<p>
The OP seems open to the possibility of a divorce; these are her own words from the first post in this thread. I believe that she has the right to choose how to spend the money she earns (though I would not allocate my own money in the same way). But I am taken aback at the idea of a divorce for strictly financial reasons.</p>
<p>Yeah, I don’t think it’s so much the gist of what she was saying, which said better, probably would have brought out the most helpful financial aid experts on the board, but the saber rattling way she said it. </p>
<p>I mean, CC is not exactly the first place I would go with a temper tantrum, unless I was in the mood to get in a fight. I mean, let’s face it, if you come here looking for a fight, you’ll usually get one. ;)</p>
<p>I hope she calms down and goes back to the finaid board and asks questions and gets help there. Even if it’s a little humbling over there, there’s not much about getting college paid for the old timers do not know.</p>
<p>I think there is a huge difference between bickering over grocery costs (petty) and feeling as if you are a legal hostage to a financially feckless or ignorant spouse who is contemplating taking out huge debt for which you will be mutually responsible (not petty). It may be that the OP feels some justified resentment for being placed in this situation. It doesn’t make her the wicked witch of the west toward her stepchildren. Do we have to say yes to any harebrained financial scheme our spouses come up with in order to be deemed committed enough? I wouldn’t follow my H down the road to ruin to save my marriage. I don’t think that makes me a bad spouse.</p>
<p>After reading all posts on this thread, I am shocked harsh many of you were on the OP.</p>
<p>While the rules for FA are widely known, it does not mean they are fair. Considering that step parents have no legal rights concerning step-kids, why should they be financially responsible?</p>
<p>In addition many of you slammed OP for not treating bio and step kids the same. What about when step kids don’t treat the step parents the same they would treat their bio parents (regardless of how good (or bad) the step parent treats them). The fact of the matter is step kids are not biological kids. While in some (rare I assume) circumstance kids cultivate better relationship with the the step parents than with bio parents, in majority of cases it is simply not true. Why? It is human nature. Blood is thicker than water.</p>
<p>In any event, like judge Judy says: “I did not have fun making your children, I should not be the one responsible paying for them.” While it is nice for step parents to contribute if they can, they should not made feel guilty for insisting it is kids’ bio parents responsibility.</p>
<p>P.S. And I believe FA rules should change.</p>
<p>Lerkin, all stepparents should strive for equality in their household. It’s not only better for the stepkids, it’s also a healthier family dynamic for the biokids. The stepparent is the adult in the situation-- I am the child of divorced parents. My stepdad has shown obvious favoritism toward my half-sister, and we have close to no relationship. My stepmom, on the other hand, has shown complete equality and our relationship couldn’t be better. It does make a difference. </p>
<p>I think many people were harsh because OP made such a big deal out of the favoritism toward the biokids. I don’t necessarily think she is responsible, but I do think she said some harsh things that hit a nerve with a lot of people. I also find it immoral that she wanted to get a legal divorce, which is clearly fraud.</p>
<p>I am still heremy skin is thicker than this.</p>
<p>First, I am extremely frustrated with this situation and with my husband right nowso there was/is a lot of venting. I apologize for that.</p>
<p>Secondly, my step kids do not appreciate it when people mistake me for their mom or refer to me as their mom. They prefer the step distinction because despite that their mom is absentshe is their mom. I think a lot of it boils down to them feeling insecure in their relationship with her and by calling me mom or me referring to them as my children, that only severs their relationship with her even more.</p>
<p>Originally, DH had shared physical custody and the plan was that the kids would fill out finaid forms living with their mom. In the past year serious issues of physical and emotional abuse involving both courts and therapists have come up. The kids dont even see her and I doubt this change to the extent that they will live with her.</p>
<p>Third, I do more than run errands. I work full time. DH and I make the same salary and we split everything 50/50.</p>
<p>We keep our finances separate because that is what an attorney advised me to do before I married DHotherwise his EX could have come back and asked him for more money based on him having access to more income.</p>
