Study: College Kids More Narcissistic

Parents Forum
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<p>I don’t remember quite so many Save the World types in the 60s and 70s. </p>

<p>marite is correct, the boomers may be the most self-obsessed generation (Is that LINT in MY navel?) but I detect (as a single data point) a measurable grandiosity to the current crop of youngsters. Those gradiose visions appear to be shared by otherwise sensible parents. Many of those lofty prescriptions will end in tears.</p>

<p>Having grown up with the legend of Bill Gates, perhaps, the student’s aspirations seem stratospheric compared to my fumblings at the same age.</p>

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<p>“I don’t remember quite so many Save the World types in the 60s and 70s.”</p>

<p>Well political activism and causes were quite numerous in the 60’s; although their numbers dropped significantly by the 70s as the baby boomers came to age. As a society back then (before the days of globalization and global warming) we were much more ignorant/unaware of the social and scientific realities of the world that needed to be “saved.”</p>

<p>The 1970’s was coined the “ME decade” by journalist Tom Wolfe to describe the then coming of age baby boomers who he saw as self- absorbed, and preoccupied with self-fulfillment, self-help, self-therapy, self-image. One historian, Christopher Lasch, wrote a social critique of that decade as well, called: The Culture of Narcissism. American Life in an Age of Diminishing Expectations (1979). In a 2005 review, Christine Rosen (a fellow at the Ethics & Public Policy Center and senior editor of the New Atlantis), revisited “The Culture of Narcissism” and, in particular, its impact on families today: </p>

<p>"It was in his examination of the transformation of the family that Lasch’s critique was most worrisome, most compelling, and, in retrospect, most apt. The family and the methods of socialization it was encouraging, in Lasch’s view, were the source of potential long-term threats to democracy. In “The Waning of Private Life,” an essay written a few years before the publication of The Culture of Narcissism, Lasch argued that in the study of the transformation of the family, “we are at the same time analyzing the weakening of the psychic basis of democracy — the self-reliant, autonomous, inner-directed individual.” Without individuals who had strong characters and an internal moral compass, Lasch feared, democracy would suffer. </p>

<p>Lasch identified two central problems with the family: the abdication of parental responsibility in the arena of moral education and discipline (and a concomitant reliance on experts to fill the void such an abdication created) and the medicalization of bad behavior in children. The first attitude “confirms, and clothes in the jargon of emotional liberation, the parent’s helplessness to instruct the child in the ways of the world or to transmit ethical precepts,” Lasch wrote in The Culture of Narcissism, and teaches children that “all feelings are legitimate.” The unintended effect of such parenting was the undermining of parents’ efforts to raise psychologically healthy children: “The parent’s failure to administer just punishment to the child undermines the child’s self-esteem rather than strengthening it,” Lasch argued." </p>

<p>Rosen goes on to discuss how changes in modern parenting (as well as several other factors) continues to contribute to the development of “narcissistic” individuals. This review (along with the article cited in berurah’s related thread), reinforce my belief that the changes in behaviors and attitudes that we are seeing with each generation are far from a “non-issue”. As I look around me today, “narcissism” seems very alive and well… </p>

<p><a href=“http://www.hoover.org/publications/policyreview/2920891.html[/url]”>http://www.hoover.org/publications/policyreview/2920891.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>[haven’t quite figured out that process of boxing in quotes yet…]</p>

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<p>“The study found that almost two-thirds of recent college students had narcissism scores that were above the average 1982 score. Thirty percent more college students showed elevated narcissism in 2006 than in 1982.”</p>

<p>It would be interesting to see the breakdown in gender among the 1982 and 2006 participants. Is it possible that this thirty percent surge in elevated
“I’m important” ness is linked to more females having options, dreams and power in our society than they did in 1982?</p>

