<p>No. I just don’t want to accept your PA scores. ;)</p>
<p>Here’s what the USNews guy says about PA:
I basically agree with that. “Reputation” matters. Reputation (on an institutional scale) usually has a basis in reality, although it may be based on past glories, or tarnished by past deficiencies, and thus may not be entirely “accurate” – but it’s still “valid.” And I don’t see any evidence that the peer assessment of the various universities ranked by USNews is not a reasonably accurate assessment of their reputations. UVa does have a higher reputational profile than Wake Forest. Fair? I dunno. But UVa’s higher PA is, in my opinion, a reasonable approximation of the difference in reputation between the two schools.</p>
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<p>I apologize if that is your impression of my posts (and I don’t think I have ever posted same), bcos I have always thought that your attempt is to show that other colleges are great, as well. I just think that the logic in your posts gets lost. For example: </p>
<p>Post #68 was clear: it is either “institutional reputation”… “OR”… great “classroom experience”. By your own words (in quotes), your are implying that a college cannnot and does not have both. Was that your intent?</p>
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<p>I want to accept PA scores for … what … they … are. I want to accept US News rankings for what … they … are. US News does not say that its rankings are the be-all and end-all of college quality. On the contrary, they make it very clear that they do not believe this. </p>
<p>Once again, the US News rankings are simply a rank ordering based on a particular methodology that yields a particular result. Agree with the methodology, or parts of the methodology, and find the rankings useful. Disagree with the methodology and don’t find the rankings useful. Agree that the PA, for what … it … is, is useful, or don’t It’s your choice.</p>
<p>The PA is about reputation, and it’s a consensus. That’s all it is, that’s all it’s ever going to be. Do I find Hawkette’s own PA better than a consensus of those of us who work and make our livings in higher ed? No. Perhaps others will. That’s up to them.</p>
<p>bluebayou,
I don’t see it (institutional reputation/classroom excellence) as either/or as I believe that an institution can have both. This was demonstrated in the 1996 USNWR surveys of PA in one survey and great classroom teaching in another. In those surveys, there was substantial overlap (16 colleges). But nine of the traditional PA favorites failed to make the Top 25 for classroom teaching. For an aspiring college student, that distinction probably has some value. </p>
<p>Colleges that are ranked in Top 25 for having BOTH strong reputation and classroom teaching excellence</p>
<p>Harvard
Yale
Princeton
Stanford
Caltech
Duke
U Chicago
Dartmouth
Wash U
Northwestern
Brown
Rice
Vanderbilt
U Virginia
U North Carolina
Tufts</p>
<p>Colleges that were favored for classroom teaching excellence but did not have a strong reputation among academics
W&M
Miami U (OH)
Notre Dame
Emory
UC Santa Cruz
Boston College
Wake Forest
BYU
Georgetown</p>
<p>Colleges that were favored by the academics but did not have a strong reputation for classroom teaching excellence</p>
<p>U Michigan
J Hopkins
U Penn
Cornell
UC Berkeley
Carnegie Mellon
Columbia
UCLA
MIT</p>
<p>Ideally, I believe that subjective rankings, such as PA or classroom teaching, have no place in college rankings and should be presented separately.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2007/11/01/BA5AT40CC.DTL&type=printable[/url]”>http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2007/11/01/BA5AT40CC.DTL&type=printable</a></p>
<p>another example of an excellent teacher/prof at at research Uni, even if it is a class of 750 kids.</p>