<p>The primary difference is that coming into our relationship I had more money and no student loans because I managed to get a Ph.D. by working my ass off the whole timeand getting grants and fellowships. DH came into the relationship with no real savings, child support, quite a bit of credit card debt, and student loans.</p>
<p>I helped DH pay off his credit card debt and his student loans.</p>
<p>Fourth, I do a lot for my step kidsnot in a resentful way but in terms of this is what you do in any normal family. My work schedule is more flexibleI re-arrange my schedule for extracurricular etc. I help with homework, make arrangements for more specialized tutoring if needed, etc. Plus all the normal mom things of cooking, cleaning, homework, health, etc.</p>
<p>I know we need to sit down and crunch the numbersthat is my frustration. DH is reluctant to do it! I am big on planninghim, not so much. I think I finally got through to him last night. He said we can sit down and do it this weekend and talk about the whole situation. I am not happy that my investments will be counted against my step kids in financial aid determinationsI agree that it isnt fair to them. That is why I suggested to DH we look into getting a legal divorcejust on paper. I dont have a million dollars saved (I wish!). I may have just enough to pay the bill for medical schoolbut then what if DH or I lose our job? Who is paying our mortgage? What if one of us gets sick? And yes, how are we living in our retirement? This is why I dont have all of my investments in an actual retirement accountI do want it accessible in case of a real emergency. AlsoSS is only 2-years younger than SD. If we do all of this for herwhat is left for him? How is that fair to him?</p>
<p>We live a pretty frugal life. We have two cars, both paid for, one is a 1998 Civic and our newest is a 2004 Odysseyboth purchased used. Were not cruising around in new Beamers.</p>
<p>I am pretty firm in that I can definitely contribute a minimum of $5K a year to SD and then also to SSfor their undergrad. I might be able to do more, but I feel confident in the $5 per year for each of them and it is better to plan with what you knowand this is more than I contribute to our little girls. I have no idea how much DH can contribute each yearpart of the number crunching that needs to be doneand HE needs to be part of that. Ive crunched mine. </p>
<p>All of the kids are treated fairly in our home. Whatever that really means. We do our best to provide what each child needs when it is needed and to foresee those needs and plan accordinglyat least I do. We just paid $1,300 in tutors to give SD an edge in some math classes. The fair thing would be to now set aside $1,300 for each of the other three kids for some kind of educational purpose. I dont see that as realistic or feasible for us. Should we have not spent that money on SD since we didnt have another $4K to spread out among the other three kids? That doesnt really make sense either. We provide what we can to whoever needs it when it is needed.</p>
<p>I certainly understand your frustration and concern, but know that many families face huge issues and challenges paying for higher ed. As I understand it, most students take out pretty significant loans for medical school, so I wouldn’t worry too much about that. (there is a great pre-med board on this site if you want to ask questions, etc.) A huge percentage of kids change their majors anyway.</p>
<p>I am still unclear as to what grade your SD is in. If she is a junior, it is time to start testing, etc. You need to know her full package of Stats as you really plan.</p>
<p>While she (and your husband may not like it), finances may limit her choices. But they do for the vast majority of students in this country. That is also important to understand as well. Most kids go where they can afford, not necessarily where they want.</p>
<p>Do you mind sharing what your husband’s income is? I think most people are very surprised at how FAFSA works. Have you filled out a sample one? Most people are shocked with the calculation and what FAFSA says they can contribute.</p>
<p>DH and I each make approxiamtely $85K/ year before taxes.</p>
<p>SD is currently a sophmore. I want DH and I to really look at our situation so we know where we stand going into her junior year when college planning begins.</p>
<p>It seems for many merit scholarships, students need to be active with community volunteer work. I have been trying to get SD and DH to get on SD to find such an activity that she is interested in and get some of that experience-- neither of them listen.</p>
<p>not all the schools that offer merit “care” about ec’s… especially schools that have automatic merit based on stats and gpa. EC’s become increasingly important with the selective schools, or selective programs honors etc. Look at the automatic ones!</p>