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<p>“Many of those lofty prescriptions will end in tears.” I agree wholeheartedly. You might often hear parents telling their children “you can be anything you want to be,” and believing in the aspect of the American dream that says your kids will have a supposedly better life than you did. But the standard of living is better than what it was when sentiments like that were fostered and most people will just have to “settle” for a typical middle-class life. There really is nothing to complain about if this is where this generation ultimately ends up (or stays), but many will probably end up devastated by a typical lifestyle that will quickly grow banal if it hasn’t already.</p>

<p>Many people of this generation, and I also speak for myself, long to constantly get a pat on the head for every little thing we do. It’s pitiful and I sometimes wonder why I long for it. Everyone must be considered a “winner.” Many awards are doled out or even made up so there’s enough to go around. I think a way to reconcile this, albeit simple, is just to acknowledge that yes, everyone is different but not necessarily “better” than each other. After all, different societies value different traits in people. Who is to say that one person’s supposed talents wouldn’t be more highly regarded in one place than another? People should just live and let be instead of striving for the appreciation of others.</p>

<p>I think many of this generation not just want but expect too much out of life and the people around them. It may ultimately lead to a very bitter parenting population down the road.</p>

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<p>I think both post 22 and ASAP’s post bring up excellent points.</p>

<p>True, global awareness & practical global involvement (particulary in areas like community service) seem to be more widespread today than during my college days, & for the reasons mentioned. However, let me just say that I met a ton of students on campus who really did believe they were going to Save the World. Whether this was communal love/lifestyles, dropping out of a materialistic society, whatever: supposedly what they did in their corner of the world was going to catch on globally & reinvigorate the world. I was impatient with it not because it seemed narcissistic (maybe it was) but because I’m more of a realist than that, and they seemed just so out of touch with reality even when not smoking anything. The true idealist is better informed than that.</p>

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<p>Camelia…
IMO you are right. My kids avoided school and adults in “official” positions whenever possible. Stick with the people who love you.
Lasch sounds like he had his pulse on this whole thing early. Have to read him, if a few decades late!</p>

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<p>And some institution actually spent $$$ putting forth a study of this nature? Unbelievable… Aren’t all humans self-centered to some degree? The evidence is apparent everyday in society.</p>

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<p>^^The current finding is not that humans are self-centered. Everyone already knows that. The finding that the current college-age generation is measurably more self-centered than the college-age kids were in 1982.</p>

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<p>QNY - </p>

<p>D WAS devastated recently when I suggested that she and her peers were far more likely to lead “ordinary” middle-class lives than to attain their dreams of fame and fourtune. I considered my comment to be completely neutral . . . oh, well.</p>

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<p>I like to think of my generation (people born, say, 1981-1995; I was born in 1990), as the “Children of Narcissus.” We were ultimately the experimental results of parenting, “Me Generation” style, and we’re the first generation to be totally absorbed in “Me Generation” culture, whereas Generation X were caught along the fautline. </p>

<p>It seemed to be particularly popular in the parenting of the 1980s and 1990s to make sure that everyone was a winner and that high self-esteem was emphasized over the transmission of morality and over healthy, adult emotions being developed. We were raised to be self-centered. The emotional immaturity that campus mental authority has to deal with is made more severe by outsized expectations. At the same time as we’re living for ourselves, we’re living to please an imaginary image of ourselves that we can never live up to (hence, all the competitiveness evident on this site, College Confidential.) I’m not going to entirely blame our baby boomer parents for this…some of it has to do with most of our childhood being in the 1980s and 1990s, the days when it was touted through Donald Trump and Bill Gates how easy it was to make money.</p>

<p>I agree that this will make for some bitter and disillusioned parenting when we start having kids in a few years.</p>

<p>To PP: We will be horribly crushed when next to none of us attain our dreams of fame, fortune, and success and we end up leading normal lives. Mental health professionals, make way! Nevertheless, most of my peers seem to want to raise their kids differently than we were raised.</p>

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<p>mose–please tell us about what you’d do differently. </p>

