Southern Ivy League

[the_prestige]

<p>Harvard students bash their college?</p>

<p>My close friends who went to Harvard absolutely rave about it.</p>

[UCBChemEGrad]

<p>^ I was a Berkeley undergrad and I rave about it.</p>

<p>Berkeley has probably 5-6x as many undergrads as Dartmouth, so of course you’re going to hear a wider (and louder) opinion.</p>

<p>Dartmouth is a great, small, very selective, liberal arts focused private college located in a picturesque, remote, bucolic setting.
Cal is a great, large, very selective (for its size), world renowned research university located in one of the most picturesque and dynamic world cities.</p>

<p>Both have their plusses and minuses. Let’s just leave it at that.</p>

<p>Heh, how does a thread titled “Southern Ivy League” turn into a debate over Dartmouth and Cal? I guess when a thread goes on long enough…anything is possible.</p>

[meangirl]

<p>

@slik nik

you seem to contradict yourself by saying Duke > Rice. In a post you made on the “Schools on the Rise” thread a few days ago, even you stated verbatim: “My point that the differences in educational quality between Duke and Rice are negligible still stands.”

</p>

<p>No. I do not (seem to) contradict myself. I never said that Duke offers a significantly better undergraduate education than Rice. (But negligible differences are still differences.) And even if I did, this wouldn’t be contradictory unless “Duke > Rice” somehow meant that Duke is better than Rice in every single imaginable and conceivable way, which it obviously doesn’t.</p>

<p>I only said that Duke has stronger faculty and departmental programs as well as stronger professional school placement. That is what I meant by “Duke > Rice.” Please do not take my words out of context again.</p>

<p>

@slik nik

Does that mean Duke is better than Rice? No it doesn’t not.

</p>

<p>Here I won’t take YOUR words out of context because you’re talking about quality of undergraduate education. But you yourself have admitted that Duke is better than Rice in other ways. This is what YOU stated in posts #32, #37 & #62 in the following thread:</p>

<p><a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/rice-university/136350-rice-respected-duke.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/rice-university/136350-rice-respected-duke.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>

@slik nik

I believe Duke’s academics are slightly better than any of the other southern schools because of the access to greater resources

</p>

<p>

@slik nik

Duke offers the best academics in the South

</p>

<p>

@slik nik

Duke > Rice/Davidson> Emory=Vanderbilt

</p>

<p>

@slik nik

I would argue that academics are a tad bit better than at Rice since they have more faculty members and more resources because of Duke’s size.

</p>

<p>Since you have done extensive research into Rice vs. Duke and have attended classes on both campuses, I will take you at your word. Thanks for playing.</p>

[the_prestige]

<p>

Heh, how does a thread titled “Southern Ivy League” turn into a debate over Dartmouth and Cal? I guess when a thread goes on long enough…anything is possible.

</p>

<p>You should know by now that all CC threads eventually lead to a Cal discussion.</p>

[meangirl]

<p>

@episcopal

I’ll take you word that you never said sports were irrelevant. That was directed at…meangirl.

</p>

<p>You seem to have an annoying habit of accusing people of saying things they never said. First the_prestige and now me. Where on earth did I ever say that sports were “irrelevant”? </p>

<p>Quite the contrary, I stated in post #173:</p>

<p>

@meangirl

Quote:
Originally Posted by Corbett
The hawkette schools are holdovers from a different era in college history: they are quaint, but they are not the future. </p>

<p>I wouldn’t go this far. While the balance of academics and athletics may be too heavily weighed for sports in some of the hawkette schools, there are some in the Ivy League community who envy at least the Stanford model:</p>

<p>Meritocracy 1, Harvard 0 | The Harvard Crimson</p>

<p>Yale Daily News - Either go big, Bulldogs, or just go home

</p>

[Schmaltz]

<p>Still think Duke and Georgetown would go Ivy without hesitation if it were offered to them. They’d gain millions of bucks from students who’d attend without needing fin. aid.</p>

[bluedog]

<p>

Still think Duke and Georgetown would go Ivy without hesitation if it were offered to them. They’d gain millions of bucks from students who’d attend without needing fin. aid.

</p>

<p>Uh, no. Give up their athletic programs (namely basketball) to join the Ivy League? NEVER would happen. Too much publicity and too much money would be lost. Plus, it’s part of their identities. It’d be like creating a different school. It’s analogous to Michigan giving up it’s football; it would be incredibly stupid to do that…Also I don’t see how they’d gain millions of bucks from students who’d attend without needing fin aid. The ivies give out plenty of financial aid and I’d guess the socioeconomic makeup of Duke, Georgetown, and the Ivies are all very similar (definitely skewed to the upper class).</p>

[MomofWildChild]

<p>Agree with bluedog. Basketball is too important and they couldn’t have anywhere near the same level of teams without athletic scholarships.</p>

[meangirl]

<p>

@slik nik

I would rather trust USNWR

</p>

<p>

@slik nik

As I stated many times on this board, there are many students at Rice…who were admitted to your “worshipped” Ivies, Stanford, Duke, MIT, Caltech, etc.