<p>Don’t panic, and don’t get too far ahead of yourself. The number of kids who think they are going to go to medical school when they start college is massive, and the number who actually do is very small. Also, by that time, it’s not “up to you.”</p>
<p>So, you know you have 5,000 to contribute, and you know your StD can take out the stafford loans and now you need to figure out what her father’s contribution will be. Based on what has been said by you, I assume the biological mother is not capable of contributing to college, at all. </p>
<p>The really good news is that your daughter has an excellent GPA. I would get her signed up for the SAT and ACT as soon as possible. I think, given her hard work, and the fact that she is fortunate enough to have you in her life to make a plan, she will have a good outcome. </p>
<p>At first she might be a little annoyed that it’s not all “taken care of,” but you know? So what? At least you are there to help her make a plan and she did all the right things to make a good plan possible.</p>
<p>Good luck to you guys.</p>
<p>ETA: based on your income, you aren’t going to get need-based aid, anyway. So, you are on the right track with maximizing her opportunities for merit aid. Did she do well on the PSAT?</p>
<p>Big thing to remember…The FAFSA formula determines your Expected Family Contribution…but this is based MOSTLY on your incomes…not your assets. Yes, both spouse incomes must be listed. HOWEVER if these kids are applying to FAFSA only schools, the reality is that their full need is unlikely to be met with need based aid anyway. </p>
<p>Here are some suggestions that might help you (and actually ANY parents who are trying to get a handle on this).</p>
<ol>
<li>There are some online financial aid calculators. Run your numbers through those. See what your family contribution would be. In your case, if you really are contemplating a “paper divorce”…run the numbers both ways. If your husband’s income is not in the “low income” range…you may find that your EFC comes out to be higher than you thought anyway…and remember it will be the MINIMUM you will be expected to pay at a FAFSA only school.</li>
</ol>
<p>
</p>
<p>Just using your husband’s income…your kids will not qualify for any federally funded need based aid except a Stafford loan. The FAFSA EFC will likely be in the $25,000 range…maybe a tad less…just on his income alone. They will not qualify for any low income need based aid either. Even in California…the Cal Grant threshold is $80,000 income.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Look at your instate options. Some states have very good honors colleges AND some actually have good merit aid for high achieving students. Both of these things will be helpful.</p></li>
<li><p>Pick a school or three…and run their Net Price Calculators. These are new this year…they are not perfect…but they will give you an estimate of what your aid would be at the schools you try. Again…an estimate only. I would suggest you do a couple of instate public universities, a private university and an OOS public…just to get an idea.</p></li>
<li><p>Remember that your financial aid will be based on the tax year PRIOR to the year the kid enrolls in college. So…if the student begins college in Sept 2013, the 2012 tax year and info is what will be used to determine need based aid.</p></li>
<li><p>Read the thread that was linked upstream…the one about guaranteed merit scholarships. Also, do a search here for a thread by momfromtexas…it’s mighty old now and the scholarship in it may not apply any longer. BUT her strategy for finding full ride (or very generous) merit scholarships for her two kiddos is excellent…and may work for your family.</p></li>
<li><p>Please understand that MANY families in your situation have similar concerns about college costs…not just families with divorced/remarried parents. College is expensive…and you have four children who will want to go to college at some point. Anyone facing putting four kiddos through college would feel the same way.</p></li>
<li><p>It IS possible to do all of this. It sounds like your SD at least has great grades and the potential to garner some merit aid someplace…which will ease the burden of payment for you.</p></li>
<li><p>I know some folks would say…yes…worry worry worry…but I will say…we planned with what we KNEW would be happening…not with worrying about all the “ifs”. Life is way too short to worry constantly about getting struck by lightening.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>I would run a sample FAFSA with just your DH’s information and then both of yours. I can’t find the link, but there are some out there that give you an idea of what your EFC (estimated family contribution) will be.</p>
<p>Remember, though, that most colleges don’t meet full need and most colleges use loans to meet need at all. </p>
