<p>Like your husband, HImom, mine, who is approaching 60, was given a statin prescription by his doctor recently for no obvious reason other than studies show it may help him live longer. I told him there is no way I would take it; when my doc said last fall my cholesterol was a bit high I lost 20 lbs and that took care of it. I am wary of side effects.</p>
<p>I think “statin” is my least-favorite word in the whole English language. I was on mostly Pravastatin for 2 years, then my doctor tried a few others such as Simvastatin and something else I can’t remember the name of, until I finally told him I just couldn’t take it anymore. The muscle pain, the muscle weakness, the fatigue, it was ridiculous – and even after being switched from statins to WelChol over 6 months ago, the symptoms have not gone away. AWFUL stuff!!! :-(</p>
<p>The two videos I linked will be eye-opening. Dr. Dayspring is more of a folksy Jersey-guy presentation. Peter Attilia’s talk is a bit more Ivy-league spit and polish, but both present the latest understanding of the whole cholesterol/coronary plaque thing. </p>
<p>VLDL particles are lipoproteins that are made in the liver to carry excess fat (triglycerides) into the bloodstream. After they deliver the fat to muscles (to burn for energy) or to your flabby bits (for storage), they pick up cholesterol and, in an hour or two, become LDL particles. That’s why, if you have high triglcyerides, you probably have a large number of LDL particles. If it gets really bad, the LDL particles can even carry triglycerides instead of cholesterol. You could then have extreme risk of heart disease from a huge LDL particle count even though your LDL cholesterol is very low. Tim Russert’s LDL cholesterol was under 70 when he had a massive heart attack.</p>
<p>Here’s the kicker. The fat in the liver that causes the problem in the first place doesn’t come from eating fat or from eating eggs. It primarily comes from the liver trying to process too much sugar (or alcohol) too fast too often. Cut sugar and grains and triglycerides fall within weeks. It turns out this whole mechanism of the liver dumping excess sugar in the form of triglcyerides (fat) is probably a contributor to insulin resistance. High triglycerides and low HDL and high LDL particle counts is the classic lipid profile of insulin resistance/diabetes. Eating more grains (“healthy whole” or otherwise) to improve “heart health” is going to make the problem worse, not better.</p>
<p>HIMOM:</p>
<p>Low thyroid is known to be associated with high LDL cholesterol numbers. It’s one of the things a doc will check when first seeing elevated LDL. That’s what prompted my doc to do a thyroid test a few years years ago when he discovered that I had very low thyroid. So, your hubby probably has to test it every 6 to 12 months to makes sure his thyroid dose is sufficient.</p>
<p>That’s so interesting, interestdad. I will watch those videos. You are a great resource! </p>
<p>Heck no. I would never go on a statin because of the side effects. I would make serious changes to my diet, and we have, as we have aged. And magically, all the numbers have stayed in/come right into line as we did so. </p>
<p>Years ago, when my Mom was still alive, the doctor told her to go on a bunch of drugs. She said she would rather try losing weight first, to see if a few numbers corrected. She lost 20 pounds, and they did, and she lived for a long time after. </p>
<p>Thanks–he will call his internist about the blood test BEFORE he decides to start taking the statin prescription. There are no lipid specialists in our state, sadly. One of our hospitals trumpets itself as a cardiac center.</p>
<p>H has no weight to lose–he’s 5’ 6.5" and maybe 135-140 pounds. He could try some dietary changes and exercise. He now admits that internist has been telling him he was borderline since 2008 but the new guidelines pushed him over to the take statins category.</p>
<p>OK. Thanks for these helpful pieces of information. We know we need to ramp up our exercise and think we will start with that. So much to mull over. It’s tough because H is so used to blindly following whatever his internist (who practices with my internist) orders. </p>
<p>My dad who will be turning 90 this year has my internist and is pronounced fit as a fiddle and on NO meds at all with NO conditions. His age should put him at a high risk using that same calculator but our internist looks at our family history and his relatives who live very long lives with very little disability and has never told dad to take any meds.</p>
