Sochi 2014

Parent Cafe
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<p>They all had the same coach 4 years ago when they won and Davis and White placed second. The coach had to change his Canada jacket to a USA jacket depending on which couple he sat with. It was very close then too and when it’s so close, it is hard to evaluate judging. There always seems to be some wiggle room and we wonder how much pre-judging is going on in their heads.</p>

<p>I’m sure the judges take their jobs very seriously and try to be as fair as possible. But the history of figure skating judging is horribly tainted and people are always afraid of some of that coming back. Particularly in ice dancing, where the mistakes are so tiny and hard to notice compared with not landing a jump. The degree of difficulty is harder to see also. </p>

<p>FWIW, there have been rumblings about the snowboard judging too. The athletes are frustrated because they don’t seem to know exactly what the judges are looking for. </p>

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<p>Shiloh, the issue with the coach was brought up long before the Olympics. Ultimately, they made the decision to remain with the coach. That was their decision and I haven’t seen any indication of sour grapes or that they didn’t support Davis and White. In fact, in every interview I’ve seen, they have complimented them and congratulated them on the gold. Scott and Charlie are very good friends, the girls less so. The judging issues have been around for as long as skating has. The debacle at the Salt Lake City games resulted in the scoring changes, from what I recall, but the complicated methods of scoring and the anonymity contribute to the conspiracy theory that was introduced prior to the games by the Russian coach and the French journalist.</p>

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<p>^^^ Interesting since it was the Russians and French colluding at Salt Lake City.</p>

<p>Am I the only one wondering why just about everyone (in figure skating) trains in Michigan? </p>

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<p>Moir and Virtue would have been better off keeping their mouths shut, rather than making veiled accusations at their coach after they got the silver. It looks like sour grapes, and it is certainly something they wouldn’t have said if they had skated exactly the same, but Davis/White had made some small mistake and Virtue/Moir had taken the gold. The time to deal with perceived coaching issues is before the skating year begins, not when the two skaters are about to retire.</p>

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<p>Did anyone watch the aerials? The guy from Belorus began to celebrate as soon as the second Chinese guy wiped out on the landing. Not classy. BTW, the Chinese aerialist had a spectacular crash landing: he was fallng head down, did a somersault on the ground and ended the run on his feet! Like a cat tossed out of a 3rd floor window! Wow, just wow - how he stayed in one piece is simply incredible.</p>

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<p>Skaters change coaches all the time. If the Canadians felt they were being shortchanged by their coach, they should’ve found a new one. Their complaining now is coming off as sour grapes.</p>

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<p>The reason everyone trains in Michigan is an accident of history: two of the leading coaches moved there and worked together. What happened is that Marina Zueva came there and then Igor Shpilband “defected” just before the end of the USSR and, it seems, she helped him get a job in the area. They eventually started working together and that attracted a handful of the other top coaches and that created a cluster in which the coaches and athletes could exchanged skills, grow, etc. The two original coaches have now split up and that has spread their influence to more skaters. Even the bronze medal Russian girl trained there for 2 years - when she was like 15. </p>

<p>BTW, if you’re into this stuff, Zueva choreographed Ekaterina Godeeva and Sergei Grinkov’s pairs routines. They were dominant - and married. Grinkov died during practice when he was 28.</p>

<p>This kind of clustering thing happens all the time in business. Want an odd one? For a number of years some decades back, the best fencing schools in the country, competitive at the world level, were Wayne State and University of Detroit. Why? Because a few Hungarian coaches defected and ended up in Detroit. </p>

<p>As to Scott Moir’s comments, probably true in the way he probably meant it, which is their coach saw more opportunity to raise Davis/White’s scores and thus they got more attention. Not a lot, but if you look at the intricacy of Davis/White’s skating, you can see how that can be true. Did it mean anything? Probably not. The reality is Davis/White have been better for a few years because they skate very technical programs with more technical accuracy. Moir/Virtue are perhaps better artistically but not as technically perfect and perhaps not as technically difficult in some of the footwork. </p>

<p>I find it funny to hear about judging, considering we don’t know which judge’s scores are even counted and that, as I noted above, the technical moments are each graded by a technical judge separately. </p>

<p>I think it’s also pretty humorous and reflective of the internet era that every speculation becomes repeated until it’s treated as fact. So for example, a Toronto Star opinion piece I mentioned yesterday is now cited as an “article” instead of what it is, which is a columnist paid to state an opinion forcefully doing exactly that without reporting behind it. </p>

<p>(BTW, I’m not saying one judge may not like Moir/Virtue’s skating compared to White/Davis’. That’s always going to happen.)</p>

<p>I also wanted to mention in regard to Bode Miller’s interview that it’s important to remember the reporter/TV microphone holder was almost certainly being told in her earpiece to keep asking about his dead brother. The fault is with the producers and then the decision to air the footage without editing. And she should have ignored what was in her ear, but she’s an employee and …</p>

