The Stockholm Octavo – August CC Book Club Selection

[Mary13]

<p>

@ignatius

Can you flip to front (timeline) and back (Stockholm Octavo) of the book like that with a Kindle?

</p>

<p>I have an early model Kindle and although flipping is possible, it’s not easy – there are too many steps. Also, the timeline and the Octavo cards were hard to read on my Kindle (black and white, not very sharp), so I wasn’t really motivated to study them. Maybe it’s different on a Kindle Fire; perhaps it displays illustrations with color and clarity. Anybody have one?</p>

[ignatius]

<p>

@cartera45

I did not see Mrs. Sparrow as possessing any mystical powers. Her thinking was simply beyond her time and she was very insightful. She recognized the power of friendship and the power of women in a time when many understood neither.

</p>

<p>

@Mary

I think Mrs. Sparrow believes fully in the power of the cards and in her own psychic gifts. She isn’t a fraud out to con people.

</p>

<p>I can’t completely discount Mrs. Sparrow’s psychic gifts while at the same time agreeing with cartera about Mrs. Sparrow’s other attributes. The early chapters hint at Mrs. Sparrow’s gift (her vision of her father’s death, predicting Gustav would soon be King). Mrs. Sparrow relates a vision to the King, describing a black coach in front of a fine house/palace … and a destroying wind. Later that evening she recognizes her vision painted on the fan Cassiopeia. Definitely the fan’s owner The Uzanne plans to use Cassiopeia to destroy King Gustav III. Even in the literal sense of acting as the wind source … blowing poison into the air. No way can Mrs. Sparrow have known the events of that evening ahead of time. She did not know The Uzanne. The events of that evening made them automatic adversaries. Without her vision, Mrs. Sparrow would not have moved in to take Cassiopeia.</p>

[Mary13]

<p>I don’t have a problem with the idea that Mrs. Sparrow had visions that foretold the future. Certainly, there are plenty of similar unexplained phenomena in the real world as well as the fictional one. But I do feel a bit like Emil does at the end, i.e., what is the point of having a vision if you can’t change the outcome? He could not alter Gustav III’s fate and refers to himself as “an errant knave trumped by a treasonous queen” (p. 403). Eventually, with the reassurance of Mrs. Sparrow, he comes to see that simply being involved in the vision brought benefits: “Through the Octavo, I have done some measure of good. I am connected. I love” (p. 409).</p>

<p>I have to add, though, that the Octavo led Emil to do things that were not good, particularly as regards the Uzanne. The Uzanne was a great villain. I could almost picture her in a coat made out of 101 Dalmation puppies :). I didn’t shed any tears over her demise, but I loathed the part that Emil played in her death. To me, it was a step backward in his spiritual growth. First of all, there’s the fact that murder is, um, wrong. But on top of that, his actions with the powder might have killed the entire household. And he implicated New Cook in a terrible way, making her a pawn in his revenge scheme in exactly the same way that the Uzanne made Johanna a pawn. </p>

<p>Mrs. Sparrow was pleased – “You performed a great service to your nation” – but I didn’t feel the same way. I imagine that there is supposed to be some sort of “what goes around comes around” satisfaction with seeing the Uzanne bested at her own deadly game, but I didn’t like to see Emil stoop to that level.</p>

[cartera45]

<p>I’m finding that I had forgotten some things that happened that clearly show Mrs. Sparrow did have visions, separate from her work with the cards.</p>

[psychmom]

<p>I kept “casting” the evil Uzanne in my mind and came up with Glenn Close as she appeared in Dangerous Liaisons. Wasn’t she also Cruella DeVille in one of the Dalmations movies?</p>

[Mary13]

<p>^LOL, yes she was. I think the Dangerous Liaisons Glenn is perfect for the Uzanne:</p>

<p><a href=“https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1547&bih=814&q=glenn+close+in+dangerous+liaisons&oq=glenn+close+in+dangerous+liaisons&gs_l=img.12...0.0.4.16220.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0..0.0.ehm_pq_signedout%2Chmss2%3Dfalse%2Chmmql%3D2...0...1..23.img..2.27.2579.c8_1erByMG8#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=SySLe34ab2zQKM%3A%3ByIS4m0DCGpUrSM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.hollywoodmemorabilia.com%252Ffiles%252Fcache%252Fglenn-close-autographed-8x10-photo-actress-dangerous-liaisons_25214ad475856bf7e026c1a1e4ef9390.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.hollywoodmemorabilia.com%252Fauthentic-memorabilia%252Fglenn-close-autographed-8x10-photo-actress-dangerous-liaisons.html%3B391%3B500[/url]”>https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&site=imghp&tbm=isch&source=hp&biw=1547&bih=814&q=glenn+close+in+dangerous+liaisons&oq=glenn+close+in+dangerous+liaisons&gs_l=img.12...0.0.4.16220.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0..0.0.ehm_pq_signedout%2Chmss2%3Dfalse%2Chmmql%3D2...0...1..23.img..2.27.2579.c8_1erByMG8#facrc=_&imgdii=_&imgrc=SySLe34ab2zQKM%3A%3ByIS4m0DCGpUrSM%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.hollywoodmemorabilia.com%252Ffiles%252Fcache%252Fglenn-close-autographed-8x10-photo-actress-dangerous-liaisons_25214ad475856bf7e026c1a1e4ef9390.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.hollywoodmemorabilia.com%252Fauthentic-memorabilia%252Fglenn-close-autographed-8x10-photo-actress-dangerous-liaisons.html%3B391%3B500&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