<p>I went to a conference where the researcher stated that normal total cholesterol should be between 110-120 based on measuring primitive tribes, Inuits and primates. Typical American cholesterol measurements are WAY off. So, if achieving this optimal total cholesterol was the goal, diet and exercise would be the best solution. Then again, excluding genetic causes, we wouldn’t have this problem if we followed a healthy diet. Our second best option is modifying HDL, LDL and total numbers through medications or just ignoring it. I wish I could tolerate the statins because I would be on one even though I don’t meet guidelines. Most of the cardiologists I work with are on statins regardless of their initial cholesterol levels. In another 10 years, we can see if the data and interventions were correct. </p>
<p>To answer the original question: I’ve been on a statin for at least 8 years (when I was diagnosed with Type ?? diabetes.) At that time, it as recommended that diabetes patients keep their LDL levels at levels so low that my endocrinologist said “it’s almost impossible to get down that low without a statin.”</p>
<p>Anyway, I’ve never had a problem with side effects and my numbers are great. My HDL is fantabulous, too, but that’s probably because I exercise daily, too…</p>
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<p>Well, that leaves me out. With HDL of 90, I would probably be dead if my total cholesterol were 110-120. LDL cholesterol in the 20 to 30 range has very very serious health implications, not the lease of which is harm to the brain and central nervous system. Just trying to drive down cholesterol numbers for the sake of cholesterol numbers is not necessarily a good idea. Curiously, in many of the big studies often cited, like the Framingham Heart Study, people with moderate cholesterol had lower all-cause mortality rates than people with very low cholesterol.</p>
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<p>It’s very tough and very frustrating. Doctors mean well, but they have been bombarded by the same often flawed information as the rest of us. It doesn’t help that statins have been the biggest selling drugs in history and that massive money has been invested in promoting “low cholesterol” as the be all and end all of health and happiness. This marketing has been directed at both consumers AND doctors. These new guildelines were supposed to be step back from chasing the cholesterol number above all else, but unfortunately, they jumped from the frying pan into the fire by defining essentially everyone above the age of 65 as being high risk and being sold a statin.</p>
<p>Many people should be taking a statin, but a lot of people are handed prescriptions when it’s probably not justified. I don’t see any way around doing the research and taking control of your own evaluations. Nothing HIMOM writes about her husband makes it sound like he’s at particularly high risk of heart disease, except that he’s in his 70s. I don’t see anything that makes him more or less “borderline” than he was last year or the year before. Until the pharma companies pushed to lower the cut-off points, 130 was the threshold for “normal” LDL cholesterol. This from the American Heart Association.</p>
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<p>So Mr. HIMOM is not overweight. Not a smoker. Has cholesterol and lipid numbers right at the national average in every category (including Triglycerides and HDL). And, he has low blood pressure. Doesn’t sound like a terribly high risk situation to me, other than the fact that we all are high risk in our 70s, 80s, 90s… Could he have a coronary tomorrow? Sure. We all could. But, you still have to weigh the particular risk versus the potential side effects of the medication. Statins don’t have major catastrophic health side effects, but they can have some pretty unpleasant quality of life side effects, especially the muscle soreness. If, for example, you have “borderline” high cholesterol and taking a statin makes your muscles ache to the point you stop exercising or going for walks, are you really ahead of the game, given how much benefit comes from exercise as we age?</p>
<p>The other issue here is how long do you have to take a statin and lower your LDL cholesterol to see a change in the risk? We are talking long term odds here, not an overnight change. Is lowering LDL cholesterol now, at age 71, going to make a darn bit of difference? Is his risk higher since he turned 71? Or, because he made it to 71, does it suggest that maybe he’s not a high risk guy? These are all part of the big picture calculations.</p>