<p>

</p>

<p>I believe this is a trait nurtured in females from primary school onwards. It has dreadful consequences in business life–so dump it if you can girls.</p>

<p>I was extremly anti-adult throughout my school years–well into university. I didn’t trust an adult as far as I could throw them. I’ve given that advice to young CC posters too. Ignore the parents! Figure it out on your own! Who cares if you get a few bumps on the head along the way? It’s more fun to discover that to be taught.</p>

<p>My boys have also been happily anti-authority–no seeking out sychophant ‘friendships’ with teachers or professors for them.</p>

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<p>Do you mean … Moi?</p>

<p>FWIW, I wonder how the current generation would fare in a comparative analysis of the narcissisism and the degree of volunteerism and community service with the prior generations.</p>

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<p>I was one of those kids brought up to believe I could “become whatever I wanted to be.” I guess because I was special. I had big dreams that I worked hard, harder than I thought possible, to make happen. They didn’t. I became ordinary instead. I was disappointed, maybe even crushed temporarily. I survived. I learned to be happy in a different way. I’ve tried to raise kids that understand that what is important is not “making their dreams come true” but being of service to other people in a way that gives them (my kids) satisfaction. It really is a lot harder though for them to consider my opinions in the American Idol age, where it seems quite possible to be plucked from obscurity and then win an Academy Award. Not a huge step from “possible” to “probable” to “inevitable” when you are an impressionable, inexperienced youth.</p>

<p>I think one of the jobs of parents today is to counter the culture’s relentless fixation with and drive towards fame and fortune by presenting a realistic perspective. When my daughter, a swimmer, said she dreamed of being in the Olympics it was cute at age 11. When she said it at 15, it was time for me to help her get realistic. Knowing your personal limitations – and where you stand against the tapestry of talent in any given area – is a healthy thing, in my mind, even if it does go against the whole American Dream scenario. Obviously, from the tears and curse words of the booted contestants – and their parents! – in the early episodes of American Idol this season, it’s clear that some families are engaging in magical thinking, to their own embarassment and detriment.</p>

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<p>

Like I said earlier in this thread, I’m part of this so-called narcissistic generation, and that is exactly how I was “raised” (in quotes because, for the most part, I still think I raised myself). I don’t think I’ve ever had an adult role model or confidante, and I would love to grow up to be ordinary if it meant I didn’t have to be as unhappy as my parents. I’ve also spent many years trying to convince myself that I’m okay–not even wonderful, just okay. In that sense, I hope I am an anomaly, but the prevalence of depression and eating disorders in teens seems to indicate that narcissism is only one side of the issue (I don’t suffer from either, but it’s difficult to find data on low self-esteem). </p>

<p>On a related note, we’re micromanaged and overindulged, but weren’t we also supposed to be the abandoned, unsupervised, raised-by-television children of horrible selfish working moms and 80-hour-workweek, usually-away-on business, can’t-be-bothered-to-care dads? Which is it, exactly?</p>

<p>Edited to add:

That’s a very good point. I’m watching the show for the first time this season, and some of the contestants are shockingly deluded. It’s almost uncomfortable to watch.</p>

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<p>To all the young posters,</p>

<p>Yes, please tell us how you plan to raise your children differently from how you were raised. My son was born in 1988, part of the generation in question, and he certainly does have his narcissistic tendencies, to be sure (and does know the story of Narcissus) did not live a coddled, over-scheduled existence as a child. I did not believe in that. I think it is interesting that both he and you, children of those years, are aware of this “we are all winners” nonsense, and indeed see it for how false it is.</p>

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<p>Well, that’s one of the things the study sought to address:</p>

<p>From the LA Times article:</p>

<p>"The researchers seek to counter theories that current college students are more civic-minded and involved in volunteer activities than their predecessors. Because many high schools require community work, increases in volunteering “may not indicate a return to civic orientation but may instead be the means toward the more self-focused goal of educational attainment,” the report says.</p>

