<p>True. So does “Oliver” with Nancy singing about how ‘he needs me’ just before Bill kills her.</p>
<p>All stories that were written in a different time. Should we ignore history and what was accepted in previous generations? I don’t think so. The arts should challenge and these shows and their stories do just that, they provoke thought, just as they should. As someone said earlier in the thread, there are equally objectionable issues that exist today that eventually, I hope anyway, will have people shaking their heads and being horrified in the future.</p>
<p>Yes, drama requires conflict and great dramatic characters must have flaws. They can’t always do the right thing. Tony kills Maria’s brother in “West Side Story”. Tevya refuses to speak to the youngest daughter again when she marries a Russian. Norma kills Joe in “Sunset Boulevard”. </p>
<p>As with any musical/play/novel–consider its context. Recognize that ideas have changed in the last 60 years since the musical was written, AND 150 years since the setting of the story. (IMO, this double context is what makes some old musicals even more interesting. Btw–does anyone remember the mini-spoof of The King and I in the more recent (about 2004?) musical The Drowsy Chaperone?–“Message from a Nightingale.” (Easy to be offended if you take these things seriously and don’t recognize that this is actually making fun of another musical. In this case it is a Chinese Emperor and and American woman instead of the Siamese King and Brit.) Part of the scene/lyrics:
THE EMPEROR
You no bow? Emperor and American rady no see eye to eye</p>
<p>AMERICAN LADY
But Emperor, sometimes a different outlook can
change your point of view.</p>
<p>THE EMPEROR
Whaaaa?</p>
<p>AMERICAN LADY
Precisely.
(singing. . .)
What is it about the Asians
That fascinates Caucasians
What is it about the Asians
That’s so nice
Is it the won-tons? The egg rolls? The rice?
Perhaps it’s Buddha or Confucius
and their excellent advice</p>
<p>THE EMPEROR
What is it about Caucasians
That mystifies we Asians?
What is it about Caucasians that’s so odd?
They call a pretty rady a broad
They have hair upon their chest
And they only have one god?
Impossible, etc.</p>
<p>Are there other musicals that you all find offensive in some way? I doubt that feminists are fans of Seven Brides for Seven Brothers and Carousel. Oliver and Oklahoma have some uncomfortable scenes, themes. But I can still enjoy these shows. (Actually, I don’t care for Carousel, which R&H said was their personal favorite, and was voted “Best Musical of the 20th Century.” It’s probably my least favorite.)</p>
<p>I completely agree with TatinG at 10:56. And to call Showboat racist? Just boggles my mind. It was the very opposite! And West Side Story?!? </p>
<p>Both of those shows are about the evils of racism, amongst other things.</p>
<p>BTW, those who are interested in Showboat ought to listen to the fabulous recording that is the subject of this excellent article:</p>
<p><a href=“'Show Boat' Makes New Waves - The New York Times”>'Show Boat' Makes New Waves - The New York Times;
<p>An example of a musical written in another time that has parts which can look embarrassingly racist when viewed through modern eyes is Disney’s “Song of the South” (1946). For that reason it has never been released in its entirety on home video.</p>
<p>They don’t play Dumbo much anymore, either. . .</p>
<p>I never said West Side Story was racist. I said it had a plot that dealt with controversial issues. </p>
<p>The first play my D was in was The King and I. I have wonderful memories of that production. Many plays are products and/or commentaries on the times - they need to be considered in the context of the times. I imagine The King and I has stood the test of time mostly for its music. Just a guess.</p>
<p>Sorry, thumper1, I misunderstood.</p>
<p>I love all these shows, and each one has some serious songs. I have always felt that the dark themes in Oklahoma, carousel, Miss Saigon,Le Mez, Porgy and Bess, WSS, South Pacific, Briggadoon, made them classics. I was never a star, but a dancer in the chorus. Should I be ashamed to say I was made up to look Asian to dance in the Nutcracker? Dancing in the city ballet, or HS productions, or college, were highlights. The shows that were all fluff never seemed to make it big. </p>
<p>When my D was 11 or 12, we rented Carousel to watch at home. I was familiar with some of the music from the show, but not the plot. I was horrified at the “acceptance” of domestic violence, so much so that I turned to my daughter in the middle of the movie and said, “It is NEVER okay for someone to hit you.” Loved the music (and the ballet dancing sailors) but not the message.</p>
<p>A few years ago, my D was cast in a regional theatre concert production of Showboat. It was her first paying gig, about the same as your son, but was an hour’s drive from here with daily rehearsals for three weeks. Needless to say, her expenses far outweighed her paycheck!</p>