Misconception #188: “Extracurriculars and other non-academic factors are extremely important at many colleges.” (Mainly only at the very few super-selective ones where most applicants’ academic indicators are close to the maximum possible and thus not very distinguishable from each other – most selective colleges look at academic indicators as the most important factors.)
^ sorry, I was getting the CC mentality of thinking HYPSM are the only colleges that exist, lol.
Folks that have never attended an elite college telling others how overrated elite colleges are.
You may be interested in [this Malcolm Gladwell piece](Getting In | The New Yorker)–interestingly, it suggests that athletes are very safe bets for top schools:
Aha! 180: that Gadwell, Hernandez, the Duke studies, some books on Amazon, etc, reveal the real and honest truth.
- My kids attended Big State and have good jobs, so spending more than what Big State costs is a waste of money.
- If your kids wants to go to medical school it's wise to send them to the cheapest out of pocket undergrad. Save money and no competition!
@marvin100 Locally I’ve noticed the athletes headed to elite colleges are connected rich kids. Is the girls cross country team at an Ivy League college really full of the best athletes or is it just a place to put donors’ kids and eke out larger annual gifts (plus full pay tuition)?
With a few exceptions, Ivy League sports teams are very, very good (NCAA Div. I, after all), so it’s extremely unlikely they’re trying to stash unathletic development admits on the cross-country team, @stressedmum1 .
One must attend an elite university to get into a good med school or law school because any other school would leave one woefully unprepared .
I didn’t say unathletic. I know some on rosters that were not very impressive athletes in prep school yet they’re on Ivy League and elite LAS rosters.
Only people that attend selective schools have high enough stats to make them competitive for such schools .
188 all athletes are stupid and wouldn't have gotten into an Ivy without a ball or a stick.
189 all athletes are on 100% scholarship (oh how I wish this were true!)
@lookingforward To participate in the ones that HYPSM cares about, that’s often the case, or at least being rich makes it significantly easier.
@marvin100 I think Malcolm is wrong about many things, but I could see that being true. I guess I think it shouldn’t be a primary admissions factor, but just another extracurricular.
Okay, well, nobody here can respond to questions about individuals you happen to know. That said, lots of teams in all kinds of colleges have low-level members who aren’t really qualified to compete. This isn’t exclusive to the Ivies by any means and it’s vanishingly unlikely to have helped those students gain admission.
@RMIBstudent --well, you and I agree about Gladwell 
That said, you should read the article. It gives a different–and useful–understanding of Ivy admission standards and aims. The “luxury brand” analogy at the end is particularly apt, imo.
“To participate in the ones that HYPSM cares about, that’s often the case, or at least being rich makes it significantly easier.”
Not so. Fallacy.
@marvin100 will do.
@lookingforward Can you give me some examples?
I kind of racked my brain to come up with the expensive ECs you may think are what the TT’s “care about” over some honest, focused effort, responsibilities, impact.
I have long thought that assuming rich kids have an advantage (and even some mighty posters say that) is based on an assumption/stereotype that poorer kids just can’t find the time or don’t have the support and that all good ECs are, of course, expensive. Not.
You think an expensive trip to “practice language skills” or hold the orphan babies, between tourist activities, is more important to H+ than rolling up your sleeves in your own community? Do you know what the tippy tops really look for?
@lookingforward Helping out your community is actually a lot easier when, well, you have more resources. Sure, you can do community service and probably accomplish some impressive things, but they’d have to be really impressive to put you through HYPSM.
I know some people whose applications were boosted substantially by winning national debate titles. How many poor schools have competitive debate teams? Granted, in this case I think that’s a legitimate extracurricular, but there’s still a disparity in access to them.
Its not about the external resources, but the internal. You don’t know the boost came from a title. And winning awards, national over state, eg, is a hierarchical mindset. But we’re off track.