<p>An annual survey of U.S. college freshmen by the Higher Education Research Institute at UCLA has found growing interest in public service and social responsibility, presumably in response to Hurricane Katrina and other disasters around the world. </p>

<p>But that survey also showed that current freshmen are much more interested in financial success and less in “a meaningful philosophy of life” than students were in the 1970s."</p>

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<p>

I’d actually never heard of it until I started reading CC. I guess that’s one reason I’m so surprised by it; it’s just not something I’ve ever been confronted by. (I will admit that I’m probably too quick to take offense at stereotypes about my generation, maybe because they never seem to apply to me personally.)</p>

<p>Edited to add: Except that now I’m getting paranoid about whether writing that makes me sound like a narcissist. :(</p>

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<p>Yeah I don’t ever really remember encountering the whole everyone is above average/everybody’s a winner attitude at school, but then I think that might also be because the teachers were just so thrilled that we were the students that actually understood the material and passed the classes that they didn’t feel the need to mention anything else. Although I like to think that I’m cynical enough that I would have noticed the teacher said the same thing to everyone else in the class, which meant that whatever was said was worthless. Although, I never had a teacher say anything bad about anything I did, either, until I got to college. My studio professors went into some long rant at the beginning of the year about how this is college and no one will tell you everything you do is wonderful, and they are critiquing the work, not you, so don’t take it personally, etc. I guess something must be going on if they feel it’s necessary to do that.</p>

<p>My parents did the “you can be whatever you want to be” crap when I was little and I was always tempted to tell them that I wanted to be an alien invader, or something else obviously impossible, because I knew that wasn’t true. I guess I just sort of believe that it was your parents’ job to tell you those kinds of things because they have to say something and “you’re so smart!” is a lot better than “well, you’re kind of average, maybe a little bit below”. I have a friend who, apparently, believed it when her parents told her she could be anything…and she’s decided she wants to be an actress, live in a city with no major film studios to speak of, and buy a house at the age of 22 off her earnings from a part-time job. I know that her mother has actually confessed to mine that she knows these things her daughter wants to do are impossible, but she doesn’t have the heart to tell her. I tried to tell her, but she would not be convinced. Tells me I’m too cynical. Had another friend who had similarly ridiculous expectations of her future life, who also thinks I am too cynical. Go figure.</p>

<p>Although I dunno about this not trusting adults business. I’ve always found the adults more interesting (especially when my other options are all narcissists ;))…that’s why I lurk in the parent forums. =X</p>

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<p>My dad used to tell me I could be anything–then one day he insisted my younger, pot-addled brother be the designated driver. In the end, I learned that my dad is a terrible sexist.</p>

<p>Besides my dad feeding me the load of bull, many other adults in my childhood bet against me–and not a few others had a go at trying to block any ascent–including parents, professors, bosses, clients, friends, colleagues–a few examples from every lot. I’ve got some great stories.</p>

<p>Cam, I am sorry to hear that your parents are unhappy. Bummer. I’m not happy 24/7 (no one is) but I’ve had a great life–travelled and lived all over the globe, married a wonderful human being, managed to start and run my own architecture firm, still breaking ceilings in that profession, raised two <em>knock wood</em> healthy, smart, nice boys who seem to be finding exciting paths in their lives.</p>

<p>I’m not Bill Gates and I never aspired to those heights. First, that level of fame would suffocate me. I couldn’t do it. EVen minor fame makes me nauseous. Literally. My nightmare is having strangers stop me in the grocery to talk about some newspaper article or radio interview.</p>

<p><em>realizes these statements will classify cheers as No 2 Narcissist, behind mini</em></p>

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<p>Maybe this goes off the main topic but if you’ve ever read Jean Twenge’s book Generation Me, you’ll laugh. Lets just say I’m not a fan of Professor Twenge.</p>