<p>I am on statins – have dropped the dose from 80 mg to 40, but I still have a lot of muscle pain. </p>
<p>I ran the calculator using the numbers the hospital ran on me seven hours after my heart attack. Call me amused. According to the calculator, I had a 2.3% (!!!) risk of a heart attack in the next ten years – with total cholesterol of 224, HDL 42, LDL 125, VLDL 47, 5.1 ratio, triglycerides of 233. I suspect these numbers are wacky because I had been deluged with meds, surgery, etc. all night. My WBC, glucose and other tests were really out of kilter as well.</p>
<p>My onc ran numbers 10 days before my heart attack and total cholesterol was 130, HDL 33, LDL 53, 3.9, which is much more consistent with the numbers from pre-MI physicals.</p>
<p>I can’t even run the calculator with my current cholesterol – but it’s 115 total, HDL 55, LDL 47, ratio 2.1, VLDL 13, tri 66. Current 10-year risk is .9%. My total cholesterol was down to 92 at the point we dropped the dosage to 40 mg. </p>
<p>I can’t imagine that my risk is so low, even after five stents, major weight loss, exercise and better eating. </p>
<p>My brothers have high cholesterol though none of them are overweight, lead healthy lives and there is no heart trouble in the family (but then most of our late family members died young of cancer). They have lowered their numbers drastically by taking krill oil regularly. The figures were creeping upward each year for them. I think 2 out of the 3 of them were recommended to statins. </p>
<p>I’ve no medical knowledge or background about this, but just saying that the krill oil has had a dramatic effect on all three of them. Their numbers are well in normal range now. </p>
<p>I was prescribed the lowest dose of something every other day. Took it for 6 months, and my cholesterol went down. I asked if I could stop, and did. Just had my blood test an cholesterol is fine. Good news story for me. </p>
<p>I was on Lipitor for a while, but my total was never under 300. A friend of mine had a theory that, since dietary cholesterol is not the problem, I needed to tell my liver that I had sufficient cholesterol and to stop producing so much. So, I quit Lipitor and started eating a good number of eggs (yolk and all). I probably eat an average of 3 eggs per day. My totals (for the past 5 years or so) seem to be around 140-160. When I’m doing interval training, my ratio is fine; when I’m exercising but not doing intervals as often, my ratio isn’t as good (hard to tell since I don’t get tested frequently enough, but that’s my impression). </p>
<p>YMMV - but the people who trusted my results enough to try it have become converts. Counter-intuitive does not mean false. </p>
<p>My doctor was after me for a few years to take a statin. I am in good shape and cholesterol was borderline. I didn’t like the idea of starting to take a pill that I would have to keep taking forever. Doctor thought it was a good idea and taking statins had other benefits, yada yada. I finally relented and have been taking pravastatin (generic) for 7 or 8 years now. I haven’t died yet. </p>
<p>I have high bad cholesterol, and high good cholesterol…and doc put me on a statin. Couldn’t take it, so went on Wellchol. My hair started to fall out after 6 months, so discontinued. I went to a new doctor and she told me a test that could give me a risk factor. It’s called a Heart scan…looks at your coronary artery plaque buildup in you heart. It’s not covered by insurance, but only cost $50. HAd it done at the hospital, takes 5 minutes and they give you the report then. This is NOT one of those life screenings, which she said was a waste of money. I was there total of half hour. I am very low risk for heart disease according to the buildup report…even with my high bad cholesterol of 185. I read the good cholesterol is more indicative of heart disease…it carries away bad. Mine is genetic. I eat well, exercise. I think statins are over prescribed now. Check into this procedure. They put you in a machine, but your head sticks out, you don’t have to worry about claustrophobia. Then they take the images. </p>
<p>Has anyone tried red yeast rice with CoQ10 as an alternative to statins?</p>
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<p>Red yeast rice contains naturally-occurring lovastatin. So do oyster mushrooms.</p>