The Plague of ‘Early Decision’

Parents Forum
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Our experience was very much like @hiislandmom’s in that our D was accepted ED to a LAC whose NPC was one of the most generous we had ever seen. She was so glad to be done before finals of her senior year. Yes, there were other schools that she really, really liked, but at some point kids have to make a decision and she was ready to do so in November.

The kids we felt the worst for weren’t the ED kids. They were the SCEA kids who were deferred or denied. Our state schools don’t notify until Spring (and frankly UMichigan is no longer a safety for these kids), and they weren’t allowed to apply to the many great private schools that offered EA. So while most kids we knew had some kind of acceptance in the fall, these kids had nothing and had to wait until March or April to get that first acceptance. Some took it in stride, but it was very, very difficult for most of the ones we knew.

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@jonri, I think your comment about the impact of parental lobbying is very astute.

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I dunno- I find it hard to muster sympathy for the “game theory crowd” and how they end up getting the short end of the stick via ED.

I think if a kid is ambivalent about an early option- the parents should shut up and let the cards get played. The college’s are pretty transparent that ED is a great option for a kid who has locked in one and only school as the clear favorite. The fact that a particular family can turn it into the Cuban Missile Crisis (Jonri, I’m not making fun of you- I know families like yours and the machinations over this- especially with a kid who is not in love with ye olde alma mater can be very complex) doesn’t change the basic calculus- ED should be used by kids who either don’t need aid, or have run the NPC’s at a school which meets full need and is satisfied that they can afford the likely financial package, WHEN that school is the clear first choice.

I think families who are trying to game a complicated set of outcomes (in the case above- so the kid would rather die than go to Lehigh if he/she gets into neither Princeton nor Penn? Jeez…) by allowing themselves to get backed into a corner (OK, Penn ED. I’ll go if you make me) really need to get a grip.

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@jonri Thanks. I thought that was what you meant but wasn’t sure. My D just got in to Duke ED as a legacy. Had the stats to take a shot at Stanford or Yale but decided to play it safe for exactly the reasons you described. A first world problem. No complaints based on the outcome, but the “what ifs” may linger.

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The problem with the “can’t decide” scenario is that they, well, can’t decide. ED isn’t about parlaying your chances, going off some wierd and undependable stats about enhancing them. It’s for kids who have decided. And have been smart sbout costs, NPCs, etc.

That’s where “unwise” comes in. It puts the burden on the kid. “Unfair” implies it’s the college’s fault Jr wants to game it.

This whole admissions thing is already approached in a half baked way, by too many.

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ED is coercive. Mildly coercive, but still coercive. It is kind of a sleazy thing for institutions of higher learning to do.

HYPS, Duke, Penn etc. could all go non-binding EA. The kids that REALLY want Duke would still select Duke at the end of the day assuming they get in. So there’s really no need for Duke truncate the evaluation and selection process. Unless Duke is afraid that some of the kids it coerces into being 100% Duke might actually wind up somewhere else if Duke didn’t demand that the kids limit their search/selection process. If Duke is sooo great, why are you afraid to let kids consider Vandy or Northwestern or Penn?

The only downside to Duke of doing this (assuming its peer schools did the same) is that it could no longer boast of its glittering 10% acceptance rate and would have to instead live with a pedestrian 20-25% instead. The upside is that its class would be full of kids who truly chose Duke, rather than kids that got gamed into making Duke their top choice in exchange for the bribe offered by the admissions office.

But no one has ever died over ED…

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You ever buy non-refundable tickets to get preferential pricing? If you aren’t sure of your availability, is that the seller’s fault?

Sure, it’s college and you may need the right discounts. But it should be the same thought process. If you can commit, if the right aid comes through, fine. If you need some reality check, don’t apply ED. Not rocket science.

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@northwesty HYPS are not binding EA. You do not have to matriculate at any of those 4 if you are accepted early.

Duke and Penn are ED, which is binding.

I think I see the point you are trying to make, but your comment about HYPS is incorrect.

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@lookingforward - I’m not sure I follow that.

If a college charged a $10,000 fee for an extra special “priority” reading of your application, would it be “unwise” for kids that didn’t take advantage of that?

Even if you forget the financial aspect, and “unfair vs unwise” - ED is clearly benefiting kids that have decided on their top choice early. Which unfortunately puts pressure on other kids to try to decide early. And pressuring kids to make a decision before they’re ready isn’t good for the kid or the school.

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The “pressure” is in the heads of people who are statistically challenged and who look at the raw numbers of how many kids get accepted ED and assume that if their kid doesn’t apply early, kid doesn’t have a %^&* chance of getting admitted.

