<p>You just likened programming to “web design,” which is a subset of programming, and… gardening? That’s ridiculous.</p>
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<p>Making a spreadsheet is programming. In fact, bolding and italicizing words in your comments on this very message board is programming. And the more you know about it, the better you will be at using a computer.</p>
<p>Well, in that case, everyone knows it already. Case closed.</p>
<p>And you’re right about the ridiculousness of equating gardening and web design. Raising food is much more important.</p>
<p>I was referring to the absurdity of a classification system that allows you to a. compare all of these things, and b. claim web design with programming are the same kind of “sub-technology,” when one is a subset of the other.</p>
<p>And yes, a lot of people know how to code in php and HTML and CSS because of the kinds of websites they frequent, to an extent. That was my point. The next step would be to become better at them–and maybe learn other languages. The case is far from closed when other languages, like Python and C++, have more diverse applications than php.</p>
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You don’t have to, but knowing how to write macros and functions in Visual Basic for Applications can help you make more powerful spreadsheets or to automate what they do. Some non-programmers don’t know what they are missing.</p>
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<p>Yes, but a modern society does not need more than a few percent of its people to raise food, while it needs a larger fraction to be proficient with computers, often involving some programming.</p>
<p>The point of learning programming, at least to me, is not to learn specifically how to make computer programs, but to learn how to think abstractly and logically, and how to break down large problems into smaller ones. There was another thread where people were talking about how to communicate with different types of audiences, and programming is pretty much communicating with a computer. Except computers aren’t human, so you have to make sure you’re logically correct all the way through, and you have to explain things to a certain detail you might not have to with others. For instance, teaching someone how to sort a list in alphabetical order is very different from trying to get a computer to sort a list in alphabetical order. I don’t think that’s something you can learn from gardening or whatever, but I’m not an experienced gardener, so I guess I can’t say. And I think most people would benefit from learning these sorts of things.</p>
<p>To be fair, I think you can get these sorts of things from a math class that had proofs. But I don’t think people do proofs anymore, and if they do, they’re not very demanding. It’s pretty easy to teach math by just giving theorems, without doing proofs. I’m pretty sure no one in my high school ever learned how to prove the Pythagorean theorem, for example, even though everyone knew it. It’s not as easy to sort of cheat through this when teaching programming.</p>
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<p>It is an intellectual skill that demands a certain level of abstract thinking that people develop at different ages, and that some people will never develop. Lots of people never get algebra, and they will probably struggle with programming, too. I do think college graduates should be smart enough to program and have done a little of it.</p>
<p>We all do some degree of programming (in whatever language) everyday be it your TV remote control, your cellphone or your watch. Has anybody here tried to “program” an electronic thermostat? S1 seems to be saying that it is really not that hard to go up one level. Our children need to acquire skills in college that we couldn’t have dreamed of 20 years ago. So, at least to play it safe, if would be wise to encourage our children to at least take one computer science course in their 4 years of college if they haven’t decided that on their own already.</p>
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<p>I would hate to work in a company where every employee with minimal skill in the field were to contribute to a programming project; it would be like building a rickety tower that is eventually going to collapse when the 10th or 12th person comes along to add or update a feature.</p>
<p>The person that wrote that piece has a lot of misunderstandings about programming and computer science:</p>
<p>“I don’t mean that you need to become genius programmers, the kind who hack into NASA’s computers for fun. Coding at such a level is a very particular and rare skill, one that most of us—myself included—don’t possess, just as we don’t possess the athletic ability to play for the New York Knicks.”</p>
<p>You don’t need to be a programmer to be a hacker. You can use tools or other methods to hack. What’s more you don’t have to be a genius either.</p>
<p>There are a lot of levels to the game and this guy is somewhat confused - that comes across in his writing.</p>
<p>“Consider this example: Suppose you’re sitting in a meeting with clients, and someone asks you how long a certain digital project is slated to take. Unless you understand the fundamentals of what engineers and programmers do, unless you’re familiar enough with the principles and machinations of coding to know how the back end of the business works, any answer you give is a guess and therefore probably wrong.”</p>
<p>This is incorrect. If you’re a good manager, you should know. Even if you’re not an engineer. Even if you don’t a thing about programming.</p>
<p>I agree - the author of the piece does not seem to know much about programming. For one thing, I thin any serious programmer would find the idea that predicting “how long” a complicated programming task will take rather humorous. (Hmmm… “how long” until Windows gets all the kinks worked out of Windows 8?) In terms of bidding for a project, the manager or sales rep would get estimates from the programmers and make representations along those lines – and it would be irresponsible for them not to take those steps. </p>
<p>“Programming” is not one thing. Writing a macro for Word is not the same as tweaking a PHP script, nor is that the same as creating a new piece of software from scratch.</p>
<p>Sorry Kirk, not everybody wants to work with you.</p>
<p>polarscribe, I manage a team of product managers and user experience designers. It is very useful to understand the difficulties and joys of programming. It is critical to understand the way in which software systems and sub-systems are built.</p>
<p>Yes, because you manage a team of product managers and user experience designers.</p>
<p>Computer literacy and skill in Microsoft Word, Excel, Powerpoint, and so forth have nothing to do with this. I’m highly skilled in Powerpoint just due to the nature of my job. That doesn’t mean I’m a “programmer.” This statement below …</p>
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<p>… is all Greek to me. I wouldn’t know what coding in php and HTML and CSS and Python and C++ are if I tripped over them. Because I don’t need to know. And I work with people in advertising and media all the livelong day.</p>
<p>And this quote from the article is particularly stupid:<br>
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<p>You don’t need to know how they do what they do specifically to be able to provide project timelines. Any manager manages plenty of people / projects where they don’t necessarily know exactly how to do the specific thing they are overseeing, but they know how long it will take. </p>
<p>This guy’s the kind of guy who sees nails everywhere because he loves to use a hammer.</p>
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<p>Lots of skills require a certain level of abstract thinking. But I don’t go around saying everyone should have to learn how to write a creative brief for a new product. Here’s a concept - instead of throwing everyone into some programming-uber-alles bucket, how about those who want to program go do it, and those who don’t can use their abstract thinking skills elsewhere?</p>
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<p>An example of the use of computers applied to humanities and social studies (how the frequency of word use changes over time):</p>
<p>[Google</a> Ngram Viewer](<a href=“http://books.google.com/ngrams/]Google”>Google Ngram Viewer)</p>
<p>No one is saying that computers aren’t useful, or that computer skills aren’t useful. But that’s different from saying everyone should know how to program.</p>
<p>The comment about estimating timelines struck me as particularly stupid as well. Specific knowledge of how to do a particular task is not required to do timelines and estimates. And if this guy thinks that someone knowing, say, Python (insert any language here), is going to help someone estimate a programming task better, I can’t imagine that he’s very good at it.</p>
<p>The argument against learning any programming at all is the classic argument against progress. People have been frightened-by/questioned/fighting technology for generations. And the next generation always scratched their heads, wondering why the previous generation couldn’t/wouldn’t embrace the technology.</p>
<p>I predict that all college-bound children, who are in elementary school now, will graduate college with some level of required programming skills. </p>
<p>Anyone reading this, if devoid of programming skills, risks being under qualified for employment right now. This may be as simple as learning how to manipulate spread sheets… input formulas, massage data, etc… …and goes up from there.</p>
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<p>Not in my field. Skill at starting IVs, knowledge of IV meds and proper administration of same, knowledge about relevant procedures and interventions, patient assessment, ability to respond to anesthesia related problems or procedure related complications, etc., trumps programming skills every day. ;)</p>