<p>There are some state Us that give merit based just on grades and test scores. But you are right, most schools are looking for the full package.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>This right here is your ticket to merit aid. I would take any “extra” money you may have and pour it into PSAT prep. National Merit money can be big, sometimes full rides (University of Alabama off the top of my head) and $500-$1000 spent on that prep, if it yields NM money is a wonderful return on your investment. This should be part of the conversation too. Unless this kiddo has Harvard Dreams (don’t most?) she needs to focus on State Flagships or smaller colleges that offer NM money and then do whatever she can to qualify. There is merit money all over the place, and you are in a fortunate position of having her only being in 10th grade. This would or could be a dead issue if she were a junior or a senior. She may need a reality check and daddy may not want to deliver it, but “dream” schools have to be financial dreams too…</p>
<p>Good luck to OP…I understand your position better than you know.</p>
<h1>“Secondly, my step kids do not appreciate it when people mistake me for their mom or refer to me as their mom. They prefer the “step” distinction because despite that their mom is absent—she is their mom. I think a lot of it boils down to them feeling insecure in their relationship with her and by calling me mom or me referring to them as “my” children, that only severs their relationship with her even more.”</h1>
<p>Those are “kid issues” and adults have to rise above them and still do the right thing. They now are your children…eventually they will “get” that. Deep down kids KNOW who is spending time on them. They know who really CARES about them. Their mom is a big painful spot to them. Since they are minors, I suggest that your H have them attend therapy to help them with those issues. Do this while they’re still minors.</p>
<p>“Originally, DH had shared physical custody and the plan was that the kids would fill out finaid forms living with their mom. In the past year serious issues of physical and emotional abuse involving both courts and therapists have come up. The kids don’t even see her and I doubt this change to the extent that they will live with her.”</p>
<p>Well, if your SDs end up going to the “better schools” that give great aid, GUESS WHAT!!! Those schools ALSO require non-custodial parent/spouse income info as well. So, that wouldn’t have worked. Those schools require CSS Profile and the ones that give the best aid require NCP info…and that includes you the spouse. FAFSA-only schools usually do not give great aid.</p>
<p>As for your mention about how your H came into the marriage with debt and no savings… Hello!!! And you were shocked that he didn’t have college funds for his kids??? Really??? You were shocked??? No…I don’t think you were shocked. People with large debts and no savings do not have college savings for their kids. Come on…you’re a PhD…you’re smarter than that.</p>
<p>At this point, I think you need to look over those links provided upthread about Assured Merit Scholarships. Your SD will need to apply to at least 2-3 schools that will FOR SURE give her large merit scholarships for her stats. Then she can also apply to some schools that hopefully might work out as well. But with those 2-3 financial safeties on her list, she’ll be certain to have a few affordable choices.</p>
<p>
Why does this keep getting repeated when it is the opposite of what the OP actually wrote? She was very clear that she isn’t going into debt for any of the kids.</p>
<p>I think there is nothing wrong with kids who wont call SM mom. In fact, I think the kids are correct, and for OP to make a big deal of it, she is wrong. She is the SM, she is not their mom. The fact that OP puts this as item 2 in her long list is telling.</p>
<p>OP- hugs to you. It is hard to walk into a family dynamic like the one you describe, and even harder when you’ve got a wide range of money issues complicating the already complex emotional issues.</p>
<p>I second (or third) the recommendation that you devote a couple of hours to learning how the financial aid system works. Then, you need to call a family meeting with your H and the eldest child and you lay out the numbers (without attaching a name to where the assets will come from- I don’t think your SD needs to know what comes from you, what comes from her dad)… it’s just “Our family contribution will be X dollars per year for four years. This is what our State flagship costs- we need to figure out our options for bridging that gap. This is what the local private U costs- you could live at home and take the bus- so the gap would be Y dollars. This is what a private U that has several full tuition awards for National Merit Scholars costs- these are the stats required to win one of those awards, this is what our gap would look like”.</p>
<p>Then you talk about the options. Loans in the kids name- what a 10K loan looks like after graduation, how much she needs to earn every month to make the payments, etc.