Most of the time, the kid has virtually no chance anyway. Applying early doesn’t change that calculus. The plain vanilla kid from Great Neck or Atherton with two professional parents, good grades, high scores, and nothing much of interest besides that has the same odds in early vs. regular (i.e. pretty terrible at the single digit admission colleges absent a hook.)

Pushing the kid to commit early- reluctantly- doesn’t change those odds even when wishful thinking and selective interpretation of the numbers might suggest otherwise.

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@blossom

I wasn’t talking about my family.

In fact, our case was a bit different and it happened a long time ago when rules were different. My alma mater offered early action. It was my kid’s third choice. My kid had a dream school and really, really wanted to go there. No other college was close. Dream school was ED.I did not hesitate to allow my kid to ED to dream school, which ranks higher than my alma mater. At the time dream school was a “high reach” and my alma mater would have been a reach.

Other people, including an EC mentor who was one of the savviest people about college admission I know, told my kid to go early to my alma mater. He predicted that my kid would get into my alma mater early. Since it wasn’t binding, kid could still apply RD to dream school which he thought was highly unlikely admit in any event. He thought that if my kid didn’t apply early to my alma mater, kid might not get in. Second choice school is more selective than ED school or my alma mater. There was a sharp drop off in interest between these 3 schools and any others.

About 2 or 3 weeks before the EA deadline I got a call from an alumni relations rep from my alma mater who was then the "go to " person for alumni admissions questions. My kid had not yet applied to my alma mater, but in conversations I had told him stats, ECs ,etc. He told me he thought my kid would have an “excellent” shot ED but was “iffy” RD. I lied through my teeth and said my kid was just too busy to apply early anywhere and needed more time to get apps done.(This was a LONG time ago, and fewer kids applied early.) I was NOT about to tell him kid applied early somewhere else.

Kid got the thick envelope in December. So it ended happily. However, if it hadn’t, I would NOT have been the one telling my kid “I told you so.” I love my alma mater, but knew full well ED school would be a better fit for my kid.

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Hard to have much sympathy for @jonri 's example. Penn’s website clearly states that ED should only be chosen if Penn is one’s “top choice.” Poor child has to attend one of the finest universities in the world!

and @notveryzen 's example:

is equally puzzling to me…what kid in their right mind would assume a Harvard acceptance and be miserable at the prospect of filling out low-reach, target and safety apps and waiting until April with all the rest of their classmates?

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@pickpocket My post clearly says that I don’t expect a lot of sympathy from other parents. However, if you know kids in this situation, I think it’s easier to understand.

As for situation #2, LOTS of kids do this. No matter how much a 16-18 year old kid can recite all the facts and knows that the chance of getting into H is small, almost invariably there’s this tiny voice deep inside him that makes him think he’s going to be one of the lucky ones. And when a kid is devastated by an early rejection or especially a deferral to any college, it is really hard to sit down and write an essay saying whey he wants to go to a different college.

Many of the kids applying to schools like H are superstars in their community. Despite the fact that we all know it’s just not true they see college admissions as a reward for their hard work. If they don’t get in, they often think “I must have done something wrong” or “a teacher or GC MUST have written something bad about me.”

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This is really all a load of what you find in fields that have bulls in them. The kids I know who “settled” on an ED college and were admitted, vs. applying to Harvard or Stanford, tend to be pretty happy with the college they went to. The kids I know who applied SCEA to one of the SCEA colleges and weren’t admitted, but were strong enough maybe to have been admitted ED at one of the slightly less hyperselective ED colleges, mostly got admitted to great colleges RD, and were happy where they went to college. There are always a few students who completely misjudge how attractive they are as applicants and wind up disappointed with the colleges that accept them . . . in April. By the next year, they are usually pretty happy. And those students would almost certainly not have been accepted ED at a “better” school had they applied.

Only a tiny, tiny fraction of kids is affected by this pseudo-problem beyond spring of their senior year in high school. Plus maybe a somewhat larger fraction of would-be tiger parents and those who have trouble landing their helicopters. Those people, kids and parents, are not an attractive lot.

Perhaps a larger number of kids (and their parents) think they are affected by it, but aren’t. The number of kids who could certainly have gotten into HYPS had they only applied (according to themselves,their families, and their friends), but who went to [public flagship, less selective college] instead, is probably about the same size as the number of kids who actually applied to HYPS and were rejected. Many people fail to appreciate just how strong the applicants HYPS rejects are. If everyone who should have gotten in applied, their admission rates would be around 1-2%.