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<p>Did they bring up the coaching issue in an interview? I’ve seen probably six interviews and read several more and didn’t see the issue being initiated by either of them, but when the interviewer asks a question about whether they ever considered switching coaches, it’s difficult to give an honest answer without appearing to be laying blame. I think in some instances, the sentiment might be accurate, e.g., the fact that their coach did not attend Canadian nationals, which is pretty much unheard of but the fact remains that they chose to remain with the coach they’ve been affiliated with for about ten years. They knew the situation, as did Davis and White, none of them is stupid. They have all been asked in interviews for the past couple of years leading up to these Olympics about sharing a coach and training center. They are probably all sick to death of the question, and certainly, after watching the Bode Miller interview, we all know how manipulative/stupid/insensitive these interviewers can be. If I hear one more athlete being asked ‘how does it feel?’, ‘what does it mean to you?’, ‘what are you thinking?’, I will probably throw something at the tv.</p>

<p>Love watching the performances but hate all the drama. All three couples on the podium skated beautifully and brought a lot of enjoyment to fans both in Sochi and around the world. Here’s hoping that the pairs and the ladies competitions are drama-free!</p>

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<p>Drama free figure skating. lol.</p>

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<p>Always mom, yes in an interview after the finals. Isaw it on a Toronto feed, just google virtue moir unhappy coach and it will pop up. They say they have been unhappy for a while. However, they fail to point out she, the coach, had more teams competing for the U.S. at the Olympics and at nationals (which were held at the same time as those for U.S.). That is what I base my sour grapes comment on. They knew ahead of time the circumstances. She has two U.S. teams, and then there was them. Plus she coaches others.</p>

<p>And I agree the producers were to blame on the miller interview, but the reporter was awkward and supposedly a friend of bode’s which makes me question her persistence even more. Job or no job I would not do that to a friend on TV.</p>

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<p>I think there was also another Italian coach who represented at least four skaters from Europe. If you want the best coach then you have to understand the consequences.</p>

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<p>And therefore, they should just shut up. It’s no doubt true that they thought their coach was spending more time with their training partners than with them. It’s also no doubt true that they thought their coach was the best coach for them, or they would have changed coaches. Some things are better left unsaid.</p>

<p>If skaters start whining about their coach after a disappointment, it just looks like sour grapes.</p>

<p>People watch sports for the drama. It’s just like opera-- it’s all about the emotion.</p>

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<p>I thought the exact same thing!!</p>

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<p>I thought the top three ice dancing couples were all amazing. I was really blown away by the Russian ice dancers. Loved their music and choreography. Wow!</p>

<p>At the elite levels in every sport there are a handful of coaches who are topnotch; athletes want these coaches and the coaches often end up with more than a few contenders for nationals or world championships or the Olympics. In the one sport with which I’m familiar (rhythmic gymnastics)–it’s the same way. One coach in rhythmics, for example, has four athletes on the US National team (juniors and seniors).</p>

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<p>Even in some very popular sports, like swimming, there is a handful of coaches who tend to master coaching for a certain event. A local team used to attract Olympians from other countries, such as Russia and South Africa, to come here and train for a while, and in 2008 several former teammates raced each other in one event, each representing her own country. The difference is that at least in the US new, official coaching staff gets selected for each Olympic team by the governing body of the sport (eg, USA Swimming) for the duration of the games, and the club coach may or may not get picked for that role. </p>

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<p>I guess I’m not seeing what everyone else is seeing, but I thought Davis & White’s artistry was superior to Virtue & Moir’s, in addition to being technically perfect. </p>

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<p>It’s difficult to change coaches even at a lower level. A girl I know was sexually assaulted by her coach. She and her partner are out of the sport (ice dancing), the coach is still coaching. If they had wanted to change coaches they would have had to move very far away. Somehow all the local stuff is divided into “clubs” you belong to and it’s harder to change, for any reason, than you would imagine. </p>

<p>He pled guilty and was given a year probation but no time off from coaching. Many people in the ice dancing community were angry at her for bringing accusations forward!</p>

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<p>^^^A coach convicted of sexual assault and he still has contact with athletes?? Why would any athlete want to train with him? Why wouldn’t the governing body of the sport expel him?</p>

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<p>I used to skate at one of the facilities Davis and White skated at every week in high school, it’s down the street from where I grew up. It’s kind of cool! It makes it all feel more real to have even a distant connection like that. </p>

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<p>Who choreographed Virtue-Moir routine? I have read analysis of long programs and in one piece someone opined that Virtue-Moir routine had some dead moments, where they were seemingly doing nothing. Maybe the blame should be on a choreographer? Although it is entirely possible that Marina Zoueva is both their choreographer and a coach.</p>

<p>ETA: It was Zoueva who choreographed both programs.</p>

<p>P.S. I have read of the sexual assault case before. Sad.</p>