In his Goodreads interview, Dominic Smith says one of his favorite books is Waterland by Graham Swift. That novel is really, really high on my list of most-admired books. I read it back in the 80s. I really should read it again to see if I like it as much the second time around.
Maybe this is a silly question, but who do you think did worse things to the other, Marty or Ellie? Was it worse to forge someone’s painting, essentially participating in a major art heist, or to sleep with someone under false pretenses? In the context of the book, Marty’s actions seemed worse, but now with some distance, the forgery seems worse. Does it matter in making the moral judgment that Ellie’s actions were a crime, but Marty’s actions weren’t? I wish this were fresher in my mind, but it seems that the book was trying to draw some equivalencies between the acts, because the fact that each wronged the other leads us to let each of them off the hook in a way.
Was anyone rooting for them to get together for real in the 1950’s/ 1960’s time frame? They had so much chemistry and I could see his marriage ending, and not feeling too bad about it.
What about the almost-affair with the secretary? What did folks think about that?
What Marty did felt worse to me. The part where he was “courting” Ellie was written from Ellie’s point of view. Though the author made you feel (at that point in the story) that Marty was probably falling in love with her, you were also led to feel that he violated her by sleeping with her in such a cold manner and then vanishing.
I had already forgotten about the secretary.
Finally getting a chance to join the discussion … I enjoyed the book a lot. Has anyone read “The Art Forger” by B.A. Shapiro? Fictionalized version of the heist at the Isabella Stewart Gardner Museum in Boston, involving a woman who forges a painting. Quite a few similarities, as you can imagine.
Several posts have mentioned there were anachronisms in the sections of the book set in the 50s. I noticed this, too and found it a little annoying. At times it seemed as if everything (in the 50s) was happening in the present day. And even the sections set in the 1600s – at one point early in the book, Sara goes to a lecture by herself at night. Really?
Another thing that jumped out at me was when Ellie discovered who Jake really was, by calling the phone number on a tag sewn into the neck of his sweater. As it turns out, area codes came into use in 1947 (not sure if this was nationwide), but why on earth would Marty have a name tag with his phone number sewn into his clothes? Seemed like a silly way for her to find out the truth.
Re: the photo of the painting showing the unmade bed – seeing the bed bothered Ellie, so she cut it off the photo. Why was that slice of the photo still in her apartment when Marty came up for a cup of tea (or whatever)? How long had it been sitting there? IMO there were a number of instances where the author didn’t really know how to move the storyline forward, causing these “odd” moments.
@caraid ahhhhh the clue may have been planted, and I missed it. The “unmade” bed, so the caterers / or the Beats unlikely, surely the bed would have been made, so that leaves Rachel, or the Maid ?
@Mary13 I, also, thought Rachel’s character was dropped very quickly, in an odd way.
Regarding Smith’s writing style, I’m in the camp with those who liked it very much. Small details conveyed so much- “unmade bed” lol, "Ellie’s “granny” underwear left hanging in the bathroom, the scents of the chemicals, ugh, Marty’s driving gloves, all the descriptions of the paintings.
But, a couple scenes will remain vivid in my mind. The bed and breakfast sex scene, skillfully crafted so we know Ellie was inexperienced but receptive, and Marty was conflicted, but still manipulative.
I had to read that scene a couple times, because I thought Ellie may have dreamt that it occurred. Smith mentions her skirt feeling course against her legs, and this confused me.
I thought Smith skillfully presented a pivotal scene. ( for the record, I thought Marty was such a Cad, and not completely convinced of his “love” even with those bloody heels)
I posted before reading @nottelling
Does it matter in making the moral judgment that Ellie’s actions were a crime, but Marty’s actions weren’t? I wish this were fresher in my mind, but it seems that the book was trying to draw some equivalencies between the acts, because the fact that each wronged the other leads us to let each of them off the hook in a way.
Excellent.
They were both morally delinquent,parallel story lines, in contrast with Sara who was a loving, kind, and resilient woman, who transcended her times.
I think Marty’s actions were worse. What Ellie stole from Marty was only a material possession, but he took part of her very essence. That said, I did not find it difficult to forgive him – and neither did Ellie, really, when they finally confronted each other 40 years later. Normally, I am extremely intolerant of unfaithful men, so props to Dominic Smith for being able to write this man sympathetically, despite his caddish behavior.
This detail is one that made sense to me. Ellie was borderline obsessed with the strip of the photo that she cut off:
Combine that fascination with the fact that Ellie is rather sloppy, and yeah…I can see the strip of photo remaining untouched on her desk.
@CBBBlinker: I read The Art Forger and liked it - and, yes, notable similarities - mainly the young girl getting swept into something and then losing control over it (if I remember correctly.)
Actually what this makes me want to do is binge-watch White Collar and I - plus youngest daughter - never missed an episode while it was on. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gIFySyLynAk
@SouthJerseyChessMom, I remember the passage you are referring to (after the seduction). I read it as Ellie feeling the need to return to normalcy – It’s not spelled out, but I think she dresses after seeing her outfit on the chair, and putting her own clothes back on brings her back to being her “real” self instead of the woman she was with Marty:
@ignatius, I never heard of White Collar – looks like fun!