[Mary13]

<p>Karen Engelmann has some ideas of her own:</p>

<p>Emil Larsson — narrator, customs officer and man of the Town: Ryan Gosling, of course!</p>

<p>Mrs. Sofia Sparrow — card shark and cartomancer: Kristin Scott Thomas.</p>

<p>The Uzanne — Baroness and villainess: Laura Linney.</p>

<p>Johanna Bloom — runaway apothecaire: Emma Watson.</p>

<p>Anna Maria Plomgren — tempestuous army widow: Noomi Rapace.</p>

<p>King Gustav III — monarch of Sweden: Stellan Skarsg</p>

[cartera45]

<p>I read an article in which the author said a producer who was considering optioning the movie asked her who should play Mrs. Sparrow and she said she always imagined Kristin Scott Thomas.</p>

<p>Ha - cross posted with Mary13. I must have misread the article. I thought Engelmann only suggested Mrs. Sparrow and the author of the article suggested the others.</p>

[NJTheatreMOM]

<p>Interesting about the casting. The Uzanne was dark-haired. I picture her as a cross between the woman who played Mrs Danvers in Rebecca and Vivian Leigh in Gone With the Wind.</p>

[BUandBC82]

<p>I finished! I enjoyed the book. Tomorrow I’ll read the discussion questions and join in.</p>

<p>I like the author’s actor suggestions for her characters. </p>

<p>Mary, to answer your Kindle question. I have the Kindle with the keyboard. I can see the pictures pretty clearly, but not perfect. The small writing on the timeline can be read, but it is small and a little fuzzy. Another option is to download the book onto your PC or tablet. If I look at the book through the Kindle app on my iPad, the pictures are very clear. They are not in color. Are the pictures in color in the regular book?</p>

[mathmom]

<p>I see Noomi Rapace in the part of Johanna, and love the idea of Glenn Close as the Uzanne. She was a great villain. Of course I can’t condone murder, but I’m not sure the society they lived in gave them viable options for her.</p>

<p>What did people think of the cross-dressing calligrapher? I thought it was so interesting that there were supposed to be male and female handwriting to produce.</p>

[Mary13]

<p>mathmom, I once had a boss who was in over his head at work, fell way behind, and had no time to sign a stack of routine letters. His support staff was female, but he insisted we bring a male volunteer into the office to sign the letters because he didn’t want his signature “in a woman’s handwriting.” </p>

<p>I really liked Master Lind a lot. He reminded me of a Dickens character: eccentric and opportunistic, yet funny and loving. He was one of the few people in the story who already had love and connection – children and a wife who was totally cool with his cross-dressing. Now that’s a happy marriage. ;)</p>

[BUandBC82]

<p>I also really liked Master Lind. He was a multi-layered character who was comfortable with himself. His fear of exposure was for his wife and children.</p>

<p>I enjoyed catching up with all the comments. I like reading historical fiction, so this book was right up my alley. I wasn’t too familiar with Swedish history, but historical fiction is always a good way to get me motivated to read the history beyond what is presented in the book. </p>

<p>I’m going to dive right in…</p>

<p>

1. THE OCTAVO
 The Octavo indicates that much of life is pre-determined but the Seeker has the opportunity to influence outcomes. Which characters in the book embraced this philosophy and took charge of their destiny—with or without the Octavo? Which didn’t, and let fate takes its course? How does the OCTAVO help to advance the story? Did you find yourself wondering about your own Octavo?

</p>

<ol>
<li>DIVINATION
 Mrs. Sparrow claims to have the gift (and burden) of the Sight. Have you ever had an experience with divination? Were the predictions relevant and accurate? Do you believe in fate, free will, or (like the Octavo) a combination of both?

</li>
</ol>

<p>I think these two questions overlap. Was there really any free will amongst the characters in this novel? Or did they all meet their destiny/fate under the false assumption of free will? </p>

<p>Didn’t Gustav’s fate seem pre-determined? Mrs. Sparrow’s sight told her of danger for Gustav and of two crowns for Duke Karl. Still, Mrs. Sparrow was not able to change their destiny. Perhaps free will can change the path of one’s fate, but not the destiny. </p>

<p>Here is what Mrs. Sparrow tells Larsson when explaining the Octavo -

@Mrs. Sparrow on page 17

…The seeker can then manipulate the event in the direction he chooses. You only need to push the eight. Think of it as destiny, partnering with free will.