Going to a college that is further away than potentially she had planned- but one which potentially will offer her free tuition. Etc.</p>
<p>I think you are in the exact same situation as tens of thousands of other people. But in your mind, your situation is different because the kids have different mothers, and because your H didn’t plan appropriately for the future. Well guess what- even intact families have lousy financial plans, or illness which saps a college fund years before the kid goes to college, or a parent becomes disabled and the 85K per year professional job becomes a 2K per month disability payment which barely covers out of pocket medical expenses.</p>
<p>In many ways you are lucky- you are both employed, your kids (at least right now) are “college material”, and even though your H was a poor planner, you have gotten him out of the debt spiral (nothing beats a good credit score!)</p>
<p>So in my opinion- put the divorce talk aside. You have the same conversation with your SD and H that you would have with your own kids- this is what we can afford, these are your educational options, let’s figure out a plan going forward. You don’t want to spend your retirement assets on tuition- that’s your business. But you’re going to disrupt the lives of four children with a bogus divorce? Seems a bit extreme to me.</p>
<p>There are plenty of doctors who attended state schools or lived at home and commuted or did two years at Community College and then transferred, or did ROTC and got the military to pay for med school, or attended college on merit scholarship and then took out loans in their own names for med school. Seems to me you have lots of educational opportunities to explore with your step kids before you decide to bail on their dad.</p>
<p>I sympathize with OP and I understand how the big picture can get twisted or lost in a forum like this. OP seems to be the most responsible, forward-thinking adult of the three parental figures the two teenagers have.</p>
<p>Many families with four kids cannot promise $200,000 or more per kid to go where they want, under what terms they want. And many people at midlife must consider their options (including divorce) if the spouse is trying to drive the family off a cliff financially. We are at a point in this country where college costs and funding can be so difficult that disastrous financial decisions can be made with Parent Plus loans.</p>
<p>To assume that all “retirement” money is safely tucked into 401ks and IRAs is a bit of a naive overassumption. Depending on how old you are and what part of the country you live in, you had better have some assets that you are counting on for retirement, that may not be titled as IRA for 401k. FAFSA basically works on the assumption that you are willing to spend yourself down close to the poverty level. That is not necessary or advisable in many situations.</p>
<p>It is probably better if the two teens do not realize that there’s money explicitly set aside for the younger kids. (And the younger kids do not have a second mother somewhere else, who could pitch in, as the teens do, although it’s evident that the teens’ mother is not much help to them.) Minors do not need that much detailed information about their parents’ investments. It might be healthiest if it can be approached as “we are a family of four kids, everybody needs an education, we can’t just write blank checks, how do we work this out?” Need-based aid is unavailable to most families. Merit aid is a card that the kid is fortunate enough to be able to play, or not. There are some hardworking kids with learning disabilities, doing four hours of homework a night from second grade, who will never get a penny of merit aid. Life’s not fair. Starting at community college is an option if you live in a place where it’s any good. Commuting to a state university might save money. Working part-time and going to school part-time has served many people well. It’s not the College Confidential dream of moving into a dorm at a dream school, at an affordable rate, but it is reality for many. And teens who don’t face facts, get off their duffs and apply, may find themselves in a gap year, going back to their old HS to talk to the old guidance counselor about things that could have been discussed in 11th or the fall of 12th. Not the end of the world.</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Fair or unfair, if there is another person paying part of the living expenses in the house, then in theory that leaves more money available to pay for education expenses. If the bio parent wasn’t remarried and sharing household expenses with someone they would have less money available for education expenses. So while you feel you might not or should not be responsible to pay for someone elses kids to go to college, the fact that you are sharing the expenses of the person who is responsible, means that the responsible person should have more available to contribute. I think that is what “they” are thinking when they count both incomes. </p>
<p>It is frustrating any way you look at it.</p>
<p>It seems for many merit scholarships, students need to be active with community volunteer work. I have been trying to get SD and DH to get on SD to find such an activity that she is interested in and get some of that experience-- neither of them listen</p>
<p>============</p>
<p>You may be looking at private scholarships or highly competitive college scholarships if that’s what you’re seeing.</p>
<p>Some colleges give ASSURED scholarships for certain SAT/ACT and GPA scores. If you have the stats and apply on time you get the merit…no matter what your ECs are. Many state schools don’t care much about ECs…they largely admit by stats and award merit by stats. There are some exceptions, of course, but if you want merit, look for assured offers.</p>