</p>

<p>According to USN&WR, where is Rice? And where are the “Ivies, Stanford, Duke, MIT, Caltech, etc.”?</p>

<p>Please do yourself and Rice a favor and quit posting. You’re not helping your school with your defensiveness and insecurity. Not to mention, poor logic.</p>

<p>At the end of the day, Rice’s 37% yield rate proves that there couldn’t have been too many students who chose Rice over the “Ivies, Stanford, Duke, MIT, Caltech, etc.” At least for reasons non-related to finances. For example, you yourself admit that you primarily chose Rice over Duke because of $$$.</p>

[meangirl]

<p>

@slik nik

By the way, although this study is somewhat outdated, Rice actually beats Duke in cross-admits… here’s the link: SSRN-A Revealed Preference Ranking of U.S. Colleges and Universities by Christopher Avery, Mark Glickman, Caroline Hoxby, Andrew Metrick.

</p>

<p>You clearly do not understand the logic behind the Revealed Preference study. Just because Rice ranks two places above Duke in this ranking does NOT necessarily mean that Rice beats Duke HEAD-TO-HEAD for cross-admits.</p>

<p>It’s entirely possible that Duke fares relatively poorly in the RP ranking because it shares a higher percentage of cross-admits with HYPSM (than Rice). Rice overlaps mostly with other regional southern schools such as UT-Austin, Vanderbilt and Emory. Just look at the geographical distribution of students between Duke (many Northeasterners, Midatlanticers and West Coasters) and Rice (mostly Texans).</p>

<p>Listen, I am tired of defending Duke. If you’ve read this thread, you’d see that I am not the biggest fan of the school, mostly because Duke overemphasizes sports (especially basketball) in its admissions policies, not to mention its very institutional identity. Still, by most objective measures, Duke > Rice. You have admitted as much yourself:</p>

<p>

@slik nik

Duke > Rice/Davidson> Emory=Vanderbilt

</p>

<p>Oh, by the way, Rice is NOT better than either Emory or Vanderbilt. But keep hanging onto whatever fantasy helps you sleep at night.</p>

[Cuse0507]

<p>Rice would probably wax Duke on the football field.</p>

[swish14]

<p>^^And if we had the OPs Southern Ivy League we would see this every year. There I made the thread come full circle. Lets just kill it now before the Duke haters and the Cal zealots continue this zombie-esque thread any longer.</p>

[meangirl]

<p>

@Cuse0507

Rice would probably wax Duke on the football field.

</p>

<p>Duke football (5-7 2009 record) is terrible. Rice (2-10 2009 record) football is worse.</p>

[MomofWildChild]

<p>I happen to think Rice IS stronger for undergrad academics than Emory or Vanderbilt, and I know a lot about two of the schools and pretty much about the third.</p>

<p>I like all three schools, but Rice gets the edge UNLESS you want the great SEC sports (and I, personally, would…)</p>

[slik_nik]

<p>@ meangirl: How about you do us all a favor and you stop posting on this board. Your personal attacks on this board (calling hawkette a 50 year old woman having hissy fits, calling me insecure, and verbally attacking other people as well) have not helped this conversation one bit… your conduct has been unprofessional. If verbally attacking random online strangers gives you satisfaction, then that says a lot about your personal security. I’m done with posting (this will be my last post on this thread); it is a waste of my time, and all of our time, arguing about schools that are pretty much all peer universities. You have taken most of my statements out of context, so there is no point arguing with you. </p>

<p>Yet, I still find it funny that you keep describing Rice as inferior to Duke when you yourself were saying they were both equally good schools last week. You can call my logic poor, but your claims are hypocritical themselves.</p>

[meangirl]

<p>My bad. Rice is an “elite” university because the cashier or store manager at your local Bed Bath and Beyond says so.</p>

<p>

@slik nik

Here’s an anecdote: I went to Bed Bath and Beyond in the outskirts of Cincinnati (it was in a more rural area) to order stuff for my dorm. When the cashier or store manager (not sure what position she had) asked where I was going, I said Rice and then she asked, “What are you going to such an elite university?”

</p>

[MomofWildChild]

<p>meangirl- Please check back with us after the real world chews you up and spits you out. I’m scared for you. I really am. You are too young to be so obnoxious and offensive.</p>

[meangirl]

<p>Yes, I am quite precocious.</p>

[Schmaltz]

<p>Meangirl, how do you have so much time to write so much? Aren’t you counting your money and out clubbing with the NYC elite most the time? These people are hating you almost as much as they hate me…which means you better tone it down a bit.</p>

[Cuse0507]

<p>

meangirl reminds me of interestingguy/prodigalson.</p>

<p>HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM…

</p>

<p>Interestingguy absolutely hates Duke though.</p>