</p>

[ignatius]

<p>Waving at BUandBC82: I read a hard copy and, no, the pictures were not in color.</p>

<p>I always find it interesting when someone mentions a certain actor he/she sees playing the part of a book character. I don’t picture characters when I read. And I guess I reveal a deficiency of some sort when I say I don’t know most of the actors listed by the author. I do, however, know Ryan Gosling and can join in on a thumbs up there.</p>

<p>I also liked Master Lind, along with other characters … Christian and Margot Norden come to mind.</p>

<p>Like others I don’t necessarily condone the murder of The Uzanne but admit that I’m not unhappy that she knows exactly who does it and how. ;)</p>

[Mary13]

<p>

@BUandBC82

Was there really any free will amongst the characters in this novel? Or did they all meet their destiny/fate under the false assumption of free will?

</p>

<p>That’s a great question, because it applies not only to the characters in the novel, but to us as well.</p>

<p>I believe in free will. We have the ability to make choices. But I also believe that as we make those choices, something nudges us on to the “right” path. Call it what you will—the Holy Spirit, conscience, karma, grace: that inexplicable something guides us, and we often know deep down which decision feels right.</p>

<p>The Catholic catechism I was raised with states, “God created man a rational being, conferring on him the dignity of a person who can initiate and control his own actions.” At the same time, it adds that grace—“the free and undeserved help that God gives us to respond to his call”—can influence the choices we make. We can accept grace or reject it; in that way, our fate is in our own hands.</p>

<p>^ I write that not to proselytize (;)), but to explain that it’s how I view the characters in The Stockholm Octavo. And I’m sure I see them that way because of my personal “baggage” – the teachings that are part of my upbringing. Everybody is going to have a different take on this, which is what makes discussion fun.</p>

<p>In my view, Emil, for example, could have married Margot. He was ready to take that step in the end – it would have been a simple, comfortable move, as they were good friends and she was the “bird in the hand.” But grace (in the form of Margot’s advice) steered him toward what they both knew was the better, more fulfilling path: to seek out Johanna. </p>

<p>So Emil (presumably) made the right choice, and by the same token, I think others made wrong ones. Do you think it was Miss Plomgren’s destiny to become a heartless murderer? Was she evil, or at some point in her life did she just begin to reject—via her free will—other, more constructive paths? I wonder how her life might have been different had her baby lived. Although she was already a loose cannon (in her marital life), the baby’s death seemed to have completely unhinged her.</p>

[Mary13]

<p>P.S. totally on board with Ryan Gosling :)</p>

[BUandBC82]

<p>Hi ignatius!! </p>

<p>I always imagine what characters look like. I didn’t know all of the actors on the list. I clicked on Mary’s link and then on the individual actor’s links to see what they looked like. I particularly like Stellan Skarsg</p>

[mathmom]

<p>I believe in free will so I have trouble with a universe that seems to be saying that it’s all pre-ordained by the cards or the visions. I think remember Galadriel in The Lord of the Rings told Frodo when he looked into the bowl that what he saw was only one of many possibilities. He sees the scouring of the Shire, but nevertheless goes on with his mission. I’ve always thought that even if he hadn’t continued on his journey that scene would have happened anyway, perhaps with Sauron in charge instead of Saruman. (My apologies to those who are not LOTR fans!)</p>

<p>I did have a weird experience once reading palms. I had a cousin whose life line stopped abruptly. He committed suicide in his early 20s. </p>

<p>I thought the predictions about Emil’s future were so vague - he had all the free will he needed, but that because Mrs. Sparrow egged him on, he did get himself on a better path than he had been on. If she hadn’t been in his life - it would have had a very different trajectory.</p>

[Mary13]

<p>

@mathmom

I think I remember Galadriel in The Lord of the Rings told Frodo when he looked into the bowl that what he saw was only one of many possibilities.

</p>

<p>Yes! It’s the eternal question. Here’s something similar from Dickens (again – can you guess that he’s on my favorite author list?):</p>

<p>

"Before I draw nearer to that stone to which you point,‘’ said Scrooge, "answer me one question. Are these the shadows of the things that Will be, or are they shadows of things that May be, only?‘’ </p>

<p>Still the Ghost pointed downward to the grave by which it stood. </p>

<p>"Men’s courses will foreshadow certain ends, to which, if persevered in, they must lead,‘’ said Scrooge. "But if the courses be departed from, the ends will change. Say it is thus with what you show me!‘’ </p>

<p>The Spirit was immovable as ever.

</p>

<p>It’s the same with The Stockholm Octavo. The characters can only hope that “if the courses be departed from, the ends will change,” but there is no way of knowing for sure because the Spirit will never give us a straight answer.</p>

<p>I thought the idea of changing course was beautifully symbolized in the alteration made to Cassiopeia. We navigate by the stars. With Cassiopeia, that navigation is literally turned on its head in order to redirect the course of events.</p>

[BUandBC82]

<p>So maybe Gustav’s destiny didn’t change because he didn’t try to change it. Gustav interpreted Mrs. Sparrows vision from a more positive viewpoint and didn’t think any change was necessary. I like the LOTR and the Dickens examples.</p>