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@thshadow

Indeed you are correct: 6-7 month delay for making the school choice. I still stand by the rest of my criticisms of his logic for which the application due dates are only 2-3 months later…

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Do kids change their preferences between November and April of the senior years? Yes of course - but they also, then change their preferences before they start college and again before their sophomore years. Preferences are fluid. Wise advice is to encourage kids to pursue schools that offer academic flexibility. My kid has been thinking engineering for a long time but in the past 4-6 months, has broadened her interests. So she was encouraged to seek a school that would be a good fit for her with engineering but also a good fit for her if she drops engineering (as a very high percentage will do).

It is NOT the case that ED is universally a bad idea for families dependent on the financial aid package, at least not for need-based aid because those calculations can be made up front. YES, ED means you can’t use one aid package to leverage another but with Ivy league schools, they typically only will try to match an aid package from a “like” school and not very many applicants will be accepted to more than one Ivy school. The main financial aid concern with ED is for kids who will rely on merit aid at non-Ivy schools. THOSE awards are much more flexible, so having multiple offers helps. My first child was in that category and he applied RD.

My youngest DID apply ED just this year. The choice was tough - she went with her heart, took a risk to pick the school she really does love the most, while knowing full well that she had other quality options - where we worked hard to develop those other options.

I have enjoyed the couple of references to “game theory” in these posts. Sometimes the reference is negative. But really, isn’t all of life about making complex choices, collecting actual facts (!), thinking about pros and cons, imagining next best alternatives? Why would college apps be any different?

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The post is about two separate issues: Finances and the stress/machinations of decisions. The two are different.

First, respectfully, I think it’s misleading to say that ED benefits only well off folks. It is in point of fact not ideal, not for those in high need, but for semi-upper middle class folks who won’t qualify for significant need based grants but who want to go for pure merit scholarships. To these families, it is financially smarter to wait and apply for the many fine merit scholarships out there, many of which involve interviews and are not on the ED timeline. Or if they don’t get merit, they can also use the RD to hopefully negotiate tuition once/if they are fortunate to have several acceptances in hand. But for high need like me, it makes total sense to apply ED, something I only realized by my fifth kid.

For my older 4, I foolishly listened to the advice to apply RD for better financial aid. It doesn’t even make sense particularly when you can run the NPC to get a sense of the likely packages. If a school has a policy to meet need, particularly with no debt or small debt, then why not apply ED to that school? Yes there are schools that don’t have that policy–don’t apply to these ones ED. But there are plenty of top schools - top schools in particular - that have a commitment to meeting your need with minimal or no debt. If you apply ED, the award will be the same; it’s a formula. And on the off chance your need isn’t met, you are permitted to withdraw from ED (for that reason alone).

As to the stress of the process, can I say that ED is only stressful in the sense that the entire college application process is stressful? Or, for some folks (not commenting on anyone in this thread), it is stressful if you view the process as a status contest or a make-it-or-else process. But if you simply concentrate on the ‘cards’ that you yourself have in your hand, and don’t worry about what others are doing or not doing, you will find the process to be a lot less stressful (although there’s no taking away of the fundamental stress!).

So much time is spent focusing on getting in, and not enough on what to do once you’re there. Trust me, it’s the ‘once you’re there’ that is many orders of magnitude more important. And there are no guarantees how your kid will feel in the 4 years they are there. But the right attitude will make a world of difference. With the right attitude, I truly believe you can find great success in any college.

For my older 4, the RD did turn out well (got into top 10 schools), but for at least two of them, they would have been better to have targeted one school and applied ED. I do believe it would have increased their chances still more, and had they gotten in, it would have ended the protracted waiting involved senior year, and certainly reduced admissions and admissions-related costs for me.

For my youngest, he applied ED to UPenn, and was fortunate to get in. He got the need based aid he needed as per their policy. Now in December, he’s done.

Could he change his mind later? Maybe. But you have to understand they change their minds all the time. It is not unusual at all for a student to be ‘in love’ with a college via RD and hate that college by Junior year. (Or vice versa–depressed about their choice as an 18 year old, and love it at 20.) That’s because between 17-22 is a time of enormous change and growth. If all kids knew what they were doing at 18, there wouldn’t be any transfers.

I think it is also fruitless to wonder ‘what if’ (though it’s human!). The main way to stay sane and grounded (which you’ll need for yourself as well as your kid) is to remember to a) focus on your own kid’s needs only, and your family’s needs only, not anyone else’s; and b) to remember that truly, truly, it is about how your kid uses his/her time and resources once they are there.

Best of luck to all.

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More like September so that you can give that information to the teachers who will be writing your recommendations.

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At our HS, teachers are asked for recommendations at the end of junior year. And the same recommendation goes to all colleges, so it’s not like they do any additional work because a student applies early.

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That sounds like a good system @hebegebe.