courses that would have counted for high school credit, but it was at the option of the high school to give the credit for progression.

A majority of the time, those courses won’t show up on the HS transcript. What the high school receives is level of progress. So even though you have 3 math, it may just show up as the “last level for ‘high school level equivalent’”. Why would the HS give you 3 years of graduation credit for courses that WERE NOT taken at their school?

The person at our high school who was supposed to be Valedictorian, “Kevin” ended up having to go to summer school. His mother was so busy futzing around and micromanaging his schedule, that they missed a core class that she intended to have him take at the CC but “forgot”.

He was rescinded by all of his top 10s. We found out was because the Principal met with and told our son that DS had been bumped up to Salutatorian. (There were 5 kids within tenths of Valedictorian status.) Our son was shocked because “Kevin” his friend and teammate no longer had the graduation requirement to graduate from his HS.

I was on-staff at the high school, but I also was a sports team parent for my kids’ teams. Kevin’s mother came screaming at me: “Why didn’t you tell me that my kid needed to meet graduation requirements!!! Isn’t your son doing the same schedule as my son???”
I told her, “I am not a guidance counselor. I have no idea about your son’s schedule. My children are responsible for meeting with their guidance counselors and I don’t know anything about their schedules unless they tell me. I do have a great relationship will all of their teachers.”

I was a team parent, but I never assumed that I would be including myself in their school lives because they are the ones taking the courses and it is their life. I wanted my kids to slowly learn how to be good students and independent adults.

“Kevin” had already put down his housing deposit for Princeton. I suggested that they could have him start at the local CC and then transfer. The parent wanted nothing to do with a CC. He wanted to go to the CC, but his parents wouldn’t allow him to go. Eventually, after a year, I spoke to our son and “suggested” that Kevin use the year as a “gap” and save money by working and then reapplying. He did reapply but didn’t get the same result, and thankfully, applied to the local UC, and got in.

You do you. I’m trying to save you some grief.

If the web sites say 4 years, they really mean 4 years. Even if it says, “recommended”, they mean what they write in the admissions section. Middle school grades are fluff to get to the next level. At some point, your child may want to exhibit his independence and may choose to take something that isn’t in the “we” plan. You need to be ready for it because you cannot attend college with him.

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56

“Recommended” is commonly interpreted as “required unless not available” when it comes to competing for admission to highly selective colleges.

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57

My kids all took ELA 9 in 8th grade too. That and every other high school class they took in middle school is shown on their transcript, with a grade. It’s not in the GPA, but it is listed.

My son is in engineering and he did a little happy dance on his last day of English class before graduation. He had placed out of both English 1 and 2 and didn’t have to take any in college. He used AP and IB History to get gen eds done. So consider having him continue with AP Lang and Lit, dual enrollment, etc and have him place out of college classes. I realize the highest rated colleges won’t accept them, but in case he ends up somewhere else, it may help a lot.

58

Beyond requirements, the most selective schools want kids who have enthusiasm for learning. That is something that is demonstrated by using advanced status to go deeper and further into subjects. Classes taken in middle school are, for this purpose, middle school classes.

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59

Not sure if mentioned yet, but your high schools record with these school will matter regardless of what schedule you craft for your child.

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Lots and lots of students have this sort of resume. Counting high school level taken in middle school, mine (both at T10s) had:

  • 5 Foreign Language years(one was middle),

  • math: 8.5 yrs of math (3 in middle) for one, 6 years HS maths for the other (2 in middle).

  • one had 5.5 yrs History(all HS) , one had 4,

  • science : one had 6.5 science years, the other had 5 (none in middle for either).

  • both had 4 yrs English(all HS).
    -both took orchestra all 4 yrs.

Bottom line , “high school” courses taken in middle school in general do not matter and are not considered unusual or impressive or worthy of cutting courses in HS. What matters for elites is to maximize the course rigor across subjects and take all 5 courses to the highest level possible, with regard to what is allowed and offered at the HS, and within reason considering schedule constraints, and only if the kid is excited about all of the courses.

Edit, for maximum clarity: both kids are surrounded by peers in college who did a very similar path and both know some kids who took a higher level of some subject in HS (that was not offered at their HS): the level of HS preparation that the majority of kids have at these schools is astounding.

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