I thought Marty’s deception to Ellie was much worse than her forgery. His actions were planned and totally manipulative. Ellie didn’t plan hers. It was presented to her. She obviously could have chosen not to do it, but it wasn’t evil. Marty’s deception was evil.
@Mary13 - how can you never have seen White Collar? I highly highly recommend you get to it. Fun describes it well. http://www.nytimes.com/2009/10/23/arts/television/23white.html?_r=0
@caraid and @notelling-
Found this interview with Smith, he intended to connect Sara and Ellie in ways I may have missed because I was too consumed with judging Ellie as an “art forger”/ bad person, but here he discuses this in terms of feminism.
Q: They’re both up against the patriarchy. You might also say that had it not been for sexism, Ellie would never have been in the position of forging Sara’s painting.
A: That’s a great perspective, because both women are hemmed in by the patriarchy, and it drives them to new levels of inventiveness — not always in good ways, in the case of Ellie. But there’s definitely a sense of being thwarted and unrecognized. That idea of recognition and authenticity is something that runs through the whole book. …
…
And then we pivot to the third storyline, that **of Ellie Shipley. What she sees in this painting is the sheer virtuosity of the painter’s skill. There’s something in it that defies what she expects to find in a painting by a woman from this time period. And in it, she sees a kind of inspiration for her own career. **To me, what was really grounding in this novel was the idea of the landscape at the center, with these three different storylines orbiting around it.
I just finished. What a satisfying reading experience! The author had such skill in manipulating the three time periods. that the transitions felt natural. Usually I end up strongly favoring one story line in books divided the way this one was, but here I looked forward to each individual plot line.
I thought that Rachel was responsible for the heist. Good catch on the rumpled bed!
The violation of Ellie by Marty was the more harmful act by far, in my opinion. Ellie forged a piece of art, but she didn’t set out to do personal damage in the way Marty did by delivering the forgery to her apartment before the weekend away, wooing Ellie, and finally ditching her at the inn. Ugh! The author was certainly skillful to convincingly bring back the aged repentant Marty.
I read the article in the link provided by SJCM and noted this:
But “At the Edge of a Wood” isn’t the last painting of Sara de Vos. She paints her self-portrait with the mini-portrait of Tomas on the easel in the background. I like that her last painting is not one of sorrow but rather of moving on with her life (at least, so it seems to me). As someone already noted, Sara’s self-portrait bears a marked resemblance to that of Judith Leyster in dress and in action. Sara paints Tomas on horseback at her window rather than Leyster’s musician.
And speaking of provenance, here’s the provenance on Leyster’s Self-Portrait - a good example since her work had to be “rediscovered” as hers: http://www.nga.gov/content/ngaweb/Collection/art-object-page.37003.html?opensection=provenance#provenance
Oh, but that last painting made me so sad! Sara is moving on with her life…to the next one. My interpretation was that she is dying and knows it. “She knows this will be the last thing she ever paints” (p. 285). She grieves to be leaving Tomas: “She wants to remember him looking back at her in the twilight.” The afterlife is the “something momentous” that she has dressed herself for.
Yes but Sara seems at a better place than after her daughter’s death. She can grieve leaving Tomas which means she opened herself to loving him. Painting comforts her as does her life with Tomas. I don’t think she had that for a long time after her daughter’s death. Her self-portrait makes me less sad than it does you, I guess. It shows her pride (clothing/profession) in who she is - an acceptance, if you will - and the love between her and Tomas. I’m going with glass half-full here.
I think the book couldn’t be contemporary at the end because the 1950s section had to be set before lead tin yellow became widely known. There’s a line that she wouldn’t have made that mistake if she’d done the forgery a few years later.
I like the idea of Rachel being in on the theft. I too wondered when the photos would have been taken.
It’s late, but I know there were a couple of time that word use was really strange.
I also saw in the Chicago Trib interview that he talks about writing in the present tense. Something I hadn’t noticed thankfully or it might have bothered me.
More than a couple. 
Another shout out for White Collar. We don’t watch a lot of TV, but we did watch that one. Such fun, though it probably went on at least one season too long.
I felt the last painting of Sarah (the self portrait) was uplifting even though she was dying. I was glad she did one last painting after so many years of not painting at all.
I don’t think Rachel’s responsible for the heist. Even if she hates “At the Edge of the Wood” what does she gain by replacing it with a fake? It’s not like the picture isn’t still hanging above the bed. My mother would have called that “cutting off your nose to spite your face” and she would have been right. Plus I never sensed any - something - that would make Rachel take a painting of import and value and send it on shady path. So veering from you guys and calling it the caterers - perhaps having run of the house to set up from early a.m. onward. Quick pictures one year and replacement the next while Marty and Rachel are on the patio with guests. In and out with no one the wiser - maybe not even all the caterers.